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Being non-forgetful.

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  • Lukas
    Dear friends, That was told I think that wise attention is a reason for panna and unwise for ignorance, isnt it? But during a day I am mostly daydreaming,
    Message 1 of 10 , Mar 8, 2013
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      Dear friends,

      That was told I think that wise attention is a reason for panna and unwise for ignorance, isnt it? But during a day I am mostly daydreaming, thinking sories instead of investigating and knowing realities. Like before sleep lying in a bad, instead to investigate or 'apply manasikara' to different characteristics, like a bodily sensations or thinking I am dreaming some stories. Is there any help to be less forgetful? How to have more wise attention? How to lessen an attachement to pleasant feelings and tendency to dreaming a stories?

      Best wishes
      Lukas
    • Tam Bach
      Dear Lukas L: How to have more wise attention? How to lessen an attachement to pleasant feelings and tendency to dreaming a stories? Tam B: When there is the
      Message 2 of 10 , Mar 9, 2013
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        Dear Lukas

        L: How to have more wise attention? How to lessen an attachement to pleasant feelings and tendency to dreaming a stories?
        Tam B: When there is the question of how, there is the idea of self who can try to do something...wanting to have less attachment instead of just understanding....
        Sarah was saying something similar on your extract earlier.

        Metta,
        Tam B


        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • philip
        Hi Lukas As you know from your friends who started that Polish group, there is not shortage of popular teachers who teach attractive techniques for speeding up
        Message 3 of 10 , Mar 9, 2013
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          Hi Lukas

          As you know from your friends who started that Polish group, there is not shortage of popular teachers who teach attractive techniques for speeding up the development of satipatthana. Why are they wrong? Remember the adze handle simile. And as Ajahn once said, "the shortcut is lobha."

          Don't press. Keep listening, keep reflecting. If we hope for results, we will be going the way of the misguided masses.


          Phil

          p.s if you try to investigate realities, lobha will be trying. Keep listening to wise friends, condiitons for investigating realities may arise. But not by trying, that is just greedy. (lobha with ditthi.)


          --- In dhammastudygroup@yahoogroups.com, "Lukas" <szmicio@...> wrote:
          >
          > Dear friends,
          >
          > That was told I think that wise attention is a reason for panna and unwise for ignorance, isnt it? But during a day I am mostly daydreaming, thinking sories instead of investigating and knowing realities. Like before sleep lying in a bad, instead to investigate or 'apply manasikara' to different characteristics, like a bodily sensations or thinking I am dreaming some stories. Is there any help to be less forgetful? How to have more wise attention? How to lessen an attachement to pleasant feelings and tendency to dreaming a stories?
          >
          > Best wishes
          > Lukas
          >
        • azita
          Hallo Lucas, ... azita: why try to lessen attachment, isn t it a reality that can - and should - be known by panna? Isn t the growth of panna the only way to
          Message 4 of 10 , Mar 9, 2013
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            Hallo Lucas,

            --- In dhammastudygroup@yahoogroups.com, "Lukas" <szmicio@...> wrote:
            >
            > Dear friends,
            >
            > That was told I think that wise attention is a reason for panna and unwise for ignorance, isnt it? But during a day I am mostly daydreaming, thinking sories instead of investigating and knowing realities. Like before sleep lying in a bad, instead to investigate or 'apply manasikara' to different characteristics, like a bodily sensations or thinking I am dreaming some stories. Is there any help to be less forgetful? How to have more wise attention? How to lessen an attachement to pleasant feelings and tendency to dreaming a stories?

            azita: why try to lessen attachment, isn't it a reality that can - and should - be known by panna? Isn't the growth of panna the only way to lessen any of the kilesas?
            Can we make wise attention arise, no, we cannot.

            The more we reflect on what we have heard regarding the fleetingness of realities, the more we understand we cannot control anything; in fact, there is no 'we'. Dhammas arise and fall due to many different conditions, wise attention arises because of various conditions, we can't make it arise. But there can be wise attention at this moment, who knows?
            Live for understanding, not for trying to control dhammas.

            patience, courage and good cheer
            azita
          • sarah
            Hi Azita, Lan, Phil, Jessica & all, ... ... S: Very well said. All the trying to lessen attachment just leads to more clinging to an idea of self being a
            Message 5 of 10 , Mar 10, 2013
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              Hi Azita, Lan, Phil, Jessica & all,

              --- In dhammastudygroup@yahoogroups.com, "azita" <gazita2002@...> wrote:

              > azita: why try to lessen attachment, isn't it a reality that can - and should - be known by panna? Isn't the growth of panna the only way to lessen any of the kilesas?
              > Can we make wise attention arise, no, we cannot.
              >
              > The more we reflect on what we have heard regarding the fleetingness of realities, the more we understand we cannot control anything; in fact, there is no 'we'. Dhammas arise and fall due to many different conditions, wise attention arises because of various conditions, we can't make it arise. But there can be wise attention at this moment, who knows?
              > Live for understanding, not for trying to control dhammas.
              ...
              S: Very well said. All the trying to lessen attachment just leads to more clinging to an idea of self being a certain way.

              Btw, will you be in Thailand during the first week of June?

              Lan had said she hoped to be in Thailand at this time and so does our friend Annie from Sydney. So we're planning to be there at that time and Ajahn is keeping the time free for us with a possible trip to Kaeng Krachan.

              Lan, if you (and any other Vietnamese friends) can confirm (off-list if you like), I'll give you more details.

              Phil? Jessica?

