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total noob questions on ep's ...

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  • cjtaylor01
    Hi everyone, I d like to take this opportunity to apologise in advance for asking something that may have been answerd in previous threads (although I havn t
    Message 1 of 6 , Jan 13, 2005
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      Hi everyone, I'd like to take this opportunity to apologise in
      advance for asking something that may have been answerd in previous
      threads (although I havn't been able to find anything on these
      questions.)


      a) In the feats section it says that additional feats can be
      purchased with ep's but it doesn't say how many ep's a feat costs.
      I'm assuming they cost 1 ep each is that right?

      b) are there any ways of gaining ep's after you initially put
      together your character without taking a tithe (like swapping out a
      feats for ep(s) or a class where you gain ep(s) at various levels)

      c) under the heading for mutants it says they get 4 compensated ep's
      but the Cyclops example it says Cyclops has 18, where did the other
      12 come from?

      Thanks.
      Chris.
    • Orion
      A) Feats cost 2EP each. I think Scott clarified that through the forum at some point. For the record: Feats are 2EP, Skills are 1EP/4 Skill points, levels are
      Message 2 of 6 , Jan 13, 2005
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        A) Feats cost 2EP each. I think Scott clarified that through the forum
        at some point. For the record: Feats are 2EP, Skills are 1EP/4 Skill
        points, levels are 8EP each. When I run a one-shot game, for example,
        I'll say to my players "You have 24EP to build a character."

        B) The standard version of the system assumes that your character starts
        his/her career with all the powers he/she will ever need (just like a
        comicbook superhero). Within a D20 system, which is predicated on the
        idea that you get more abilities as you got, this can seem
        counter-intuitive, but it's a way to match up with the superhero genre.
        A GM can always decide that he wants to give out a few EPs/level, but
        it's not part of the system, and unless it's an extremely low number of
        EPs the game could get overpowered very, very quickly.

        C) Any and all characters can have as many EPs as they want; this called
        the Experience Tithe. You take however many EPs you want, and then you
        have to devote half of your experience points towards paying off the
        debt. There's an Experience Tithe table you have to consult to see how
        much XP you owe the system (I don't recall the page number; you can look
        it up). The idea is that if you take a low-powered character, that
        character will progress in levesl WAY faster than a high-powered
        character. NOtice, also, that the XP debt on the Tithe table is not a
        flat line; it's a curve. 10EP doesn't cost you ten times as many XP as
        1EP; it's far, FAR more, in fact. This is how the system maintains a
        power balance AND gives players the ability to have a character like the
        Blue Beetle standing shoulder-to-shoulder with Green Lantern/Guy Gardner.

        Next?

        cjtaylor01 wrote:
        >
        > Hi everyone, I'd like to take this opportunity to apologise in
        > advance for asking something that may have been answerd in previous
        > threads (although I havn't been able to find anything on these
        > questions.)
        >
        >
        > a) In the feats section it says that additional feats can be
        > purchased with ep's but it doesn't say how many ep's a feat costs.
        > I'm assuming they cost 1 ep each is that right?
        >
        > b) are there any ways of gaining ep's after you initially put
        > together your character without taking a tithe (like swapping out a
        > feats for ep(s) or a class where you gain ep(s) at various levels)
        >
        > c) under the heading for mutants it says they get 4 compensated ep's
        > but the Cyclops example it says Cyclops has 18, where did the other
        > 12 come from?
        >
        > Thanks.
        > Chris.
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        > Yahoo! Groups Links
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >

        --
        -Orion

        "You're born naked and everything else is drag."
        -RuPaul
      • cjtaylor01
        Wow! Thanks for the quick reply, what I was thinking of was a character class based around a hero who is intensely training the powers and/or abilities they
        Message 3 of 6 , Jan 14, 2005
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          Wow!

          Thanks for the quick reply, what I was thinking of was a
          character class based around a hero who is intensely training the
          powers and/or abilities they have. So instead of a good base attack
          bonus;a good save or class abilities, they get power points. You
          could then use this character class to role play someone discovering
          their powers, or an established character could take a level or two
          and put the ep's towards new tricks that they had learned with their
          powers (this is more common in super hero stories than a hero
          gaining new powers). Although I guess you could just up the
          experience tithe (if your GM agrees.)

