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[crosstalk2] Re: John 19:26

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  • Tom Simms
    On Mon, 24 May 1999 19:26:34 -0500, miser17@epix.net writes: Well, this may be just another case of text-crunching but it sure helps Jan s case.
    Message 1 of 6 , May 24, 1999
      On Mon, 24 May 1999 19:26:34 -0500, miser17@... writes:

      Well, this may be just another case of text-crunching but it sure
      helps Jan's case.

      Thanks, Steve

      Tom Simms
      >
      >
      >> By the way, if Jn 19.26 refers to 4 women, then a least 3 of them are named
      >> Mary. That's strange. And the previous chapters have been extolling
      >> (another?) Mary, sister of Martha (variant from same root), sister of
      >> resurrected Lazarus. Hmmm. She's Mary the anointer of Jesus' feet. Wish you
      >> or someone could explain why all the women in John seem to have the same 1st
      >> name. I'll bet the answer lies in etymology of the Hebrew form of her name.
      >> Jon
      >
      >Two more things to worry about:
      >
      >Gospel of Philip:
      >
      > There were three who always walked with the Lord: Mary,
      >his mother, and her sister, and Magdalene, the one
      > who was called his companion. His sister and his mother and
      >his companion were each a Mary.
      >
      >Jan's idea has second century support through this. [I don't think
      >anybody's mentioned it yet... if so I apologize for not noticing].
      >===================
      >
      >Gospel of Mark:
      >
      >15:40Some women were watching from a distance. Among them were
      >Mary Magdalene, Mary the mother of James the younger and of
      >Joses, and Salome.
      >
      >15:47Mary Magdalene and Mary the mother of Joses saw where he
      >was laid.
      >
      >16:1 When the Sabbath was over, Mary Magdalene, Mary the mother of
      >James, and Salome bought spices so that they might go to anoint
      >Jesus' body.
      >================
      >
      >Mary mother of James the younger and Joses
      > Joses
      > James
      >
      >Mark 6:3 Isn't this Mary's son and the brother of James, Joses, Judas
      >and Simon? Aren't his sisters here with us?"
      >
      >=================
      >
      >So.... questions. James the younger what? Surely can't refer
      >to the "James and John" duo, for Mark almost always mentions
      >them together, and Joses has nothing to do with them. Mt has
      >their mom present... but that's another story.
      >
      >Maybe its James the younger of the two Jameses, bar Zebedee
      >and bar Alphaeus. Or it's James the younger, second brother,
      >after Jesus, also brother of Joses. If it's bar Alphaeus then where
      >does Joses suddenly come from? Mark expects his readers to
      >recognize the name. Where has Mark given us a Mary mother
      >of James and Joses before? Only one Joses has been mentioned.
      >
      >Mary mother of James and Joses is the BVM.
      >Actually, according to Mark, there would be two of "Mary mother
      >of James and Joses" and that seems a bit much to ask. One
      >the BVM and the other just some dame who shows up out of
      >nowhere.
      >
      >My hunch is that Mark knows of a Mary mother of Jesus (and James
      >and Joses and Simon and sisters) at the cross (cf. GJohn) and
      >isn't going to give her credit (he's already constructed a story
      >where she thinks Jesus is possessed) so her matronly identity
      >is suppressed, but not eliminated, giving Markan readers a way of
      >understanding how it could be that other Xians think Mary mother of
      >Jesus and James and Joses was present. NO, Mark suggests,
      >rather it is some other Mary mother of some other James and some
      >other Joses.
      >
      >Steve
      >
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