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Turk. qaghan (was Re: [tied] god)

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  • wtsdv
    I once read somewhere that the Turkish words for rulers qaghan and qatun were from this same *sva- by way of Iranian *xva-. Does anybody know if this is
    Message 1 of 20 , Jun 30, 2002
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      I once read somewhere that the Turkish words for rulers
      'qaghan' and 'qatun' were from this same *sva- by way
      of Iranian *xva-. Does anybody know if this is true?

      David

      --- In cybalist@y..., Piotr Gasiorowski <piotr.gasiorowski@i...>
      wrote:
      > Pavel has already explained that. An Old Indo-Aryan cognate
      > is <sva-tavas-> 'powerful' (lit. 'self-strong').
      >
      > Piotr
    • richardwordingham
      ... the list some time ago, also in response to Dr Kalyanaraman s query, so I just wonder why he should ask twice only to get the same answers. It s far less
      Message 2 of 20 , Jul 1 5:43 AM
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        --- In cybalist@y..., Piotr Gasiorowski <piotr.gasiorowski@i...>
        wrote:
        > You're right of course, Peter, but we discussed the <il.-> root on
        the list some time ago, also in response to Dr Kalyanaraman's query,
        so I just wonder why he should ask twice only to get the same
        answers. It's far less trouble to check the archives.
        >
        > Piotr

        Alas, he would have had to search his own memory, unless you know a
        good way to search the archives. I searched for 'il.-' and only
        found 'NACHRICHTEN DER AKADEMIE DER WISSENSCHAFTEN IN
        GOETTINGEN. Phil.-hist. Klasse'. My search for 'allah' (lowercase
        because few subscribers enjoy the luxury of an English spell-checker)
        yielded many instances of Allahabad and Sammallahti. The only
        reference to 'Allah' I found was in a discussion of creation myths.

        I searched via the 'search' button while reading the list archive.
        If anyone knows a better way, please advise! I myself have already
        asked about labiovelars because I did not find an earlier discussion
        which had addressed their articulatory realisation.

        Richard.
      • Pavel Lurje
        Dear Danny, In Avestan and OPers. the chief word for god is baga-, from the OIndian root bhag- to divide, separate . Thus, the god is one who gives baxta-,
        Message 3 of 20 , Jul 1 12:16 PM
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          Dear Danny,
           
          In Avestan and OPers. the chief word for 'god' is baga-, from the OIndian root bhag- 'to divide, separate'. Thus, the god is one who gives baxta-, i.e. 'fortune'. Thiss word might have circulated amoung the Scythians as well. Russian bog 'god' is an Iranian, resp. Scytho-sarmatian loan.  
          The other word for 'god' was yazata-, it is the one worthy of homage (root yaz- 'to pay homage')
          IE *deiuos, Ind. Deva- doesn't work within Iranians.It's ancestor, OIr. daiva-, New Pers. Dew/Diw is an evil creature, a kind of devil, their leader is Anghra-mainyu, the one opposing Ahura Mazda, a positive highest god.
           
          Regards, PL.  
          ----- Original Message -----
          Sent: Sunday, June 30, 2002 5:41 AM
          Subject: Re: [tied] god

          It's related to Modern Persian |xodâ|, which is found in Urdu as |xudâ|. I don't think it's cognate with the Germanic word. (Both Persian |xodâ| and the Arabic loan |?allâh| are used interchangeably, with the latter being a more "sacred" usage than the former.)
           
          What's the Old Persian/Avestan word, by the way?
           
          ~Danny~
          While on the Subject, can someone explain 'Ghuda' as a Word for God in Punjabi?
           
          Carl

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        • kalyan97
          ... English god and German Gott came from IE *gheu(@)-, to call, invoke , suffixed zero-grade form *ghu-to-, the invoked (one) . Pokorny s root is
          Message 4 of 20 , Jul 1 7:07 PM
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            --- In cybalist@y..., "Danny Wier" <dawier@h...> wrote:
            > According to the American Heritage Dictionary (online):
            English "god" and German "Gott" came from IE *gheu(@)-, "to call,
            invoke", suffixed zero-grade form *ghu-to-, "the invoked (one)".
            Pokorny's root is *g^hau- (#413). ~DaW~

            Thanks a lot, Danny. God has complex roots in the mists of language!

            Could the IE *gheu- be cognate with Vedic.

            hve- (a phoneme which occurs in a score of Sanskrit lexemes, e.g.
            hava_mahe, juhve...)> hve = to call , call upon , summon ,
            challenge , invoke (R.gveda).

            In Tamil, the root is iku- as in: iku-ttal = to call, invite.
          • Cristian Mocanu
            AFAIK, bog occurs in all Slavic languages-including of course Old Church Slavonic-not just in Russian. So it would be a safe assumption that Common Slavic
            Message 5 of 20 , Jul 3 9:46 PM
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                  AFAIK, "bog" occurs in all Slavic languages-including of course Old Church Slavonic-not just in Russian. So it would be a safe assumption that Common Slavic borrowed it from Iranian. Just a minor correction.
                                                              Regards,
                                                               Cristian
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