Re: The place of "meditation" ... Viharati (corrected)
- Hi, Matheesha -
Thank you for leaving me with something to ponder.
>M:deeper the one-pointedness, it seems to 'tolerate' only certain
>1. Concentrating develops samadhi. The deeper the samadhi, the
types of agitations of the mind. vitakka and vichara are tolerated in the
first jhana, but in the second they are ejected and only piti
suka is tolerated.
>2. There is mention in the suttas of someone thinking 'this vitakkavicara is an agitation, what if I abide without it (or words to that
effect). This another way of doing it, but one must have trained well in
adhi-citta to do such things.
>3. It it is possible to have all the factors of a jhaana outside of jhana.But if the 5 hindrences are still arising, then it is not a jhana.
>4. It might be better to think of jhana as a state where many factors areabsent (hence deep calm), rather than a state where something is
Tep: I like 1., 2. and 3. Can you explain your reasoning for 4. ? Thanks.
--- In email@example.com, "matheesha"
> Hi my friend Tep,
> I think it is important to note that just because there is flour,
> eggs, sugar etc this does not automatically make it a cake. IT must
> all be processed and baked together for a good period of time. It it
> is possible to have all the factors of a jhaana outside of jhana. But
> if the 5 hindrences are still arising, then it is not a jhana. If
> there is no adequate samadhi it is not a jhana. It might be better to
> think of jhana as a state where many factors are absent (hence deep
> calm), rather than a state where something is present.
- Hey Jon and Eric,
> Hey, are you trying me on, Eric? ;-)) Because I think you're the oneAlways nice to see the physical sciences putting in an appearance. I would
> who has it backwards!! Whenever there is fire, there is heat. But we
> cannot say whenever there is heat there is fire.
> (Is it true to say that heat is a necessary condition for fire? I'm not
> sure about that; when a fire is started by striking a match against the
> appropriate substance, the fire is produced by a chemical reaction
> rather than by the generation of heat.)
say that the lighting of the match is initiated by the friction of striking
the match against the side of the matchbox, and that friction translates
into heat, which precipitates the chemical reaction.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]