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No gun, no bullet

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  • Robert Kirkpatrick
    I was thinking today about violence. I listened to Khun sujin say to someone who had being talking about murder. She said: There was no person, no gun, and no
    Message 1 of 2 , Nov 17, 2000
      I was thinking today about violence.
      I listened to Khun sujin say to someone who had being talking
      about murder. She said: "There was no person, no gun, and no
      bullet" then she said words to the effect that we take murder as
      being worse than accidental death but both are simply the result
      of conditions. She said something like even when we are being
      shot and killed that panna can understand deeply in this way.
      The more there is understanding of a moment as a moment the
      easier it becomes to understand this. There is no self in a
      moment. Every citta is of one of 4 types of jati - either
      kusala, akusala, kiriya or vipaka - but no self anywhere; and no
      bullet, gun or killer too. How well do we understand this?
      The Buddha once pointed to some people who were collecting
      sticks and leaves for a fire. He asked the monks if they felt
      concern or attachment to those sticks and leaves that were going
      to be burned. The monks said "of course not, they do not belong
      to us". .."so it is monks, and the khandas(vedana, citta,
      sankhara, rupa, sanna) do not belong to you either". This is the
      truth - and this is what we must see more and more clearly as
      the path continues.
      Do we think that citta is something we can control or that it is
      good when we feel calm? This is clinging, and it is just as
      foolish as if we were to cling to sticks and leaves; it is
      because we believe that citta is self, or sankhara is self that
      we have such ideas.
      Upasena, sariputtas younger brother was bitten by a snake. He
      asked the other monks to put him outside before he died. The
      monks commented that they saw no change in Upasena- in mind or
      body. This is because he didn't take citta for self, or body for
      self, or sankhara for self, or vedan or sanna. And there and
      then he died.
      Are we concerned when citta changes for the worse? This is
      because we are fooled by the majicians trick. (remember Gayans
      quote last month). If we are injured will panna arise and know
      that rupa is not us, that it is like a "lump of foam"? The
      painful feeling that comes at the same time is like a bubble.
      Sanna is like a mirage, sankhara is like a 'log of a plantain
      tree'- no heart.
      WE might think that we will understand all this later, after we
      get enlightened, or next life. However, there is only now. For
      deep panna to arise there must be many conditions - we have to
      begin to understand this moment. Are the colours appearing now
      "something", or is it understood at some level that there is
      nothing except visible object appearing to condition seeing?
      Seeing is only citta, a majicians trick. Visible object is only
      a lump of foam.
      Nina wrote to me yesterday how urgent it is to develop
      satipatthana. It is true: the moments flash by, but we are so
      neglectful. We want to be aware 'when the time is right'. We
      think we will be aware when we are calm, or relaxed, or after we
      study more, or when concentration is stronger, or after we keep
      sila, or when we are not busy, or when we meet with khun sujin.
      This is just thinking and all the time countless moments go
      past, lost to understanding.
      Sati and panna can only arise when the right conditions
      coincide but knowing about the urgency can be a condition too.
      And understanding that nothing at all is self is a basic
      understanding that should be very firm intellectually so that
      deeper insight can occur.
      If tommorow we are seriously injured will we think this is a
      trajedy? Or will we know that a moment is just a moment - no
      self - it can be understood.
      Robert

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    • charlest
      Good friends all, ... We all truly believe the following: If tomorrow we are seriously injured will we think this is a tragedy? Or will we know that a moment
      Message 2 of 2 , Dec 27 8:14 PM
        Good friends all,

        --- In dhammastudygroup@yahoogroups.com, Robert Kirkpatrick <robertkirkpatrick@...> wrote:
        >
        > I was thinking today about violence.
        > I listened to Khun sujin say to someone who had being talking
        > about murder. She said: "There was no person, no gun, and no
        > bullet" then she said words to the effect that we take murder as
        > being worse than accidental death but both are simply the result
        > of conditions. She said something like even when we are being
        > shot and killed that panna can understand deeply in this way.
        > The more there is understanding of a moment as a moment the
        > easier it becomes to understand this. There is no self in a
        > moment. Every citta is of one of 4 types of jati - either
        > kusala, akusala, kiriya or vipaka - but no self anywhere; and no
        > bullet, gun or killer too. How well do we understand this?
        > The Buddha once pointed to some people who were collecting
        > sticks and leaves for a fire. He asked the monks if they felt
        > concern or attachment to those sticks and leaves that were going
        > to be burned. The monks said "of course not, they do not belong
        > to us". .."so it is monks, and the khandas(vedana, citta,
        > sankhara, rupa, sanna) do not belong to you either". This is the
        > truth - and this is what we must see more and more clearly as
        > the path continues.
        > Do we think that citta is something we can control or that it is
        > good when we feel calm? This is clinging, and it is just as
        > foolish as if we were to cling to sticks and leaves; it is
        > because we believe that citta is self, or sankhara is self that
        > we have such ideas.
        > Upasena, sariputtas younger brother was bitten by a snake. He
        > asked the other monks to put him outside before he died. The
        > monks commented that they saw no change in Upasena- in mind or
        > body. This is because he didn't take citta for self, or body for
        > self, or sankhara for self, or vedan or sanna. And there and
        > then he died.
        > Are we concerned when citta changes for the worse? This is
        > because we are fooled by the majicians trick. (remember Gayans
        > quote last month). If we are injured will panna arise and know
        > that rupa is not us, that it is like a "lump of foam"? The
        > painful feeling that comes at the same time is like a bubble.
        > Sanna is like a mirage, sankhara is like a 'log of a plantain
        > tree'- no heart.
        > WE might think that we will understand all this later, after we
        > get enlightened, or next life. However, there is only now. For
        > deep panna to arise there must be many conditions - we have to
        > begin to understand this moment. Are the colours appearing now
        > "something", or is it understood at some level that there is
        > nothing except visible object appearing to condition seeing?
        > Seeing is only citta, a majicians trick. Visible object is only
        > a lump of foam.
        > Nina wrote to me yesterday how urgent it is to develop
        > satipatthana. It is true: the moments flash by, but we are so
        > neglectful. We want to be aware 'when the time is right'. We
        > think we will be aware when we are calm, or relaxed, or after we
        > study more, or when concentration is stronger, or after we keep
        > sila, or when we are not busy, or when we meet with khun sujin.
        > This is just thinking and all the time countless moments go
        > past, lost to understanding.
        > Sati and panna can only arise when the right conditions
        > coincide but knowing about the urgency can be a condition too.
        > And understanding that nothing at all is self is a basic
        > understanding that should be very firm intellectually so that
        > deeper insight can occur.
        > If tommorow we are seriously injured will we think this is a
        > trajedy? Or will we know that a moment is just a moment - no
        > self - it can be understood.
        > Robert
        >
        > __________________________________________________
        >

        We all truly believe the following:

        If tomorrow we are seriously injured will we think this is a
        tragedy?

        Or will we know that a moment is just a moment - no
        self...

        peace...

        metta (maitri),

        Chuck
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