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Re: Friends of Caesar

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  • RSBrenchley@aol.com
    Russ Conte wrote:
    Message 1 of 5 , Dec 1, 2000
      Russ Conte wrote:

      <<<<The "friend of Caesar" is absolutely historical, check out Suetonius,
      Tiberius, xlvi. For want of a better way to say it, there really was a
      "friend of Caesar" club. When the crowd threatened Pilate by going over
      his head to Caesar, Pilate caved in. Quite a number of other details are
      in the trial, for those who read the accounts closely and are familiar
      with Roman history of the first century.>>

      Quite right, I believe Herod the Great was a member (some
      recommendation!). Was Pilate? I don't have a copy of Suetonius to hand, but I
      seem to remember that Pilate was appointed by Sejanus, not personally by
      Claudius. Or maybe my memory is playing tricks.>>

      Sorry, I meant Tiberius.

      Regards,

      Robert Brenchley

      RSBrenchley@...
    • David C. Hindley
      ... of Caesar club] (some recommendation!). Was Pilate? I don t have a copy of Suetonius to hand, but I seem to remember that Pilate was appointed by Sejanus,
      Message 2 of 5 , Dec 1, 2000
        Robert Brenchley said:

        >>Quite right, I believe Herod the Great was a member [of the "Friends
        of Caesar" club] (some recommendation!). Was Pilate? I don't have a
        copy of Suetonius to hand, but I seem to remember that Pilate was
        appointed by Sejanus, not personally by [Tiberius]. Or maybe my memory
        is playing tricks.>>

        He was so appointed, but as an Equestrian rank governor over a
        third-rate province, I doubt he was ever publicly assigned such an
        honor. If I am not mistaken, was not the title "friend of Caesar"
        something to be assigned to client kings and princes in the buffer
        states, and not to individual Romans? It would sort of be like
        "Favored Nation Status" for a nation that does business with the USA.
        What the author of the Gospel of John meant by this kind of phrase was
        anyone's guess, but I would think it was intended to have a sense sort
        of like Caesar's mythical speech "friends, Romans, countrymen..."

        Regards,

        Dave Hindley
        Cleveland, Ohio, USA
      • Lorna Wilson
        Robert, Dave, See Raymond Brown s commentary on 4G for explanation of phrase friend of Caesar. Lorna Wilson ...
        Message 3 of 5 , Dec 1, 2000
          Robert,
          Dave,

          See Raymond Brown's commentary on 4G for explanation of phrase "friend of
          Caesar."

          Lorna Wilson

          >
          >Robert Brenchley said:
          >
          > >>Quite right, I believe Herod the Great was a member [of the "Friends
          >of Caesar" club] (some recommendation!). Was Pilate? I don't have a
          >copy of Suetonius to hand, but I seem to remember that Pilate was
          >appointed by Sejanus, not personally by [Tiberius]. Or maybe my memory
          >is playing tricks.>>
          >
          Dave Hindley said:

          >He was so appointed, but as an Equestrian rank governor over a
          >third-rate province, I doubt he was ever publicly assigned such an
          >honor. If I am not mistaken, was not the title "friend of Caesar"
          >something to be assigned to client kings and princes in the buffer
          >states, and not to individual Romans? It would sort of be like
          >"Favored Nation Status" for a nation that does business with the USA.
          >What the author of the Gospel of John meant by this kind of phrase was
          >anyone's guess, but I would think it was intended to have a sense sort
          >of like Caesar's mythical speech "friends, Romans, countrymen..."
          >
          >

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        • Richard Anderson
          Josephus has a brief discussion oh Herod as firend of caesar. Caesar said that one was safer being Herod s pig than Herod s son. Josephus records in
          Message 4 of 5 , Dec 2, 2000
            Josephus has a brief discussion oh Herod as firend of caesar.
            Caesar said that one was safer being Herod's pig than Herod's son.
            Josephus records in Antiquities of the Jews, XVI, ix 3; Book 16, section 286
            that Augustus was furious with Herod in 8 BCE and threatened to treat him no
            longer as a friend (Client), but as a subject (subject to taxes). Josephus
            stated that Augustus wrote to Herod. The sum of his epistle was this, that
            whereas of old he had used him as his friend, he should now use him as his
            subject.
            Richard H. Anderson
            Wallingford PA
            http://www.geocities.com/gospelofluke
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