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84614Re: [dsg] Re: 3 Types of INSIGHT (panna)

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  • TGrand458@aol.com
    Apr 4, 2008
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      Hi Jon, All


      In a message dated 4/4/2008 4:49:32 P.M. Mountain Daylight Time,
      jonabbott@... writes:

      Hi TG

      Thanks for the article. The 3-fold classification of panna as
      suta-maya, cinta-maya and bhavana-maya has often been discussed on
      this list. I don't think there is anything particularly new in what
      the article has to say in this regard.

      ...........................................


      TG: If this is so commonly understood, why all the fuss when I keep saying
      that thinking/contemplating is an important part of insight? No, I don't
      think so. From my experience, it is rejected by many in this group and needs
      more attention.


      ......................................




      In particular, it has always been stressed that direct understanding
      must be preceded by understanding at an intellectual level (hence our
      interest in discussing here the precise meaning of what is found in
      the texts!).
      .................................


      TG: Not always so precise. "Ultimate Realities with their own
      characteristics" is a huge fabrication.


      .....................................





      There are other classifications of panna mentioned in the texts also,
      such as sacca-nana, kiccha-nana, and kata-nana (see UP under 'sacca').

      So there is no question but that panna can be of a level that does not
      amount to the direct understanding of a presently arisen dhamma.

      .................................................


      TG: Super! I won't worry about trying to inform you then. :-)


      ...............................................





      However, when the term "insight" is used it refers, to my
      understanding, to panna of a certain level, namely, direct
      understanding of a presently arisen dhamma. At least, that is how
      most folks here use the term, I believe.

      .......................................................


      TG: Yea, there you go. That's the heart of the matter. You see, when I
      think of insight, I think of "seeing more deeply into nature than normal."
      This certainly includes deep direct understanding, but does not preclude deep
      indirect understanding. That's my point in a nut-shell. And it is met with
      huge resistance I can assure you. LOL


      IMO, the way I think about the matter is in accordance to the way the Buddha
      presents it... I.E. -- a broad spectrum of insight, not just a narrow
      "presence only" viewpoint. The importance is, that the obsession on "presence
      only" has two drawbacks... 1) A lot of important insight fodder is negated.
      2) It tends to misdirect understanding by overly "substantiating" the
      present. (The proof is in the "Ultimate Realities" pudding.)


      ......................................................





      Hoping this helps clarify our differences.

      ......................................................


      TG: From this post, I don't see much difference. :-)


      TG OUT






      Jon






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