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Re: [XTalk] Paul's Gnosticism (and Jesus?)

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  • Matthew Estrada
    Out of curiosity, why is Paul thought to have had little 1st century influence? Matt Estrada ... Il ne matter pas. The question is how much influence on Paul
    Message 1 of 34 , May 2, 2002
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      Out of curiosity, why is Paul thought to have had little 1st century influence?
      Matt Estrada
      >And,
      >as an aside, I seriously wonder about the 1st century influence the
      >historical Paul actually had?

      Il ne matter pas. The question is how much influence on Paul the HJ
      (mediated through the earliest "Christians," of course) might have had. I
      tend to agree that Paul's influence in 1C was VERY limited. But he is
      himself a 1C thinker, and so may tell us something about those who
      influenced HIM.





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    • Richard Anderson
      David Friedman wrote: Richard has actually written a paper on this subject. He makes some good points, [thank you] . . . . If Luke was following Josephus by
      Message 34 of 34 , May 12, 2002
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        David Friedman wrote:

        Richard has actually written a paper on this subject. He makes some good
        points, [thank you] . . . .

        If Luke was following Josephus by writing an apology dedicated to a patron
        that would make it more likely that Theophilus was a literary creation.

        Notice that "most excellent" connected to a Roman governor. That makes it
        inconceivable that Theophilus was meant to be a Jew.
        . . .
        I don't think so. Isaiah mentions vicarious atonement.

        Theophilus as the HP is the highest ranking Jewish official in Judea but he
        is nonetheless a Roman appointee; consequently Luke has correctly addressed
        him.

        There is no evidence that Luke is dependent upon Josephus or that Josephus
        is dependent on Luke. It is more likely, according to Gary Goldberg who has
        written on this subject, that Luke and Josephus are using a common source.
        See http://members.aol.com/FLJOSEPHUS/home.htm

        Isaiah does has vicarious atonement according to most scholars (Whybray has
        a strong dissent in JSOT) but only in the Hebrew MT; there is no vicarious
        atonement in the Greek Septuagint and Luke quotes the Septuagint.

        Richard H. Anderson
        Wallingford PA
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