          Thanks.

          --- In deedsnotwordsd20@yahoogroups.com, Orion <okidder@t...> wrote:
          > A) Feats cost 2EP each. I think Scott clarified that through the
          forum
          > at some point. For the record: Feats are 2EP, Skills are 1EP/4
          Skill
          > points, levels are 8EP each. When I run a one-shot game, for
          example,
          > I'll say to my players "You have 24EP to build a character."
          >
          > B) The standard version of the system assumes that your character
          starts
          > his/her career with all the powers he/she will ever need (just
          like a
          > comicbook superhero). Within a D20 system, which is predicated on
          the
          > idea that you get more abilities as you got, this can seem
          > counter-intuitive, but it's a way to match up with the superhero
          genre.
          > A GM can always decide that he wants to give out a few EPs/level,
          but
          > it's not part of the system, and unless it's an extremely low
          number of
          > EPs the game could get overpowered very, very quickly.
          >
          > C) Any and all characters can have as many EPs as they want; this
          called
          > the Experience Tithe. You take however many EPs you want, and then
          you
          > have to devote half of your experience points towards paying off
          the
          > debt. There's an Experience Tithe table you have to consult to see
          how
          > much XP you owe the system (I don't recall the page number; you
          can look
          > it up). The idea is that if you take a low-powered character, that
          > character will progress in levesl WAY faster than a high-powered
          > character. NOtice, also, that the XP debt on the Tithe table is
          not a
          > flat line; it's a curve. 10EP doesn't cost you ten times as many
          XP as
          > 1EP; it's far, FAR more, in fact. This is how the system maintains
          a
          > power balance AND gives players the ability to have a character
          like the
          > Blue Beetle standing shoulder-to-shoulder with Green Lantern/Guy
          Gardner.
          >
          > Next?
          >
          > cjtaylor01 wrote:
          > >
          > > Hi everyone, I'd like to take this opportunity to apologise in
          > > advance for asking something that may have been answerd in
          previous
          > > threads (although I havn't been able to find anything on these
          > > questions.)
          > >
          > >
          > > a) In the feats section it says that additional feats can be
          > > purchased with ep's but it doesn't say how many ep's a feat
          costs.
          > > I'm assuming they cost 1 ep each is that right?
          > >
          > > b) are there any ways of gaining ep's after you initially put
          > > together your character without taking a tithe (like swapping
          out a
          > > feats for ep(s) or a class where you gain ep(s) at various
          levels)
          > >
          > > c) under the heading for mutants it says they get 4 compensated
          ep's
          > > but the Cyclops example it says Cyclops has 18, where did the
          other
          > > 12 come from?
          > >
          > > Thanks.
          > > Chris.
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > > Yahoo! Groups Links
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          >
          > --
          > -Orion
          >
          > "You're born naked and everything else is drag."
          > -RuPaul
        • Orion
          No problem. I had a few minutes free and I know these rules pretty well by now, though Palmer s nigh encyclopeadic knowledge of DNW still puts me to shame.
          Message 4 of 6 , Jan 14, 2005
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            No problem. I had a few minutes free and I know these rules pretty well
            by now, though Palmer's nigh encyclopeadic knowledge of DNW still puts
            me to shame.

            I've thought about the kind of thing you're talking about, and I think
            the simpler solution, if you want a character whose powers get stronger,
            or who just gets better at using his powers, you can do a couple of
            different things.

            You can hand out EP at the end of every level. This can get Monty Hall
            very quickly, so watch out. If you do this, though, make sure you
            stipulate one or both of the following rules:

            1. Characters can pump more points into existing powers (including
            Enhancements), but not buy new ones. If you have a super-speedster, he
            can get faster (up his movement rate), or buy more Bonus Actions, for
            example, but he cannot suddenly develop the ability to blow fireballs
            out his ass.

