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Re: This Club: New management/ownership

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  • Jim
    Hi Fred, The high end hobby insted of DIY may be the biggest difference between the two clubs. I remember when my wife and I lived in Houston. We were active
    Message 1 of 16 , Aug 19, 2007
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      Hi Fred,

        The high end hobby insted of DIY may be the biggest difference between the two clubs.  I remember when my wife and I lived in Houston. We were active in PTA, Girl Scouts, girls fast pitch softball, etc. It was always the same people running things. Getting volunteers always seemed hard. Guess most clubs and organizations suffer from the same problems. It's just time for me to pull in some of the many irons in this audio fire. Thanks for your thoughts. I've made Russ, Frank and Blair co-owners with me for the present time. Hope the transition(s) go well. We shall see. jim...


      --- In dallasaudioclub@yahoogroups.com, "Fred" <fredaudio@...> wrote:
      >
      > Jim, you are too generous in describing me as a real mover and shaker
      > in Houston. The one part you got right is the Houston part. I
      > couldn't help but notice that DAC Yahoo Group participation has
      > dwindled to about one post per month. The Houston club, in contrast,
      > has a steady stream of posts, and meeting attendance has grown to the
      > point where we often can't accommodate everybody in the listening
      > room. In addition, there's quite a bit of informal activity, such as
      > last week when several of us visited Fred Crowder's house to hear his
      > new Acapella speakers.
      >
      > I'm not absolutely certain why the difference between the audio clubs
      > in two very similar metropolitan areas, but I have some ideas that
      > might be helpful to anybody wanting to generate more participation in
      > the Dallas club:
      >
      > 1) The Houston club has defined itself as a "high end audio" club,
      > and not a DIY group. I've found that most of the people who have high
      > end (read "expensive") audio systems are only passingly interested in
      > DIY, and many of the DIY enthusiasts I know aren't interested in
      > expensive high end audio equipment. Keeping the high end (HAS) and
      > DIY (Lone Star Bottleheads) activities separate has worked well for
      > us.
      >
      > 2) Given the sad state of the high end audio business it's hard to
      > raise a good crowd for one club's events, even in a large metro area
      > like DFW. In the DFW area you have two, the DAC and the North Texas
      > Audio Jam. I never have understood the difference, but I suspect you
      > would do better with one high end club and one DIY-oriented club.
      > Individuals could choose to participate in either or both.
      >
      > 3) Every club has turnover, and new members are often more
      > enthusiastic than the old guard. We have actively recruited new
      > members for the HAS, and many of the regulars from as recently as
      > four years ago are no longer very active. About half the participants
      > at each meeting are people who have joined within the past two years.
      > We tried to advertise at the three local high end audio shops, and
      > they have been very helpful in hosting some meetings to demo their
      > products, but aren't too interested in advertising our existence to
      > their customers. I suspect they fear losing those customers to some
      > of our dealer members. Our most effective recruiting tool is very
      > simple: I search Audiogon every week for ads posted by audiophiles
      > living in the zip code area beginning with "77" (Houston area), and
      > send each a message saying "I can't use the (component), but you're
      > invited to join our Yahoo Group and our club. Just go the the link
      > below for information about our next meeting. Hope to see you there."
      >
      > 4) The amount of structure you should have in any organization is the
      > minimum needed to get the job done. But every club needs some
      > structure, and the least that's required is a small group of
      > designated leaders who make things happen. After some confusion and
      > disorganization at meetings we appointed a President (John Z),
      > program director (me), and a treasurer (Sheri). This has been working
      > well, and the three of us plan to meet soon to discuss club
      > activities and issues like the size of our meeting space, new member
      > recruiting, etc. Most people don't want to be leaders for a variety
      > of reasons including work/family time conflicts, but if you can't
      > find three new people to volunteer each year to lead, then you
      > probably don't have a viable club.
      >
      > Hope this helps whomever volunteers to take over those slippery DAC
      > reins.
      >

    • Richard Rea
      I think Fred has some good idears. I think that a set day once a month(say every 2nd Sat) the club has meet. That would have an issue of someone needing to
      Message 2 of 16 , Aug 19, 2007
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        I think Fred has some good idears.
        I think that a set day once a month(say every 2nd Sat) the club has
        meet. That would have an issue of someone needing to host.

