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The matter of alignment...

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  • cryptosnark <cryptosnark@yahoo.com>
    I ve been wondering... Is it even necessary for me to spend a page talking about alignment in DNW, and discuss it anywhere else? I ve removed alignment
    Message 1 of 7 , Jan 2, 2003
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      I've been wondering...

      Is it even necessary for me to spend a page talking about alignment in DNW, and discuss it anywhere else?

      I've removed alignment limitations on all the basic classes (since any of them could be rationalized, in some fashion, for any alignment, so why
      bother?), and that got me thinking... does alignment serve any purpose whatsoever? Is it expected of me? Will there be a gaping hole in the game if I
      leave it out, or will nobody notice?

      Cheers,

      SL
    • Jeremy Mueller
      Mutants & Masterminds dropped alignment. I personally think it s not needed in a supers game. Jeremy Mueller Owner - Game Horizons Manager - Amazing Stories
      Message 2 of 7 , Jan 2, 2003
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        Mutants & Masterminds dropped alignment.  I personally think it's not needed in a supers game.
         
        Jeremy Mueller
         
        Owner - Game Horizons
        Manager - Amazing Stories
        Webmaster - WarJacks.com
         
        ----- Original Message -----
        Sent: Thursday, January 02, 2003 9:25 PM
        Subject: [deedsnotwordsd20] The matter of alignment...

        I've been wondering...

        Is it even necessary for me to spend a page talking about alignment in DNW, and discuss it anywhere else?

        I've removed alignment limitations on all the basic classes (since any of them could be rationalized, in some fashion, for any alignment, so why
        bother?), and that got me thinking... does alignment serve any purpose whatsoever? Is it expected of me? Will there be a gaping hole in the game if I
        leave it out, or will nobody notice?

        Cheers,

        SL





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      • Jonathan M. Thompson
        I agree, but I would make it optional. That s the way it is in the Cityscape material. I allow alignment as an optional rule, especially for those people using
        Message 3 of 7 , Jan 3, 2003
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          I agree, but I would make it optional. That's the way it is in the Cityscape material. I allow alignment as an optional rule, especially for those people using existing D&D characters in the game.

          Jonathan M. Thompson
          President, Battlefield Press, Inc.(http://www.battlefieldpress.com)
          jthompson@...
          Corporate Supers (A Metahuman Sourcebook for Cityscape) - Available January 2003

          -----Original Message-----
          From: Jeremy Mueller [mailto:century@...]
          Sent: Thursday, January 02, 2003 11:32 PM
          To: deedsnotwordsd20@yahoogroups.com
          Subject: Re: [deedsnotwordsd20] The matter of alignment...

          Mutants & Masterminds dropped alignment.  I personally think it's not needed in a supers game.
           
          Jeremy Mueller
           
          Owner - Game Horizons
          Manager - Amazing Stories
          Webmaster - WarJacks.com
           
          ----- Original Message -----
          Sent: Thursday, January 02, 2003 9:25 PM
          Subject: [deedsnotwordsd20] The matter of alignment...

          I've been wondering...

          Is it even necessary for me to spend a page talking about alignment in DNW, and discuss it anywhere else?

          I've removed alignment limitations on all the basic classes (since any of them could be rationalized, in some fashion, for any alignment, so why
          bother?), and that got me thinking... does alignment serve any purpose whatsoever? Is it expected of me? Will there be a gaping hole in the game if I
          leave it out, or will nobody notice?

          Cheers,

          SL





          To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
          deedsnotwordsd20-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com



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        • bd_92 <bd_92@yahoo.com>
          i concur..your reputation says it all anyway..positive your loved...negative your hated...drop it... ... not needed in a supers game. ... alignment in DNW, and
          Message 4 of 7 , Jan 3, 2003
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            i concur..your reputation says it all anyway..positive your
            loved...negative your hated...drop it...


            --- In deedsnotwordsd20@yahoogroups.com, "Jeremy Mueller"
            <century@g...> wrote:
            > Mutants & Masterminds dropped alignment. I personally think it's
            not needed in a supers game.
            >
            > Jeremy Mueller
            >
            > Owner - Game Horizons
            > Manager - Amazing Stories
            > Webmaster - WarJacks.com
            >
            > http://www.GameHorizons.com
            > http://www.GamersSolution.com
            > http://www.WarJacks.com
            > ----- Original Message -----
            > From: cryptosnark <cryptosnark@y...>
            > To: deedsnotwordsd20@yahoogroups.com
            > Sent: Thursday, January 02, 2003 9:25 PM
            > Subject: [deedsnotwordsd20] The matter of alignment...
            >
            >
            > I've been wondering...
            >
            > Is it even necessary for me to spend a page talking about
            alignment in DNW, and discuss it anywhere else?
            >
            > I've removed alignment limitations on all the basic classes
            (since any of them could be rationalized, in some fashion, for any
            alignment, so why
            > bother?), and that got me thinking... does alignment serve any
            purpose whatsoever? Is it expected of me? Will there be a gaping hole
            in the game if I
            > leave it out, or will nobody notice?
            >
            > Cheers,
            >
            > SL
            >
            >
            >
            >
            > Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
            > ADVERTISEMENT
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            >
            >
            >
            > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
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            >
            >
            >
            > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
            Service.
          • Bradford C. Walker <bcwalker_98@yahoo.co
            ... Only insofar as it applies to superhero gaming. ... Yes, it will leave a hole. Yes, people notice. Alignment serves first as a shorthand. Lawful Good
            Message 5 of 7 , Jan 3, 2003
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              --- In deedsnotwordsd20@yahoogroups.com, "cryptosnark
              <cryptosnark@y...>" <cryptosnark@y...> wrote:

