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bw III on the James Ossuary- Holding firm in the face of all contrary evidence!

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  • Jim West
    *Following is an interview with Ben Witherington- the whole of which can be read here: * * * *http://www.midbible.ac.uk/content/view/130/ * * * * * *Before we
    Message 1 of 4 , Apr 3, 2008
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      *Following is an interview with Ben Witherington- the whole of which can
      be read here:
      *

      *
      *

      *http://www.midbible.ac.uk/content/view/130/
      *

      *
      *

      *

      *

      *Before we finish, I'd like to spend some time talking about the James
      Ossuary. For the benefit of those who don't know, perhaps you could
      briefly describe what this controversy and debate is about?*

      The James Ossuary is a burial box and it has an inscription on it that
      says "James son of Joseph, his brother is Jesus." All who have examined
      the inscription found it to be genuine and so do I. Right now, it's
      embroiled in the controversy surrounding the trial of its owner, Oded
      Golan, so were waiting to see how that turns out.

      *Haven't the Israel Antiquities Authority declared it to be a fake?*

      Well let's be clear about this. First of all, the Israel Antiquities
      /team/ that first investigated it declared it to be authentic. Secondly,
      the chief epigrapher of the IAA again said in January [2008] that it was
      authentic. People who are saying it's inauthentic would be the head of
      the IAA, Yuval Goran, and Shuka Dorfmann. So it's not every one in the
      IAA and those who are most expert on inscription say it's genuine,
      including those who work for the IAA.

      *It would appear that among the popular press at the least, the majority
      consider it to be a fraud. Are you saying that view is wrong?*

      Absolutely but I don't think that is the majority opinion of the press.
      I continue to be asked about this by the BBC, NBC, ABC, CBS and others.
      Their response to the Jesus Ossuary has been very different to, say, the
      Talpiot Tomb (the so-called burial tomb of Jesus). The media has come to
      the conclusion that the Talpiot Tomb discussion is not worth continuing
      because the evidence is so strongly against it being the tomb. But the
      issue of the James Ossuary is that ever since the beginning in 2001, so
      many heavyweight scholars from all kinds of different persuasions have
      weighed in and said it was a genuine ossuary with a genuine inscription.

      *Do you think there's a political aspect to the IAA and their
      declaration of the ossuary being fake?*

      There's no question there is. The IAA have a genuine concern with forged
      and stolen antiquities and I understand that. But the way to deal with
      those concerns is not to declare any unprovenanced artefact as a fake or
      forgery.

      *The Geological Survey of Israel have also declared it to be fake too
      though.*

      Well, the GSI is a subheading under the IAA and their two leading
      experts both claimed it was genuine to start with. Under pressure, they
      were forced to retract what they said but they did not repudiate their
      findings. Now that's a whole different ball game. It's one thing to talk
      about a retraction; it's another thing to talk about the repudiation.

      *Do you think there will be a resolution on this within the next few
      years?*

      Yes I would say there will be some resolution, but let me say why this
      is such an important issue. The James Ossuary is an indirect testimony
      to the resurrection of Jesus. The reason I say that is you don't brag
      about being related to Jesus if the last thing that happened to him was
      that he died on a cross – that was the most shocking way to die in
      antiquity. So the fact that this ossuary reads, "Jesus the son of
      Joseph, his brother is Jesus" is very clear that this person is claiming
      to be related to Jesus and he wouldn't be claiming that if Jesus died on
      the cross and there was no resurrection.

      * *Finally, d*o you think that this has anything to do with the IAA
      claiming that the James Ossuary is fake?*

      Of course! In fact, Shuka Dorfmann said as much when he said, "we don't
      want this ossuary used for a fundamentalist Christian agenda."

      --
      ++++++

      Jim West, ThD

      http://jwest.wordpress.com -- Blog
      http://drjewest.googlepages.com - Biblical Studies Resources
    • Jack Kilmon
      ... From: Jim West To: ; Sent: Thursday, April 03, 2008 10:13 AM Subject:
      Message 2 of 4 , Apr 3, 2008
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        ----- Original Message -----
        From: "Jim West" <jwest@...>
        To: <biblical-studies@yahoogroups.com>; <crosstalk2@yahoogroups.com>
        Sent: Thursday, April 03, 2008 10:13 AM
        Subject: [XTalk] bw III on the James Ossuary- Holding firm in the face of
        all contrary evidence!