        Could even meet early at a Starbucks for coffe first. Should be
        wraped up by noon or so.

        On another note, I'm very into hiend, but due to wife support I can
        not afforde what I want. Thu, looking to do some small amount of DIY
        hence last post.

        Just my 2cents.

        from the guy with a better sound stage in his car than home.

        Richard


        --- In dallasaudioclub@yahoogroups.com, "Fred" <fredaudio@...> wrote:
        >
        > Jim, you are too generous in describing me as a real mover and
        shaker
        > in Houston. The one part you got right is the Houston part. I
        > couldn't help but notice that DAC Yahoo Group participation has
        > dwindled to about one post per month. The Houston club, in
        contrast,
        > has a steady stream of posts, and meeting attendance has grown to
        the
        > point where we often can't accommodate everybody in the listening
        > room. In addition, there's quite a bit of informal activity, such
        as
        > last week when several of us visited Fred Crowder's house to hear
        his
        > new Acapella speakers.
        >
        > I'm not absolutely certain why the difference between the audio
        clubs
        > in two very similar metropolitan areas, but I have some ideas that
        > might be helpful to anybody wanting to generate more participation
        in
        > the Dallas club:
        >
        > 1) The Houston club has defined itself as a "high end audio" club,
        > and not a DIY group. I've found that most of the people who have
        high
        > end (read "expensive") audio systems are only passingly interested
        in
        > DIY, and many of the DIY enthusiasts I know aren't interested in
        > expensive high end audio equipment. Keeping the high end (HAS) and
        > DIY (Lone Star Bottleheads) activities separate has worked well for
        > us.
        >
        > 2) Given the sad state of the high end audio business it's hard to
        > raise a good crowd for one club's events, even in a large metro
        area
        > like DFW. In the DFW area you have two, the DAC and the North Texas
        > Audio Jam. I never have understood the difference, but I suspect
        you
        > would do better with one high end club and one DIY-oriented club.
        > Individuals could choose to participate in either or both.
        >
        > 3) Every club has turnover, and new members are often more
        > enthusiastic than the old guard. We have actively recruited new
        > members for the HAS, and many of the regulars from as recently as
        > four years ago are no longer very active. About half the
        participants
        > at each meeting are people who have joined within the past two
        years.
        > We tried to advertise at the three local high end audio shops, and
        > they have been very helpful in hosting some meetings to demo their
        > products, but aren't too interested in advertising our existence to
        > their customers. I suspect they fear losing those customers to some
        > of our dealer members. Our most effective recruiting tool is very
        > simple: I search Audiogon every week for ads posted by audiophiles
        > living in the zip code area beginning with "77" (Houston area), and
        > send each a message saying "I can't use the (component), but you're
        > invited to join our Yahoo Group and our club. Just go the the link
        > below for information about our next meeting. Hope to see you
        there."
        >
        > 4) The amount of structure you should have in any organization is
        the
        > minimum needed to get the job done. But every club needs some
        > structure, and the least that's required is a small group of
        > designated leaders who make things happen. After some confusion and
        > disorganization at meetings we appointed a President (John Z),
        > program director (me), and a treasurer (Sheri). This has been
        working
        > well, and the three of us plan to meet soon to discuss club
        > activities and issues like the size of our meeting space, new
        member
        > recruiting, etc. Most people don't want to be leaders for a variety
        > of reasons including work/family time conflicts, but if you can't
        > find three new people to volunteer each year to lead, then you
        > probably don't have a viable club.
        >
        > Hope this helps whomever volunteers to take over those slippery DAC
        > reins.
        >
      • blrchapman
        Hello guys, As you saw in Jim s post, I as well as a few other members here have stepped up to try to put a new starter motor on this group. I like and
        Message 3 of 16 , Aug 19, 2007
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          Hello guys,

          As you saw in Jim's post, I as well as a few other members here have
          stepped up to try to put a new starter motor on this group. I like
          and appreciate what everyone is saying regarding the difference in
          DIY and Hi End audio. I think the line that separates most of these
          two groups is typically funding. AKA the difference between me
          walking into my living room with four ziplocks full of lead shot, and
          another guy walking into the room with super dense pretty weights
          designed for the tops of his speakers custom made in mahoghany and
          zebrawood. What works better? Who knows really?

