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Re: [XTalk] Judas and the sicarii ?

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  • Gary Greenberg
    John indicates that Iscariot was a family name of some sort and that Judas’ father Simon was also an Iscariot. It seems unlikely that multiple family members
    Message 1 of 15 , Feb 10, 2012
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      John indicates that Iscariot was a family name of some sort and that Judas’ father Simon was also an Iscariot. It seems unlikely that multiple family members would publicly be known by the same anti-Roman, and Herod or Pilate wouldn’t crack down. And how likely is it that a member of a family bitterly opposed to collaboration with the Romans would go to the Sadducee collaborators and work out a deal to betray a religious teacher who urges his followers to accept Pharisee teachings (per Matthew.)

      Gary
      Gary Greenberg
      Web site: Bible Myth and History

      Author of the following books

      101 Myths of the Bible
      The Moses Mystery
      The Judas Brief
      King David Versus Israel
      Who Wrote the Gospels?
      Manetho: A Study in Egyptian Chronology

      From: Dennis Goffin
      Sent: Friday, February 10, 2012 10:02 AM
      To: crosstalk2@yahoogroups.com
      Subject: RE: [XTalk] Judas and the sicarii ?


      Thanks to David, we have established that sicarius does exist in transliterated Greek form from the time of Acts and the writings of Josephus, which I would judge to be approximately contemporary. Greek, however was not the earliest language in which anecdotes of Jesus and his followers were told. I submit therefore that it is unnecessary to require proof of the Greek word's existence at the time of Jesus. Peter's nickname Cephas was after all Aramaic. All that is rquired is to be able to accept that Judah's nickname in Aramaic, among his companions was something like "the blade" for this to be taken over into earlier accounts which finally were subsumed into the Gospels we have. The desire not to upset the Romans, as in the case of "zealot" would have been sufficient motive for the subsequent obfuscation.
      Dennis--------------------Dennis GoffinChorleywood UK
      To: mailto:crosstalk2%40yahoogroups.com
      From: mailto:D.Mealand%40ed.ac.uk
      Date: Fri, 10 Feb 2012 12:37:59 +0000
      Subject: RE: [XTalk] Judas and the sicarii ?

      Sicarius was used in latin to refer to an assassin

      (sica being a curved dagger). The term was used

      in latin at least as early as Cicero, so 1st C BCE.

      It appears in Greek in Acts 21.38 and in Josephus

      with reference to the troubles in the time of Felix

      and Festus i.e. after 52 CE, around 20 years or so

      after the demise of Judas.

      Does anyone have to hand the earliest instance of

      the use of this latin loan word in Greek? Does someone

      have a pre-Neronian example? That would seem to be

      a relevant piece of evidence which might either support

      or tend to disconfirm some of the assumptions behind

      the discussion.

      David M.

      ---------

      David Mealand, University of Edinburgh

      --

      The University of Edinburgh is a charitable body, registered in

      Scotland, with registration number SC005336.



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