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Re: Messiah in 1st Century

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  • rit2506
    ... Thanks Mike for pointing me in a couple of directions. I am still not content with this. Does anyone know of any figure called messiah besides Jesus
    Message 1 of 5 , Aug 3, 2006
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      --- In crosstalk2@yahoogroups.com, "Mike Grondin" <mwgrondin@...> wrote:
      >
      > --- David Ritsema wrote:
      > > A number of so-called "messianic claimants" are
      > > frequently sited. But I have so far not found any
      > > specific reference to these claimants as actually
      > > described as "messiah." Does anyone know of any
      > > other figure in the first-century who was called
      > > messiah except for Jesus?
      >
      > I've had this same question myself, David. In RSG
      > Wright speaks vaguely of "messianic movements
      > between roughly 150 BC and AD 150" (p.700), and
      > certainly counts Simon bar-Giora as a "would-be
      > messiah" (p.558), but the only other one I can
      > find mention of in RSG is Bar-Kochba, who seems
      > to have been the first explicitly declared so
      > that we have record of. Maybe there's more in JVG,
      > but I don't have that. In any case, I think you're
      > right that folks talk about "messsianic claimants"
      > in a general way to designate anyone who initiated
      > any kind of independence movement, without regard
      > to whether that person had been anointed and/or
      > declared a 'messiah'.
      >
      > Regards,
      > Mike Grondin
      >

      Thanks Mike for pointing me in a couple of directions. I am still not
      content with this. Does anyone know of any figure called "messiah"
      besides Jesus actually in the first century world?

      Any suggestions on where to turn to find out such answer?

      David Ritsema
      PhD New Testament (Student)
      B. H. Carroll Theological Institute
      http://davidritsema.wordpress.com
    • RSBrenchley@aol.com
      Message 2 of 5 , Aug 5, 2006
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        <<Thanks Mike for pointing me in a couple of directions. I am still not
        content with this. Does anyone know of any figure called "messiah"
        besides Jesus actually in the first century world?

        Any suggestions on where to turn to find out such answer?

        David Ritsema>>


        Josephus uses the term of Vespasian, but he's not exactly reliable as an
        indicator of Jewish belief in the matter! Most likely some of the rebel leaders
        he wrote claimed Messiahship, or had it claimed for them by others, but in
        their case he avoids using it, probably deliberately. Bar Cochba was, of
        course, declared to be the Messiah by Akiva, but that may be too late for your
        needs.

        Regards,

        Robert Brenchley



        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • Bob Schacht
        ... If this discussion of Messiah in 1st Century sounds familiar and gives you that feeling of deja vu, it should. David Ritsema asked the same question on
        Message 3 of 5 , Aug 5, 2006
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          At 12:59 PM 8/5/2006, RSBrenchley@... wrote:


          ><<Thanks Mike for pointing me in a couple of directions. I am still not
          >content with this. Does anyone know of any figure called "messiah"
          >besides Jesus actually in the first century world?
          >
          >Any suggestions on where to turn to find out such answer?
          >
          >David Ritsema>>

          If this discussion of "Messiah in 1st Century" sounds familiar and gives
          you that feeling of deja vu, it should. David Ritsema asked the same
          question on July 7, and got a number of responses over the next day. The
          thread is available in the archives, beginning at
          http://groups.yahoo.com/group/crosstalk2/message/21370

          Some questions do tend to come up over and over again. But it is
          disingenuous to pretend that your question is new. So if a thread ends
          leaving you unsatisfied, and you want to bring it up again, the appropriate
          thing to do, when raising the question again, is to recap the previous
          thread in such a way that carries the discussion forward, rather than
          recycling the same old same old.

          Posters who bring up the same question over and over again, as if for the
          first time, or repeating only the same arguments, without carrying the
          discussion forward into new territory, are likely to get labelled as
          "Johnny One-Notes" and to be put on moderated status so that we can block
          repetitious threads that go nowhere.

          Bob Schacht
          Assistant Moderator




          >Josephus uses the term of Vespasian, but he's not exactly reliable as an
          >indicator of Jewish belief in the matter! Most likely some of the rebel
          >leaders
          >he wrote claimed Messiahship, or had it claimed for them by others, but in
          >their case he avoids using it, probably deliberately. Bar Cochba was, of
          >course, declared to be the Messiah by Akiva, but that may be too late for
          >your
          >needs.
          >
          >Regards,
          >
          >Robert Brenchley
          >
          >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          >
          >


          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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