          What I would really like is as much feedback as I can get to assist
          in trying to make this a better club for everyone.

          Let me introduce myself first,

          My name is Blair Chapman. I live in Allen and have been fairly
          obsessed with audio since I was about 10. I'm 28 now. I'm a big time
          DIYer. As a matter of fact my current system consists of a 6SN7
          preamp, a pretty modded DIYTUBE MKIII (Stereo amplifier), braided
          CAT5 cables, DIY open baffle hybrid speakers (I'll include some
          links), a MHZS CD player that I bought broken from a guy for 150
          bucks and put 50 more into to mod the crap out of it and fix the
          poppy sound or replaced the DAC chip;) So, I can honestly say that
          there ain't a thing in my system that I haven't had a gun on.

          http://www.villagephotos.com/pubbrowse.asp?folder_id=1535206

          What I want is your thoughts on the differences between DIY audio
          versus High End audio minus the obvious. This is not meant to strike
          up an arguement, but to assist me in trying to reformat and think of
          some meeting ideas and a "workable" solution.

          Thank all,

          Blair
        • Dennis Boyle
          This might turn out to be an interesting topic. To start off I refer interested members to a definition of high end audio
          Message 4 of 16 , Aug 19, 2007
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            This might turn out to be an interesting topic. To start off I refer interested members to a definition of high end audio

            http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High-end_audio and DIY audio http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DIY_audio there is enough information in those definitions for every to fell good about themselves.

             

            I assume most audio enthusiasts, I hate to use the word audiophile, are just trying to end up with a home audio system that gets them closer to the Magic in the Music. I am not sure it is just an issue of affordability, since price doesn’t always mean performance whether you are buying or building.

             

            Home Audio Stereo sales as a % of the consumer electronics market is shrinking rapidly, at least according to the CES. Many consumers have switched to Home Theater systems which they also use to play Music, but the biggest impact has been MP3, portable DA players and ancillary products that provide an alternative Home Audio System. They just drop their Ipod into an affordable powere stereo speaker console. When I used to get my complimentary Manufacturers copy of Stereophile, they used to send me quarterly surveys on their subscribers. At that time the average age of their subscribers was in the high 50s. How many years does “high end” audio have left. How many perople in their 30s have ever heard a decent Stereo System.

             

            The good news is that the Web has been a very good thing for Audio, whether you are building or buying a system. There has also been a lot of decent affordable, relatively speaking, audio products that offer excellent performance…especially if you are buying used equipment off the Web.

             

            Perhaps the question really is, are the traditional ways audio consumers improved their systems still working? Audio Magazines, Audio Dealers and Audio Manufacturers claims are not trusted or believed as they used to be. Many audio consumers surf the web and read customers reviews or ask members of audio groups their opinions on equipment. I hasten to add there is misinformation on the web as well, but in most cases the participants are not as biased or as blatant as the information published by members of the Audio Industry.

             

            Since this seems to be about the future “path” of the DAC towards success. It might be a good idea to e-mail all the members and have them participate in a survey. Why did they join, how they would like the DAC to be a resource to their needs, etc. and publish the results. It could be that my assumption that all of us joined to find the Magic in the Music might not be valid,                    

             

            Regards,

             

            Dennis Boyle

            Chimera Laboratories

            Website: http://www.chimeralabs.com/

            Website: http://home.att.net/~chimeraone/index.html

             

             


            From: dallasaudioclub@yahoogroups.com [mailto:dallasaudioclub@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of blrchapman
            Sent: Sunday, August 19, 2007 10:03 PM
            To: dallasaudioclub@yahoogroups.com
            Subject: [dallasaudioclub] Re: This Club: New management/ownership

             

            Hello guys,

            As you saw in Jim's post, I as well as a few other members here have
            stepped up to try to put a new starter motor on this group. I like
            and appreciate what everyone is saying regarding the difference in
            DIY and Hi End audio. I think the line that separates most of these
            two groups is typically funding. AKA the difference between me
            walking into my living room with four ziplocks full of lead shot, and
            another guy walking into the room with super dense pretty weights
            designed for the tops of his speakers custom made in mahoghany and
            zebrawood. What works better? Who knows really?