            2. The GM has veto over every new superpower to make sure that it's
            appropriately 'themed' to the existing power set. For example, a PC
            called the White Tiger purchases a bunch of powers that simulate the
            physical prowess of a big cat, but then at 4th level wants to buy
            Flight. The GM then says, "But wait! Cats can't fly!" and the PC is not
            allowed to take the power.

            Finally, I wouldn't screw with the Experience Tithe amounts if I were
            you. They're pretty carefully tabulated to maintain a certain
            mathematical curve. Just doubling them, or something, would kinda screw
            with the math, as I understand it.

            What you can do, though, is raise the fraction of XP a player needs to
            devote to paying off the Tithe. Presently, a PC must give up half of her
            XP per game towards the Tithe. How about 75%? How about 100%?
            Alternatively, how about 25%? This is a number that's easy to adjust and
            factor into a game. A 50% Tithe means the character will gain half as
            many levels as her comrades until she pays it off, 75% means she'll be
            one quarter the level progression, etc.

            cjtaylor01 wrote:
            >
            > Wow!
            >
            > Thanks for the quick reply, what I was thinking of was a
            > character class based around a hero who is intensely training the
            > powers and/or abilities they have. So instead of a good base attack
            > bonus;a good save or class abilities, they get power points. You
            > could then use this character class to role play someone discovering
            > their powers, or an established character could take a level or two
            > and put the ep's towards new tricks that they had learned with their
            > powers (this is more common in super hero stories than a hero
            > gaining new powers). Although I guess you could just up the
            > experience tithe (if your GM agrees.)
            >
            > Thanks.
            >
            > --- In deedsnotwordsd20@yahoogroups.com, Orion <okidder@t...> wrote:
            >
            >>A) Feats cost 2EP each. I think Scott clarified that through the
            >
            > forum
            >
            >>at some point. For the record: Feats are 2EP, Skills are 1EP/4
            >
            > Skill
            >
            >>points, levels are 8EP each. When I run a one-shot game, for
            >
            > example,
            >
            >>I'll say to my players "You have 24EP to build a character."
            >>
            >>B) The standard version of the system assumes that your character
            >
            > starts
            >
            >>his/her career with all the powers he/she will ever need (just
            >
            > like a
            >
            >>comicbook superhero). Within a D20 system, which is predicated on
            >
            > the
            >
            >>idea that you get more abilities as you got, this can seem
            >>counter-intuitive, but it's a way to match up with the superhero
            >
            > genre.
            >
            >>A GM can always decide that he wants to give out a few EPs/level,
            >
            > but
            >
            >>it's not part of the system, and unless it's an extremely low
            >
            > number of
            >
            >>EPs the game could get overpowered very, very quickly.
            >>
            >>C) Any and all characters can have as many EPs as they want; this
            >
            > called
            >
            >>the Experience Tithe. You take however many EPs you want, and then
            >
            > you
            >
            >>have to devote half of your experience points towards paying off
            >
            > the
            >
            >>debt. There's an Experience Tithe table you have to consult to see
            >
            > how
            >
            >>much XP you owe the system (I don't recall the page number; you
            >
            > can look
            >
            >>it up). The idea is that if you take a low-powered character, that
            >>character will progress in levesl WAY faster than a high-powered
            >>character. NOtice, also, that the XP debt on the Tithe table is
            >
            > not a
            >
            >>flat line; it's a curve. 10EP doesn't cost you ten times as many
            >
            > XP as
            >
            >>1EP; it's far, FAR more, in fact. This is how the system maintains
            >
            > a
            >
            >>power balance AND gives players the ability to have a character
            >
            > like the
            >
            >>Blue Beetle standing shoulder-to-shoulder with Green Lantern/Guy
            >
            > Gardner.
            >
            >>Next?
            >>
            >>cjtaylor01 wrote:
            >>
            >>>Hi everyone, I'd like to take this opportunity to apologise in
            >>>advance for asking something that may have been answerd in
            >
            > previous
            >
            >>>threads (although I havn't been able to find anything on these
            >>>questions.)
            >>>
            >>>
            >>>a) In the feats section it says that additional feats can be
            >>>purchased with ep's but it doesn't say how many ep's a feat
            >
            > costs.
            >
            >>>I'm assuming they cost 1 ep each is that right?
            >>>
            >>>b) are there any ways of gaining ep's after you initially put
            >>>together your character without taking a tithe (like swapping
            >
            > out a
            >
            >>>feats for ep(s) or a class where you gain ep(s) at various
            >
            > levels)
            >
            >>>c) under the heading for mutants it says they get 4 compensated
            >
            > ep's
            >
            >>>but the Cyclops example it says Cyclops has 18, where did the
            >
            > other
            >
            >>>12 come from?
            >>>
            >>>Thanks.
            >>>Chris.
            >>>
            >>>
            >>>
            >>>
            >>>
            >>>
            >>>Yahoo! Groups Links
            >>>
            >>>
            >>>
            >>>
            >>>
            >>>
            >>>
            >>>
            >>
            >>--
            >>-Orion
            >>
            >>"You're born naked and everything else is drag."
            >> -RuPaul
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            > Yahoo! Groups Links
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >

