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84524Re: 3 Types of INSIGHT (panna)

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  • colette
    Mar 31, 2008
      Hi TG,

      Pardon me, is this my ball, laying on the green? (I'm thinking of
      something that Chevy Chase or Rodney Dangerfield might've said in the
      movie Caddy Shack).

      I don't have much time on the computer but I liked what I got a
      chance to read before going back downstairs and getting in bed with
      Tummo, Osel, et al.

      > Relevance of Vedana to Bhavana-maya Panna
      > Vipassana Research Institute
      > The Pali term bhavana-maya panna means experiential wisdom.
      > is meditation through which wisdom (panna) is cultivated.

      colette: cultivated implies cultivating or cultivation which is an
      important aspect here, that many novices will overlook. In
      Freemasonry and many other esoteric groups I've had the luck to
      participate with I've found a complete lack of attention for and lack
      of attention to FOUNDATIONAL REQUIREMENTS. Either they, the
      practioners, are too self-centered or too busy to be bothered by such
      mundane things or are simply too busy with their attachmetn to the
      everyday 9-5 world in which they live.

      They believe that wisdom is just sitting there and if they reach far
      enough off of the horse they ride upon on the merry-go-round, then
      they will eventually be able to grab it and claim victory for a job
      well done. <...>

      In the process of laying a foundation upon which to build the
      practioner is contemplating the actual foundation: why it can support
      certain things, how heavy things can be that it supports, etc. This
      is part of the Wisdom which is being cultivated, NURTURED to reach

      In order to
      > understand the essence of the term bhavana-maya panna and its
      relevance to vedana
      > (sensation), we first need to understand the meaning of the term

      colette: I just found out today that Naropa was an Indian and not a
      Chinese. Malarepa was the Chinese or non-Indian. I never knew that
      Naropa was of a different culture
      > is derived from the root 'na' which means 'to know', prefixed
      by 'pa' meaning
      > 'correctly'.2 Thus, the literal English translation of the word
      panna is 'to
      > know correctly'. Commonly used equivalents are such words
      as 'insight',
      > 'knowledge' or 'wisdom'. All these convey aspects of panna, but,
      as with all Pali
      > terms, no translation corresponds exactly.
      > In the ancient texts, panna is defined more precisely as
      > yatha-bhutam-nana-dassanamyatha-bhuta-nana-dassanam,3 seeing things
      as they are, not as they
      > appear to be.

      colette: VERY IMPORTANT. Simple sight, seeing things as they are not
      as they appear to be, IS SO PRIMORDIAL, FOUNDATIONAL. Sure, it allows
      a person freedoms to do what I revel in doing, taking tangents
      or "off-ramps" (leaving the beaten path for a little sight-seeing)
      and this is great but the practioner can't attach themselves to what
      is seen and experienced through the tangent or off-ramp. The
      practioner has to stay attached to the beaten path.

      That is, understanding the true nature of anicca (impermanence),
      > dukkha (suffering) and anatta (essencelessness) in all things.

      colette: this is a point I was trying to make to Ken concerning his
      misinterpretations and misdirections of what I was/am saying. This,
      also is pure ABHIDHARMA, I mean this sounds so very close to the Abh.
      analysis and practice that I ponder the writer.

      Now it's time for bed.

      Thank you for letting me say my peace but it's off to the Land of Nod
      and the Dream state to see what I can get out of astral projections.


      > realisation leads to the ultimate truth of nibbana. It may also be
      described as
      > pakarena janati'ti pannapakarena janati ti panna-because it is
      understood through
      > different angles it is panna. <....>
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