            What I would really like is as much feedback as I can get to assist
            in trying to make this a better club for everyone.

            Let me introduce myself first,

            My name is Blair Chapman. I live in Allen and have been fairly
            obsessed with audio since I was about 10. I'm 28 now. I'm a big time
            DIYer. As a matter of fact my current system consists of a 6SN7
            preamp, a pretty modded DIYTUBE MKIII (Stereo amplifier), braided
            CAT5 cables, DIY open baffle hybrid speakers (I'll include some
            links), a MHZS CD player that I bought broken from a guy for 150
            bucks and put 50 more into to mod the crap out of it and fix the
            poppy sound or replaced the DAC chip;) So, I can honestly say that
            there ain't a thing in my system that I haven't had a gun on.

            http://www.villagep hotos.com/ pubbrowse. asp?folder_ id=1535206

            What I want is your thoughts on the differences between DIY audio
            versus High End audio minus the obvious. This is not meant to strike
            up an arguement, but to assist me in trying to reformat and think of
            some meeting ideas and a "workable" solution.

            Thank all,

            Blair

          • Tom Russell
            The small number of posts making any response concerning this matter likely says more, and thus brings the DAC situation more into focus, than any other thing
            Message 5 of 16 , Aug 20, 2007
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              The small number of posts making any response concerning this matter likely
              says more, and thus brings the DAC situation more into focus, than any other
              thing that might be said. Nevertheless, after mulling over this for a while,
              I decided to post on this subject.

              First off, a large word of thanks goes out to Jim, and to Fred, for
              possessing a lot of initiative and showing a lot of dedication in their
              efforts to the purpose of creating a viable hifi guy group in our area. No
              matter what either of them might say, they are the movers and shakers here
              abouts. As far as I can tell from my view, without their efforts there would
              be no moving, nor any shaking, going on at all. I have been involved in some
              aspect of high end/DIY audio for many decades, all in the D/FW area. I have
              seen several attempts at establishing an audio based group over the years
              and none of these attemps have led to anything that could be called
              successful. Maybe there is something endemic to this area?

              Regarding the thoughts, "Heck I feel you're not a full DAC member until your
              have hosted a audio meet some kind." and " if you have never hosted a meet
              before then I feel you have no input or have paid your dues.", if this
              criteria is to be used, this thread is a useless exercise as the three or
              four few who have hosted can work this out amongst themselves. My thoughts
              would be more along the lines that this club has been, if anything, too
              exclusionary and should do, if anything, whatever is reasonable to encourage
              participation across as wide a front as could possibly be considered
              relative to quality audio reproduction. It is obvious that the preponderance
              of responses to this thread have been from DIY guys.

              I've always assumed that the DAC/Bottlehead guys and the North Texas Audio
              Jam guys were, respectively, the Audio Karma guys and the Audio Circle guys.

              Regarding high end audio vs. DIY audio, the definitions of these
              disciplines, especially as they relate to ultimate sound quality, are not at
              all directly relative to the amount of money spent. There are far, far too
              many examples of both of these disciplines rendering poor quality results.
              The real problem area lies in the fact that any and all versions of a
              serious attempt at quality audio reproduction are quickly becoming more and
              more marginalized to the point of effective extinction. The practical
              problem, the problem that is certainly very real in the minds of non-audio
              folks, is that the average audio system, as represented by both high-end,
              high-dollar and DIY, do not sound very good and therefore do not, and in
              actuality can not, in any sense that would be generally considered as
              reasonable, validate their own worth and ultimately can not validate their
              own existence in the real world. This is the real world battle line. It is
              true that what remains of the hi-fi scene has generally morphed into home
              theater. Every time a home-theater-in-a-box is sold, the world goes further
              away from 2 channel audio. My experience shows me that attempting to combine
              a home theater surround sound set-up and a 2 channel music set-up into one
              system is not going to do justice to either discipline. The burden is on
              those of us who have interest in the viability of the 2 channel music system
              to demonstrate the value of having such a system to the rest of the world.
              In this regard, it is obvious that we have failed.

