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Howard's suttas, 2. Sutta no 3.

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  • nina
    Hi Howard, Jon and all, PTS Vol 1,p134. Duties BB s transl, Prescribed by the Wise Three things are prescribed by the wise: giving, going forth into
    Message 1 of 4 , Jan 31, 2005
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      Hi Howard, Jon and all,

      PTS Vol 1,p134. 'Duties'

      BB's transl, 'Prescribed by the Wise'

      "Three things are prescribed by the wise: giving, going forth into
      homelessness, service to one's parents."

      Verse (P.T.S. translation):
      Giving and harmlessness and self-restraint,
      Control of sense and service to the parents
      And holy ones who live the righteous life,-
      If anyone be wise to do these things
      By good men favoured, an Ariyan
      Clear-sighted, will attain the world of bliss.

      N: the Co states as to prescribed: what the wise prescribe, declare, exhort
      to. Prescribe: the word paññatti, which can mean regulation, is used here.
      Thus, these are strong wordings.
      'Wise', sappurisa, the Co adds: mahaa-purisa, great men, a term for ariyans.
      It is repeated: they prescribe, declare, exhort to these things.
      As to harmlessness, ahimsa, this is compassion and the foundation of it.
      Control of sense: sa.mvara siila: the guarding of the sense-doors, indriyas.
      It is said that one trains oneself by means of the uposatha siila. Siila
      observed on vigil days.
      Service to mother and father: to take care of them, to protect them, to
      serve them.
      Holy ones, this is the translation of santa, calm. The Co states that in
      other texts this word refers to the Buddha, the Solitary Buddha and all
      ariyans who are calm. In this context it refers to those who serve their
      parents. The ariyans are calm in the highest sense, they live the righteous
      life, brahmacaariya, the superior way of life. The Co. explains that we
      should understand that the service to one's parents the wise regulate,
      declare, exhort to, is superior.
      An Ariyan is clear-sighted: endowed with wisdom (dassana, seeing).
      Because of the three conditions that are mentioned in the sutta one is an
      ariyan, a noble person. The Co adds: this word does not denote here a
      Buddha, etc. or a sotapanna, etc.
      N: these three conditions are: Giving and harmlessness and self-restraint,
      control of sense and service to the parents. Harmlessness and
      self-restraint, control of senses, is summarized in the Sutta as going
      forth. It is a way of renunciation.
      It is said that those who serve mother and father are ariyans, noble ones.
      They are clearsighted. They will have rebirth in heavenly planes.
      Remark: this sutta reminds us to practice virtues dear to the ariyans, such
      as service to one's parents. The Co. repeats this with much emphasis.
      Actually, this sutta points to satipatthana in daily life. Guarding of the
      sense-doors is achieved by mindfulness of whatever object presents itself
      through one of the six doorways. At the same time we should practise
      generosity and compassion. In that way we practise the righteous living,
      brahmacaariya, namely the development of the eightfold Path and this will
      lead to becoming an ariyan in the sense of an enlightened person.
      The wise prescribe, declare, exhort to these things.
      We are usually heedless, lazy and attached to our own confort. Such strong
      exhortations are most beneficial to remind us to develop satipatthana and
      all good qualities, such as helping our parents and our fellowmen.
      Nina.
    • Jonothan Abbott
      Nina Many thanks for the commentary material and your own supplement. I find it very inspiring. As you say, it is actually tallking about the ariyan, as
      Message 2 of 4 , Feb 2, 2005
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        Nina

        Many thanks for the commentary material and your own supplement. I find
        it very inspiring.

        As you say, it is actually tallking about the ariyan, as appears from
        the verse, and is an exhortation to us all to develop those same qualities.

        Here is the verse from the BB translation, for comparison:
        The wise prescribe giving,
        Harmelssness, self-control and taming,
        Service to one's dear parents
        And to those who live the holy life.
        These are the kinds of deeds
        T which the wise person resorts.
        The noble one, possessed of vision,
        Passes to an auspicous world.

        A footnote to the verse reads:
        'It seems that in the verse, the "going forth" is represented by
        "harmlessness, self-control and taming", since these are the practices
        undertaken by those who go forth. "Service to those who live the holy
        life" must be included under service to parents.'

        Thanks again for the commentary.

