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Re: [DhammaStudyGroup] Age and Wisdom

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  • Robert Kirkpatrick
    Totally agree Kom about wisdom and age (I hope you are right). But I think the buddha spent 6 years doing ascetic practice because of bad kamma he had done in
    Message 1 of 139 , Apr 3, 2001
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      Totally agree Kom about wisdom and age (I hope you are right).
      But I think the buddha spent 6 years doing ascetic practice
      because of bad kamma he had done in past life (I forget what).
      He was unusual in this regard.
      I think I read in the commentaries that most(but not all of
      course) Buddhas to be in their last life become Buddha within a
      few days of leaving home.

      On the other hand he was one where panna (wisdom)was predominant
      and thus he went the short way compared to other bodhisattas
      (some go with effort or other factors predominant). All of them
      have all factors, of course, and even the short way is 4
      unimaginably long periods of time plus a hundred thousand aeons.
      (not counting all the time it took to get to the stage where
      they can receive a prediction from another Buddha).
      Makes the seven years until I reach fifty seem pretty brief.
      robert
      --- Kom Tukovinit <kom@...> wrote:
      > Dear Robert,
      >
      > Khun Jack read it from somewhere to me (tipitika?) once that
      > >= 50 is
      > the age of wisdom. Guess you still have a few more years to
      > go, eh?
      >
      > On this topics, wouldn't this wisdom be based on accumulation
      > rather
      > than age? For example, Gotama Buddha became englightened when
      > he is in
      > his 30's, because of his past kamma resulting in his spending
      > 6 years
      > in following extreme asceticism. Some buddhas may spend
      > hundreds/thousands of years (because of their life
      > expetencies?) before
      > they reach enlightenment.
      >
      > I don't know about the wisdom reaching its maturity at 50's,
      > but the
      > Buddha flatly refuted that old age brings on the arising of
      > less panna
      > and sati.
      >
      > kom
      >
      > --- Robert Kirkpatrick <robertkirkpatrick@...>
      > wrote:
      > > Kind regards to the senior, venerated members of the group.
      > > Especially Howard on his upcoming birthday.
      > > Jina - you didn't say your age?
      > > Me - 43
      > > And just wondering- what differences does anyone notice
      > between
      > > say 40 and 50 (and 60). Apart from greatly increasing
      > wisdom, of
      > > course.
      > > robert
      >
      >
      >
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    • Jonothan Abbott
      Rob, Mike and All, If I may be excused for nitpicking ... ... wrote: Dear Mike, ... The extent to which akusala of any
      Message 139 of 139 , Apr 26, 2001
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        Rob, Mike and All,

        If I may be excused for nitpicking ...

        --- Robert Kirkpatrick
        <robertkirkpatrick@...> wrote: > Dear Mike,
        > I think I should be more specific here. When I said
        > "it drops
        > away easily" I meant (and should have said) that it
        > also doesn't
        > tend to come back so much (not like lobha for sense
        > objects -
        > which is only eradicated at the stage of anagami). I
        > wasn't sure
        > if that was clear.
        > All dhammas do as you indicate fall away so quickly
        > anyway -
        > 'long gone'- and that is a good point.

        The extent to which akusala of any kind may appear to
        fall away, or be reduced in strength or frequency
        thereafter, should not be thought of as either an
        indicator or a result of the arising of awareness.
        Awareness has its own distinctive characteristic and
        function which is independent of any of these
        'indicators'.

        > In fact, it may rearise at anytime for all of us
        > but it becomes
        > a little easier to detect the more it is seen as
        > lobha and not
        > (samma vayama)right effort(which it tends to look
        > like). It is
        > good to be reminded about this desire as it takes us
        > out of the
        > present moment. It is sort of a special one that
        > sincere
        > buddhists are likely to collect (but still samudaya
        > -sacca,
        > cause of dukkha).
        > This all reminds me of gayans vangcaka.
        > robert

        Or it could simply become more subtle and sneaky,
        since the tendency remains.

        Jon

        > --- "m. nease" <mlnease@...> wrote:
        > > Dear Robert,
        > >
        > > --- Robert Kirkpatrick
        > > <robertkirkpatrick@...> wrote:
        > >
        > > > One good think about this type of craving (for
        > > > stages of
        > > > insight): it is an add on that we didn't have
        > before
        > > > learning
        > > > about Buddhism.
        > >
        > > Interesting point!
        > >
        > > > Consequently if it is truly seen as
        > > > lobha and
        > > > also recognised as counterproductive it drops
        > away
        > > > easily.
        > >
        > > True--in fact, when recognized it's already LONG
        > > gone...
        > >
        > > mike

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