              On a personal note about hosting, I volunteered, in discussions with both
              Jim and Fred, to host audio meetings. Those of you who know me know that I
              am a music guy. All of this equipment stuff is, to my view, strictly there
              to be in support of the musical statement and the emotional music
              connection. That said, I do have some good stuff. What I had to offer was a
              place with sufficient space to accomodate a normally sized group, two
              complete 2 channel systems [both of which are about as good sounding as you
              will find anytime, anywhere], many 1000's of all sorts of recordings, chef
              quality food, and a very flexible schedule. I also have a dedicated theater
              area that could be available for use. Both of my 2 channel systems are fully
              hard-wired; audio signal, power supply, and AC. My systems are not conducive
              to moving different components in and out. In my home, I have only so much
              space and it has required some specific planning so that everything will
              have it's own place to be. In both conversations, it was decided that my
              place was not good for an audio meeting. "These people want to change
              components around." That was that. When one takes into account that some
              people don't feel that they have sufficient space to host [should be able to
              be worked out], some people feel that they don't have a sufficient level of
              equipment quality to host [shouldn't matter], some people have family issues
              that they feel preclude hosting, some people feel that they don't have
              sufficient financial resources to host [should be able to be worked out],
              etc., etc., and you add in the above paragraph, one can see that there are
              practical problems, with regard to hosting, that need to be overcome.
              Should be able to be worked out!

              All said, I continue to desire to get together with audio guys, particularly
              music oriented audio guys, just about anytime. Our family is a late night to
              early morning family and I have most every afternoon and evening open. Y'all
              are welcome!


              Tom
            • blrchapman
              Thank you for this opinion and offer, I agree that Fred and Jim are both very assertive and aggressive towards the needs of the audio community. Granted I
              Message 6 of 16 , Aug 20, 2007
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                Thank you for this opinion and offer,

                I agree that Fred and Jim are both very assertive and aggressive
                towards the needs of the audio community. Granted I haven't done
                anything through this organization, I have assembled several
                successful DIY events with people driving up from as far as Austin to
                attend. It is always a pleasure to have these events and the
                reoccurance of guests obviously shows enjoyment during their visits.
                As far as loving music, I think we are all in agreement there. I
                guess that I'm trying to get at is that it was a poorly stated post
                to try to discern between DIY and Hi End audio enthisiast. I was
                merely trying to see who posteed on behalf of each type of audio
                enthusiast. I eagerly look forward to making things happen here and
                will do my best to introduce some neat and challenging topics
                tailored towards everyone whether it is source material or distortion
                figures in various vacuum tubes. I think the idea brought forth about
                meeting once every month or two in person to dicuss such issues if
                not just for the sake of having a drink is a good idea as well. Shows
                support and some form of group interest.

