Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.

Re: Off to mind-made abstract land of paramattha dhammas

Expand Messages
  • Robert E
    Hi Phil. ... Here is an excerpt of a 2011 post from Nina on Abhidhamma.org that addresses your question, and in which she quotes K. Sujin on this question as
    Message 1 of 339 , Aug 18, 2013
    • 0 Attachment
      Hi Phil.

      --- In dhammastudygroup@yahoogroups.com, "philip" <philco777@...> wrote:

      > Dear group again
      > Probably was clear, but to clarify:
      > >> There are *no* non-momentary realities (apart from Nibbana). Therefore, belief
      > > in a reality that lasts 100 years is exactly the same (equally as wrong) as
      > > belief in a reality that lasts for just a little bit more than a moment.
      > >Good point, never thought of that. I guess this can help us in our understanding of nimitta...Does this confirm that nimitta is a concept, or is nimitta an exception?

      Here is an excerpt of a 2011 post from Nina on Abhidhamma.org that addresses your question, and in which she quotes K. Sujin on this question as well:

      "When we asked Acharn Sujin whether the impression or sign (nimitta)
      of a dhamma is a concept or a reality she answered: "These are only
      words. If we use the word concept there is something that is
      experienced by thinking. We should not just know words, but
      understand the reality that appears right now. There is not merely
      one moment of experiencing visible object, but many moments arising
      and falling away. When right understanding arises we do not have to
      use any term."

      "She repeated that there is the impression of visible object right
      now. She said: "It is this moment." Visible object impinges on the
      eyesense and after it has fallen away, what is left is the impression
      or sign, nimitta of visible object.

      "It seems that visible object lasts for a while, but in reality it
      arises and falls away. Acharn Sujin used the simile of a torch that
      is swung around. In this way, we have the impression of a whole, of a
      circle of light.

      "We know that seeing arises at this moment, but we cannot pinpoint the
      citta which sees, it arises and falls away very rapidly and another
      moment of seeing arises. We only experience the "sign" of seeing.
      The notion of nimitta can remind us that not just one moment of
      seeing appears, but many moments that are arising and falling away.
      Also visible object is not as solid as we would think, there are many
      moments arising and falling away which leave the sign or impression
      of visible object.

      "Visible object that was experienced by cittas of a sense-door process
      has fallen away; sense-door processes and mind-door processes of
      cittas alternate very rapidly. Visible object impinges again and
      again and seeing arises again and again. When their characteristics
      appear we cannot count the different units of rúpa or the cittas that
      see, they arise and fall away; the impression of what is seen and of
      the seeing appears.

      "Acharn Sujin said: "No matter whether we call it nimitta or not, it
      is appearing now. Whatever appears is the sign or nimitta of the
      dhamma that arises and falls away."
      We cling to what appears for a very short moment, but is does not
      remain. It is the same with saññå, there is not one moment of saññå
      that marks and remembers, but countless moments, arising and falling

      "Thus, we can speak of the nimitta of each of the five khandhas: of
      rúpa, of feeling, of saññå, of sankhårakkhandha, of consciousness.
      There are nimittas of all conditioned dhammas that appear at this
      moment, arising and falling away extremely rapidly.

      "Seeing arising at this moment sees visible object. We notice visible
      object and while we notice it, we have a vivid impression of it, but
      it has just fallen away. Seeing falls away but extremely shortly
      after it has fallen away another moment of seeing arises that
      experiences visible object. It arises again and again and in between
      one notices that there is seeing, or, if there are the right
      conditions a citta with sati can arise that is mindful of its
      characteristic. However, mindfulness of seeing arises after seeing
      has fallen away, not at the same time as seeing. > "

      --- The full post is at this link: http://www.abhidhamma.org/forums/index.php?showtopic=365

      Rob E.

      - - - - - - - - -
    • ptaus1
      Hi Jon, ... p: Yes, I think survival was my rendering of what you had said, which was probably means of subsistence . ... p: Yes, that makes sense. Best
      Message 339 of 339 , Oct 20, 2013
      • 0 Attachment
        Hi Jon,

        > J:  I think that's pretty much how the discussion went.  Not sure if I used the word 'survival', but if I did I think I would now prefer to say 'means of subsistence'.  

        p: Yes, I think "survival" was my rendering of what you had said, which was probably "means of subsistence".

        > J: Just to supplement a little, I remember it being explained that for a monk, his livelihood is the going on his alms round.
        p: Yes, that makes sense.
        Best wishes
      Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.