        > *Following is an interview with Ben Witherington- the whole of which can
        > be read here:
        > *
        >
        > *
        > *
        >
        > *http://www.midbible.ac.uk/content/view/130/
        > *
        >

        >
        > Yes I would say there will be some resolution, but let me say why this
        > is such an important issue. The James Ossuary is an indirect testimony
        > to the resurrection of Jesus. The reason I say that is you don't brag
        > about being related to Jesus if the last thing that happened to him was
        > that he died on a cross – that was the most shocking way to die in
        > antiquity. So the fact that this ossuary reads, "Jesus the son of
        > Joseph, his brother is Jesus" is very clear that this person is claiming
        > to be related to Jesus and he wouldn't be claiming that if Jesus died on
        > the cross and there was no resurrection.


        I do not read the Aramaic as above. I read "Yaqub, son of Yahosef, brother
        (of him) OF Yeshua."


        shlama

        Jack Kilmon
      • Jim West
        ... -- ++++++ Jim West, ThD http://jwest.wordpress.com -- Blog http://drjewest.googlepages.com - Biblical Studies Resources
        Message 3 of 4 , Apr 3, 2008
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          Jack Kilmon wrote:
          > ----- Original Message -----
          > From: "Jim West" <jwest@...>
          > To: <biblical-studies@yahoogroups.com>; <crosstalk2@yahoogroups.com>
          > Sent: Thursday, April 03, 2008 10:13 AM
          > Subject: [XTalk] bw III on the James Ossuary- Holding firm in the face of
          > all contrary evidence!
          >
          >
          >
          >> *Following is an interview with Ben Witherington- the whole of which can
          >> be read here:
          >> *
          >>
          >> *
          >> *
          >>
          >> *http://www.midbible.ac.uk/content/view/130/
          >> *
          >>
          >>
          >
          >
          >> Yes I would say there will be some resolution, but let me say why this
          >> is such an important issue. The James Ossuary is an indirect testimony
          >> to the resurrection of Jesus. The reason I say that is you don't brag
          >> about being related to Jesus if the last thing that happened to him was
          >> that he died on a cross – that was the most shocking way to die in
          >> antiquity. So the fact that this ossuary reads, "Jesus the son of
          >> Joseph, his brother is Jesus" is very clear that this person is claiming
          >> to be related to Jesus and he wouldn't be claiming that if Jesus died on
          >> the cross and there was no resurrection.
          >>
          >
          >
          > I do not read the Aramaic as above. I read "Yaqub, son of Yahosef, brother
          > (of him) OF Yeshua."
          >
          >
          > shlama
          >
          > Jack Kilmon
          >
          >
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          --
          ++++++

          Jim West, ThD

          http://jwest.wordpress.com -- Blog
          http://drjewest.googlepages.com - Biblical Studies Resources
        • James Crossley
          According to the Witherington interview: ...but let me say why this is such an important issue. The James Ossuary is an indirect testimony to the resurrection
          Message 4 of 4 , Apr 3, 2008
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            According to the Witherington interview:
            '...but let me say why this is such an important
            issue. The James Ossuary is an indirect testimony to
            the resurrection of Jesus. The reason I say that is
            you don't brag about being related to Jesus if the
            last thing that happened to him was that he died on a
            cross – that was the most shocking way to die in
            antiquity. So the fact that this ossuary reads, "Jesus
            the son of Joseph, his brother is Jesus" is very
            clear that this person is claiming to be related to
            Jesus and he wouldn't be claiming that if Jesus died
            on the cross and there was no resurrection.'

            I would have thought that all this line of thought
            could possibly prove is that people *believed* Jesus
            was resurrected. But then we know that anyway. If we
            take Witherington's logic one step further, the
            earliest Christian literature would not be making such
            claims about if there was no resurrection, right? If I
            am being fair, then that would be some leap of logic.

            James Crossley
            Dept of Biblical Studies
            University of Sheffield, UK


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