                Thank you,

                Blair


                --- In dallasaudioclub@yahoogroups.com, "Tom Russell" <tomjoy@...>
                wrote:
                >
                > The small number of posts making any response concerning this
                matter likely
                > says more, and thus brings the DAC situation more into focus, than
                any other
                > thing that might be said. Nevertheless, after mulling over this for
                a while,
                > I decided to post on this subject.
                >
                > First off, a large word of thanks goes out to Jim, and to Fred, for
                > possessing a lot of initiative and showing a lot of dedication in
                their
                > efforts to the purpose of creating a viable hifi guy group in our
                area. No
                > matter what either of them might say, they are the movers and
                shakers here
                > abouts. As far as I can tell from my view, without their efforts
                there would
                > be no moving, nor any shaking, going on at all. I have been
                involved in some
                > aspect of high end/DIY audio for many decades, all in the D/FW
                area. I have
                > seen several attempts at establishing an audio based group over the
                years
                > and none of these attemps have led to anything that could be called
                > successful. Maybe there is something endemic to this area?
                >
                > Regarding the thoughts, "Heck I feel you're not a full DAC member
                until your
                > have hosted a audio meet some kind." and " if you have never hosted
                a meet
                > before then I feel you have no input or have paid your dues.", if
                this
                > criteria is to be used, this thread is a useless exercise as the
                three or
                > four few who have hosted can work this out amongst themselves. My
                thoughts
                > would be more along the lines that this club has been, if anything,
                too
                > exclusionary and should do, if anything, whatever is reasonable to
                encourage
                > participation across as wide a front as could possibly be considered
                > relative to quality audio reproduction. It is obvious that the
                preponderance
                > of responses to this thread have been from DIY guys.
                >
                > I've always assumed that the DAC/Bottlehead guys and the North
                Texas Audio
                > Jam guys were, respectively, the Audio Karma guys and the Audio
                Circle guys.
                >
                > Regarding high end audio vs. DIY audio, the definitions of these
                > disciplines, especially as they relate to ultimate sound quality,
                are not at
                > all directly relative to the amount of money spent. There are far,
                far too
                > many examples of both of these disciplines rendering poor quality
                results.
                > The real problem area lies in the fact that any and all versions of
                a
                > serious attempt at quality audio reproduction are quickly becoming
                more and
                > more marginalized to the point of effective extinction. The
                practical
                > problem, the problem that is certainly very real in the minds of
                non-audio
                > folks, is that the average audio system, as represented by both
                high-end,
                > high-dollar and DIY, do not sound very good and therefore do not,
                and in
                > actuality can not, in any sense that would be generally considered
                as
                > reasonable, validate their own worth and ultimately can not
                validate their
                > own existence in the real world. This is the real world battle
                line. It is
                > true that what remains of the hi-fi scene has generally morphed
                into home
                > theater. Every time a home-theater-in-a-box is sold, the world goes
                further
                > away from 2 channel audio. My experience shows me that attempting
                to combine
                > a home theater surround sound set-up and a 2 channel music set-up
                into one
                > system is not going to do justice to either discipline. The burden
                is on
                > those of us who have interest in the viability of the 2 channel
                music system
                > to demonstrate the value of having such a system to the rest of the
                world.
                > In this regard, it is obvious that we have failed.
                >
                > On a personal note about hosting, I volunteered, in discussions
                with both
                > Jim and Fred, to host audio meetings. Those of you who know me know
                that I
                > am a music guy. All of this equipment stuff is, to my view,
                strictly there
                > to be in support of the musical statement and the emotional music
                > connection. That said, I do have some good stuff. What I had to
                offer was a
                > place with sufficient space to accomodate a normally sized group,
                two
                > complete 2 channel systems [both of which are about as good
                sounding as you
                > will find anytime, anywhere], many 1000's of all sorts of
                recordings, chef
                > quality food, and a very flexible schedule. I also have a dedicated
                theater
                > area that could be available for use. Both of my 2 channel systems
                are fully
                > hard-wired; audio signal, power supply, and AC. My systems are not
                conducive
                > to moving different components in and out. In my home, I have only
                so much
                > space and it has required some specific planning so that everything
                will
                > have it's own place to be. In both conversations, it was decided
                that my
                > place was not good for an audio meeting. "These people want to
                change
                > components around." That was that. When one takes into account that
                some
                > people don't feel that they have sufficient space to host [should
                be able to
                > be worked out], some people feel that they don't have a sufficient
                level of
                > equipment quality to host [shouldn't matter], some people have
                family issues
                > that they feel preclude hosting, some people feel that they don't
                have
                > sufficient financial resources to host [should be able to be worked
                out],
                > etc., etc., and you add in the above paragraph, one can see that
                there are
                > practical problems, with regard to hosting, that need to be
                overcome.
                > Should be able to be worked out!
                >
                > All said, I continue to desire to get together with audio guys,
                particularly
                > music oriented audio guys, just about anytime. Our family is a late
                night to
                > early morning family and I have most every afternoon and evening
                open. Y'all
                > are welcome!
                >
                >
                > Tom
                >
              • Ron Carlton
                There is another fairly active group in the DFW area: DFW_Hornheads http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DFW_Hornheads/ that shouldn t be overlooked. I have two
                Message 7 of 16 , Aug 20, 2007
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                  There is another fairly active group in the DFW area: DFW_Hornheads
                  http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DFW_Hornheads/ that shouldn't be
                  overlooked. I have two complete systems with an empty room in which a
                  third could be setup. I certainly have the means to host an event also.