            --
            -Orion

            "You're born naked and everything else is drag."
            -RuPaul
          • Palmer of the Turks
            ... Don t worry, it would be a pain to find the answers in the archives anyways. ... 2 EP each, actually. It was left out as a typo, unfortunately. ...
            Message 5 of 6 , Jan 14, 2005
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              On 13 Jan 2005, at 22:55, cjtaylor01 wrote:

              > Hi everyone, I'd like to take this opportunity to
              > apologise in advance for asking something that
              > may have been answerd in previous threads
              > (although I havn't been able to find anything on
              > these questions.)

              Don't worry, it would be a pain to find the answers in the archives anyways.

              > a) In the feats section it says that additional feats
              > can be purchased with ep's but it doesn't say how
              > many ep's a feat costs. I'm assuming they cost 1
              > ep each is that right?

              2 EP each, actually. It was left out as a typo, unfortunately.

              > b) are there any ways of gaining ep's after you
              > initially put together your character without taking
              > a tithe (like swapping out a feats for ep(s) or a class
              > where you gain ep(s) at various levels)

              Strictly speaking, no. In DNW 2.0 (which i'm working on) it will include gaining EP
              every level as a standard feature, but it will basically phase out the Tithe in it's place.

              An optional rule that developed in later supplements is that if you gain extra
              Weapon/Armor proficiencies, and don't want them, you can trade them in for 1 EP
              each.

              Other than that, there's no rules regarding this.
              If you DO want to give EP every level, you might want to try the version I'm working
              with for 2.0 currently.
              1: Limit the size of tithe everyone can take, or make it so everyone has the same
              number of uncompensated EP.
              2: Do NOT give characters the extra feat every 3 levels and extra stat point every 4
              levels. They gain class bonuses normally, though.
              3: Give them 1 EP every level they gain, plain and simple. They can save them or
              spend them right away. They CANNOT be used to reduce tithe (that breaks the
              system), only to improve from where they are.

              > c) under the heading for mutants it says they get 4
              > compensated ep's but the Cyclops example it says
              > Cyclops has 18, where did the other 12 come from?

              Complications :)

              Hero’s Code: Loyalty (2)
              Hero’s Code: Mercy (2)
              Nemesis: Villain (Magneto; 4)
              Nemesis: Media (Anti-Mutant Lobby; 4)
              Dependent (Junior X-Trainees; 2)

              That makes 14, plus 4 for Mutant makes 18.

              ====================
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            • Palmer of the Turks
              ... Nope, they re 1 EP for 2 skill points. See the Extra Study feat (4 skill points) and Super-(skill) powers (1 EP = +2) ... You missed that he was talking
              Message 6 of 6 , Jan 14, 2005
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                On 13 Jan 2005, at 16:29, Orion wrote:

                > Skills are 1EP/4 Skill points

                Nope, they're 1 EP for 2 skill points.
                See the Extra Study feat (4 skill points) and Super-(skill) powers (1 EP = +2)

                > C) Any and all characters can have as many EPs as they want;

                You missed that he was talking about compensated EP.
                Cyclops has a hell of a lot more than 18 EP worth of powers and advantages... 58 in total to be exact.
                The Optic Blast costs 42 EP alone.

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