              > Is it even necessary for me to spend a page talking about alignment
              > in DNW, and discuss it anywhere else?

              Only insofar as it applies to superhero gaming.

              > I've removed alignment limitations on all the basic classes (since
              > any of them could be rationalized, in some fashion, for any
              > alignment, so why bother?), and that got me thinking... does
              > alignment serve any purpose whatsoever? Is it expected of me? Will
              > there be a gaping hole in the game if I leave it out, or will
              > nobody notice?

              Yes, it will leave a hole. Yes, people notice.

              Alignment serves first as a shorthand. "Lawful Good" contains all of
              the information you need to know about the personality and beliefs of
              a character that would otherwise take two or more paragraphs; all you
              need to specify are the specifics of how that character exhibits the
              traits of that alignment.

              Alignment serves second as part of the default cosmology, where the
              forces of Law, Chaos, Good and Evil are not philosophical abstracts
              but rather are real and present forces in the world. Spells, class
              abilities and other powers are often tied to alignment (such as the
              Holy and Unholy magic weapon qualities). Removing them makes using
              such supernatural elements as angels, demons, etc. difficult beyond
              need because it requires the GM to define the parameters of a quality
              when the SRD already did that work. Avoiding unnecessary repetition
              of effort is a good thing.

              Alignment serves third as a selling point, as a result of the first
              two points. The gamer who comes looking for Deeds is looking for a
              superhero game that he can jump into right away without wasting time
              relearning the rules. That means that he's looking for some sort of
              alignment system that he can use as firm benchmarks to guide his
              play. All of the really successful d20 games and settings use
              alignment: Star Wars (Light/Dark), D&D, L5R (Honor & Taint), Scarred
              Lands, Kalamar, Forgotten Realms, Dragonstar, etc. The detractors
              are, in truth, part of the shrill minority of harpies that do not
              speak for the bulk of the d20 user network.

              So yes, keep it. Alignment is a good thing. If not the version from
              the SRD, then Aliegence from the _d20 Modern_ SRD. Either version of
              the concept achieves the same goals and fulfil the same functions, as
              the d20M version is wholly compatible with the D&D version.

              --Bradford C. Walker
            • Infinite Possibilities
              ... I would suppose that means me. ;-) Although I m not sure how minority i am. I have yet to find a group that uses Alignment in any meaningful way. In fact
              Message 6 of 7 , Jan 3, 2003
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                >
                >
                >The detractors
                >are, in truth, part of the shrill minority of harpies that do not
                >speak for the bulk of the d20 user network.
                >
                >
                I would suppose that means me. ;-) Although I'm not sure how minority i
                am. I have yet to find a group that uses Alignment in any meaningful
                way. In fact most of my character sheets have an alignment of None on
                them, and no one has noticed yet. And I've been playing for the last 12
                years or so. ;-)

                I'm of the personal oppinion that two or three descriptive terms does
                much beter than the alignment system in D&D. After all what sounds beter
                to you. Lawful Neutral or Calm and quiet who likes children and small
                animals.

                Just my thoughts tho. ;-)

                Have Fun,
                Darren
              • Palmer of the Turks
                ... I personally don t use alignment for PCs. Ever. To me, it s an artificial restriction of character behaviour and development. I use it for NPCs as a
                Message 7 of 7 , Jan 3, 2003
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                  On 3 Jan 2003, at 5:25, cryptosnark cryptosnark@yahoo wrote:

                  > I've been wondering...
                  >
                  > Is it even necessary for me to spend a page talking about alignment in DNW, and discuss it anywhere else?
                  >
                  > I've removed alignment limitations on all the basic classes (since any of them could be rationalized, in some fashion, for any alignment, so why
                  > bother?), and that got me thinking... does alignment serve any purpose whatsoever? Is it expected of me? Will there be a gaping hole in the game if I
                  > leave it out, or will nobody notice?

                  I personally don't use alignment for PCs. Ever. To me, it's an artificial
                  restriction of character behaviour and development.

                  I use it for NPCs as a *rough* guide as to behaviour and ethics, when I just
                  need something quick and off the cuff. Major NPCs... don't use it.

                  So overall, I say drop it.

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