                  Ron
                • bearhifi
                  Once again it does not matter if your DIY or commercial and this club has never cared what your preferences is. The rule has always been Its your meeting /
                  Message 8 of 16 , Aug 20, 2007
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                    Once again it does not matter if your DIY or commercial and this
                    club has never cared what your preferences is. The rule has always
                    been "Its your meeting / house and you can do as you please." If
                    you want to only listen to music then that's your choice as long as
                    you post your desires on the board. This has been a simple group of
                    folks looking to have a beer and play around with audio gear. It's
                    not high tech or commercial! That's it in a nut shell. But like I
                    said if one wants to grow the club into something bigger and/or a
                    different direction then I will try to support it.

                    Regarding your comment "this club has been, if anything, too
                    exclusionary." It has become exclusionary because only a hand full
                    of folks actually hold meetings… If more people would volunteer then
                    it would not be so exclusionary, we'd get a variety of perspectives
                    and preferences, and maybe appeal to a broader audience…


                    There should not be any more debates regarding DIY and non-DIY!
                    It's not an issue and if you like and have audio gear of any kind
                    then please feel free to share it with us over a beer (or wine, or
                    tequila, or whatever)… It's that simple really…
                  • jktdet
                    ... Very well said... why don t we just have a meeting and see what happens. Personally I enjoy the chance to talk to other folks listen to a little new music.
                    Message 9 of 16 , Aug 20, 2007
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                      >
                      >
                      > There should not be any more debates regarding DIY and non-DIY!
                      > It's not an issue and if you like and have audio gear of any kind
                      > then please feel free to share it with us over a beer (or wine, or
                      > tequila, or whatever)… It's that simple really…


                      Very well said... why don't we just have a meeting and see what
                      happens. Personally I enjoy the chance to talk to other folks listen
                      to a little new music. See what people's interests are etc...

                      I will host a meet if anyone is game. I have the space and a system. I
                      can also set things up for easy hook up of other gear.

                      Dave
                    • Dennis Boyle
                      Hopefully more DAC members will participate in this discussion and the postings will help the group reach a consensus that satisfies the needs of a majority of
                      Message 10 of 16 , Aug 20, 2007
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                        Hopefully more DAC members will participate in this discussion and the postings will help the group reach a consensus that satisfies the needs of a majority of the active members. I can’t believe that the roster shows a membership of over 90 members.

                         

                        I thought I would at least share my own experiences participating in the club. Keep in mind I am in the business, but to be honest, I am not interested in orders from DAC members. I am interested in two things. Using their ears to help me refine the products and to do some serious listening to components and Music.

                         

                        DAC members were a big help in refining the Axiom Amp design. Once again thanks to all who participated. I have lost count of how many new artists and new albums I discovered. It wouldn’t have happened without the listening sessions and look forward to discovering more.

                         

                        To be honest I can do without the large group meetings. I went to a meeting at Bob Spence’s house and took a friend along that was interested in joining the club to listen to some Music. There were a lot of people and a lot of equipment and Music I never got to listen to. The agenda seemed to be more about talking about audio than listening to it. We stayed about 30 minutes and took off.  That’s the last meeting I went to.

                         

                        Since then I have accepted invitations to weekend listening sessions from DAC members when I could. Smaller group of people, in some cases a break for food or none at all. Then we stopped talking and listened to Music. In one listening session the group grew to some number I don’t remember and discussion trumped the Music.

