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Re: [XTalk] The Jesus movement before the NT

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  • Jack Kilmon
    ... From: Ronald Price Sent: Friday, December 02, 2011 1:22 PM To: CrossTalk Subject: Re: [XTalk] The Jesus movement before the NT JK: -- ..... All three
    Message 1 of 73 , Dec 2, 2011
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      -----Original Message-----
      From: Ronald Price
      Sent: Friday, December 02, 2011 1:22 PM
      To: CrossTalk
      Subject: Re: [XTalk] The Jesus movement before the NT

      JK: -->
      ..... All three Ya'qubs are contemporaries, and relatives, of
      Jesus. I do not include the Ya'qub that was, perhaps, his grandfather. The
      author of Matthew may have had information from family members who were
      active in the 1st century. I accept as evidence that the Matthean genealogy
      may have been correct for the first three generations, at least, his
      patrilear brother and cousin named Ya'qub (that's two) and his cousin Ya'qub
      Zebedee (that's three).

      RP: -->
      So now I'm a step closer to understanding what you're claiming, but I¹m
      still unsure about the evidence that these two men called James were the
      cousins of Jesus.

      - - - - - - - - - -

      Let's start with Ya'qub Bar Zebediy or "James the Greater"

      Mark 16:1 And when the sabbath was past, Mary Magdalene, and Mary the
      [mother] of James, and Salome, had bought sweet spices, that they might come
      and anoint him.

      John 19:25 writes it as ....Now there stood by the cross of Jesus his
      mother, and his mother's sister, Mary the [wife] of Cleophas, and Mary
      Magdalene. ...

      The parallel quotes identifies Salome as the wife of Zebedee and mother of
      James and John and John calls her the sister of Jesus' mother. This makes
      James and John Bar Zebedee cousins and makes more sense of the Zebedee
      brothers' request of Jesus at Mt. 20:20

      Both Ya'qub "James the Lesser" amd Levi (Matthew) are the sons of
      Alphaeus/Clopas (Mt, 10:3; Mk 2:14, 3:18) the husband of the "other Mary"
      and identified by Papias and Hegesippus as the brother of Joseph.

      This makes sense since these women/aunts travel with Jesus and his mother
      and are present at the crucifixion. It was they who were to spice and
      anoint the corpse in preparation, a job performed by female members of the
      family.

      This is also supported by Jesus' brother being succeeded by another son of
      Alphaeus, Shymeon, another cousin and his successors were also members of
      the Desposyni

      Jack Kilmon
      Houston, TX
    • David Mealand
      This topic ran for a while back in January. I have just seen a review of a book on Philo which gives particular attention to Philo s use of some passages from
      Message 73 of 73 , Feb 16, 2012
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        This topic ran for a while back in January.

        I have just seen a review of a book on Philo
        which gives particular attention to Philo's
        use of some passages from the haftarot which, it is
        argued, match part of a later cycle of such readings.
        Naomi Cohen, Philo's Scriptures ... (Brill 2007) is
        the book, and a very interesting and detailed review
        of it by Tzvee Zahavy is in Review of Rabbinic
        Judaism 15 (2012) 133-136.

        David M.







        ---------
        David Mealand, University of Edinburgh


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