        Jon

        nina wrote:

        >Hi Howard, Jon and all,
        >
        >PTS Vol 1,p134. 'Duties'
        >
        >BB's transl, 'Prescribed by the Wise'
        >
        >"Three things are prescribed by the wise: giving, going forth into
        >homelessness, service to one's parents."
        >
        >Verse (P.T.S. translation):
        >Giving and harmlessness and self-restraint,
        >Control of sense and service to the parents
        >And holy ones who live the righteous life,-
        >If anyone be wise to do these things
        >By good men favoured, an Ariyan
        >Clear-sighted, will attain the world of bliss.
        >
        >N: the Co states as to prescribed: what the wise prescribe, declare, exhort
        >to. Prescribe: the word paññatti, which can mean regulation, is used here.
        >Thus, these are strong wordings.
        >
        >
      • Nina van Gorkom
        Dear Jon, Thank you very much for the verse, BB translation. It helped me, I can add something now. See below. ... N: Taming, the Thai Pali had thama, in Pali
        Message 3 of 4 , Feb 3, 2005
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          Dear Jon,
          Thank you very much for the verse, BB translation.
          It helped me, I can add something now. See below.
          op 02-02-2005 23:05 schreef Jonothan Abbott op jsabbott@...:
          > Here is the verse from the BB translation, for comparison:
          > The wise prescribe giving,
          > Harmelssness, self-control and taming,
          > Service to one's dear parents
          > And to those who live the holy life.
          > These are the kinds of deeds
          > T which the wise person resorts.
          > The noble one, possessed of vision,
          > Passes to an auspicous world.
          >
          > A footnote to the verse reads:
          > 'It seems that in the verse, the "going forth" is represented by
          > "harmlessness, self-control and taming", since these are the practices
          > undertaken by those who go forth.
          N: Taming, the Thai Pali had thama, in Pali dama, and now I see: taming,
          subduing. The Co adds: uposatha sila, and also in the Punnovaadasutta:
          khanti, patience, and also paññaa in the Alavakasutta. Thus, taming includes
          several qualities, patience and wisdom. Harmlessness, self-control and
          taming are virtues of the recluse. He lives a life of non-violence. Also
          laypeople can develop those virtues.
          Nina.
        • Jonothan Abbott
          Hi, Nina Thanks for the extra detail about taming . Very interesting. The correlation between the 3 things prescribed by the wise mentioned in the main text
          Message 4 of 4 , Feb 5, 2005
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            Hi, Nina

            Thanks for the extra detail about 'taming'. Very interesting.

            The correlation between the 3 'things prescribed by the wise' mentioned
            in the main text of the sutta and the qualities set out in the verse
            seems to be as follows:

            Giving: Giving
            Going forth: Harmlessness, self-control and taming
            Service to one's parents: Service to one's dear parents and to those
            who live the holy life

            So the reference to 'going forth' is a reference to qualities that (in
            their mundane form) can be developed by all of us, in daily life.

            Jon


            Nina van Gorkom wrote:

            >Dear Jon,
            >Thank you very much for the verse, BB translation.
            >It helped me, I can add something now. See below.
            >op 02-02-2005 23:05 schreef Jonothan Abbott op jsabbott@...:
            >
            >
            >>Here is the verse from the BB translation, for comparison:
            >>The wise prescribe giving,
            >>Harmelssness, self-control and taming,
            >>Service to one's dear parents
            >>And to those who live the holy life.
            >>These are the kinds of deeds
            >>T which the wise person resorts.
            >>The noble one, possessed of vision,
            >>Passes to an auspicous world.
            >>
            >>A footnote to the verse reads:
            >>'It seems that in the verse, the "going forth" is represented by
            >>"harmlessness, self-control and taming", since these are the practices
            >>undertaken by those who go forth.
            >>
            >>
            >N: Taming, the Thai Pali had thama, in Pali dama, and now I see: taming,
            >subduing. The Co adds: uposatha sila, and also in the Punnovaadasutta:
            >khanti, patience, and also paññaa in the Alavakasutta. Thus, taming includes
            >several qualities, patience and wisdom. Harmlessness, self-control and
            >taming are virtues of the recluse. He lives a life of non-violence. Also
            >laypeople can develop those virtues.
            >Nina.
            >
            >
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