                         

                        I guess what I am saying is it might not be the number of meetings you have or how many meetings take place at different locations. It what members want the agenda of the meeting to be. I don’t care about how many different pieces of equipment there will be or whether there will be munchies. I would like to know whether we will do some serious listening.

                         

                        Regards,          

                         

                         

                        Dennis Boyle

                        Chimera Laboratories

                        Website: http://www.chimeralabs.com/

                        Website: http://home.att.net/~chimeraone/index.html

                         

                         


                        From: dallasaudioclub@yahoogroups.com [mailto:dallasaudioclub@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of bearhifi
                        Sent: Monday, August 20, 2007 7:08 PM
                        To: dallasaudioclub@yahoogroups.com
                        Subject: [dallasaudioclub] Re: This Club: New management/ownership

                         

                        Once again it does not matter if your DIY or commercial and this
                        club has never cared what your preferences is. The rule has always
                        been "Its your meeting / house and you can do as you please." If
                        you want to only listen to music then that's your choice as long as
                        you post your desires on the board. This has been a simple group of
                        folks looking to have a beer and play around with audio gear. It's
                        not high tech or commercial! That's it in a nut shell. But like I
                        said if one wants to grow the club into something bigger and/or a
                        different direction then I will try to support it.

                        Regarding your comment "this club has been, if anything, too
                        exclusionary. " It has become exclusionary because only a hand full
                        of folks actually hold meetings… If more people would volunteer then
                        it would not be so exclusionary, we'd get a variety of perspectives
                        and preferences, and maybe appeal to a broader audience…

                        There should not be any more debates regarding DIY and non-DIY!
                        It's not an issue and if you like and have audio gear of any kind
                        then please feel free to share it with us over a beer (or wine, or
                        tequila, or whatever)… It's that simple really…

                      • Jim
                        Tom: For whatever reason. Probably my own old fart brain, I never understood you to offer holding a meeting. My bad and sorry. Dennis: In the beginning, I
                        Message 11 of 16 , Aug 20, 2007
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                          Tom: For whatever reason. Probably my own "old fart" brain, I never understood you to offer holding a meeting. My bad and sorry.
                          Dennis: In the beginning, I wanted the club to be about listening to music, not gear necessarily. That seemed to tick off several folks in one of my early meetings.
                          Frank: You are correct sir. The club rule has always been... the host decides on the format. Music, gear, selling/swapping, whatever. After all, it's his (or her) house. The host makes the rules.
                          Group: Hey, I've got dialog flowing now!
                          Group: This group was meant to be about vinyl, CD and all other formats!  Listening and sharing music.
                           
                               I've learned a lot since I started the club.
                          One: With 31 people in your house, it's not about the music any more. Plus the cat was crazy for weeks. Two of those was enough.
                          Two: For several months, I asked for people to have a meeting and all I got was dead silence in this group. Except finally for Frank and Russ. Maybe that's when things started to go sour. At least for me.
                          Three: For me, 10 or less at a meeting is as much as my house can hold and still be about the music. One reason I asked members to hold smaller gatherings and report on new music, etc.  That never happened.
                          Four: I'm old and tired and am willing to turn over or share the group with one or more younger leaders who want to try new ideas and things.
                            jim...
                        • jktdet
                          Jim, I am old too. I really guys like Blair and the others will help. Thanks for bringing up Frank... he was the guy who hosted the last two meets I went to. I
                          Message 12 of 16 , Aug 20, 2007
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                            Jim,

                            I am old too. I really guys like Blair and the others will help.
                            Thanks for bringing up Frank... he was the guy who hosted the last two
                            meets I went to. I like the music aspect... heck I would probably not
                            know who Katie Melua was had I not attended one of these meetings. I
                            use her cds to voice crossovers with. I like the technical side too
                            but I mostly just enjoy people who want to save stereo hifi and
                            realize that ipods are great for airplanes and basically nothing else.

                            I would love to host a meeting and hope you are up to attending.

                            Dave
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