              To All: There is also a scheduled Dhamma trip to S.Vietnam during the first 2 weeks of September. Anyone would be very welcome. Pls ask for more details if you might be interested to join us. It's being organised by Tam Bach and other Vietnamese friends, many of whom are members here.

              Metta

              Sarah
              ======
            • sprlrt
              Dear Lukas, I m sure you remember which are the conditions for seeing, are they the same for thinking as well? Alberto
              Message 6 of 10 , Mar 10, 2013
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                Dear Lukas,

                I'm sure you remember which are the conditions for seeing,
                are they the same for thinking as well?

                Alberto

                > Dear friends,
                >
                > That was told I think that wise attention is a reason for
                > panna and unwise for ignorance, isnt it? But during a day I
                > am mostly daydreaming, thinking sories instead of
                > investigating and knowing realities. Like before sleep lying
                > in a bad, instead to investigate or 'apply manasikara' to
                > different characteristics, like a bodily sensations or
                > thinking I am dreaming some stories. Is there any help to be
                > less forgetful? How to have more wise attention? How to
                > lessen an attachement to pleasant feelings and tendency to
                > dreaming a stories?
              • Lukas
                Dear Phil, Here is a message from good friend kanchana, who sent me this as private message to my recent doubts. This is very good reminder. I forward it to
                Message 7 of 10 , Mar 10, 2013
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                  Dear Phil,
                  Here is a message from good friend kanchana, who sent me this as private message to my recent doubts. This is very good reminder. I forward it to DSG.


                  Kanchana: To have more understanding that every reality which you experience is already appeared and completely falled away. No one can change anything which alerady happened. So just listen more and investigate more. That' s it.
                  with metta,
                  kanchana.

                  Best wishes
                  Lukas


                  > Remember the adze handle simile. And as Ajahn once said, "the >shortcut is lobha."
                  >
                  > Don't press. Keep listening, keep reflecting. If we hope for >results, we will be going the way of the misguided masses.
                • Lukas
                  Dear Azita, Thank you for your reminder. It according to the Truth. Also thanks to Phil for a kind support on meditations . I think meditations are very
                  Message 8 of 10 , Mar 10, 2013
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                    Dear Azita,
                    Thank you for your reminder. It according to the Truth. Also thanks to Phil for a kind support on 'meditations'. I think 'meditations' are very easy, comparing to really understand realities. Especially while we like to have an easy way, always.

                    Best wishes
                    Lukas


                    > > That was told I think that wise attention is a reason for panna and unwise for ignorance, isnt it? But during a day I am mostly daydreaming, thinking sories instead of investigating and knowing realities. Like before sleep lying in a bad, instead to investigate or 'apply manasikara' to different characteristics, like a bodily sensations or thinking I am dreaming some stories. Is there any help to be less forgetful? How to have more wise attention? How to lessen an attachement to pleasant feelings and tendency to dreaming a stories?
                    >
                    > azita: why try to lessen attachment, isn't it a reality that can - and should - be known by panna? Isn't the growth of panna the only way to lessen any of the kilesas?
                    > Can we make wise attention arise, no, we cannot.
                    >
                    > The more we reflect on what we have heard regarding the fleetingness of realities, the more we understand we cannot control anything; in fact, there is no 'we'. Dhammas arise and fall due to many different conditions, wise attention arises because of various conditions, we can't make it arise. But there can be wise attention at this moment, who knows?
                    > Live for understanding, not for trying to control dhammas.
                    >
                    > patience, courage and good cheer
                    > azita
                    >
                  • philip
                    Hi Lukas ... Yes, that s it. Of course we can struggle and find ways to be better people and on a certain level it is very helpful to do fewer bad deeds etc.
                    Message 9 of 10 , Mar 16, 2013
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                      Hi Lukas
                      >
                      > Kanchana: To have more understanding that every reality which you experience is already appeared and completely falled away. No one can change anything which alerady happened. So just listen more and investigate more. That' s it.


                      Yes, that's it. Of course we can struggle and find ways to be "better people" and on a certain level it is very helpful to do fewer bad deeds etc. But the Buddha didn't teach for us to learn how to do fewer bad things, he taught for the development of understanding, liberating understanding. And we know from Abhidhamma that understanding (as all kusala) must be accompanied by alobha. That is a black and white truth, but it makes meditation as practiced by modern Buddhists akusala.And of course it makes trying to be a better person akusala. And when we think with satisfaction about deep teachings there is attachment too. There can't be much kusala in a day, but just a few moments of it is valuable, and conditions more, without expectations. (Which are akusala as well.)

                      Hope all is well with you, and your cousin/brother.


                      Phil
                    • philip
                      Hi again Lukas p.s I continue to believe that meditation is very good for the health, a form of attachment to pleasant feelings/mind states that is less
                      Message 10 of 10 , Mar 16, 2013
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                        Hi again Lukas

                        p.s I continue to believe that "meditation" is very good for the health, a form of attachment to pleasant feelings/mind states that is less harmful than alcohol and drugs. As you know, I drank alcohol for 30 years, and although now I don't have a strong interest in the precept against alcohol (drinking isn't akuasala kamma patha) the main reason I don't drink is that the pleasant sensations that I can achieve through "breath meditation" are superior to those that I got through drinking. If I were still deceived, I would talk about "developing jhanas", but I know it is just greed for pleasant sensations.

                        ANyways, I strongly recommend looking into yoga, which I also do. It's so good to be in tune with plesaant energies in the body, a good substitute for the drugs and alcohol you and I and so many others enjoy/have enjoyed.

                        Phil

                        p.s And Sarah is helping you develop your understanding of sila. I suppose I will be interested in that again someday, in line with conditions. I expect I will.
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