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Re: [XTalk] 4Q521 and Luke

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  • Brian Trafford
    ... Well, the texts I cite tell us directly that the dead will be resurrected, and that this will come at the end of human history (commonly understood in
    Message 1 of 76 , Dec 3, 2003
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      --- In crosstalk2@yahoogroups.com, Bob Schacht <bobschacht@i...>
      wrote:
      >What Wise, Abegg&Cook say about 4Q521,after quoting Matthew 11:2-5,
      >is this (p.420):
      >"This account of Jesus' response to the Baptist (see also Luke 7:22)
      >parallels the Dead Sea Scrolls' [4Q521] in a remarkable way. Both
      >the Gospels and this scroll presuppose that during the age of the
      >messiah, the dead will be resurrected, either by God himself or
      >through his messianic agent. Yet nowhere in the Old Testament do we
      >read of this belief."
      >
      >Evidently, they see important differences in the OT texts you cite
      >when compared with these later sources.

      Well, the texts I cite tell us directly that the dead will be
      resurrected, and that this will come at the end of human history
      (commonly understood in Judaism as the dawn of the Messianic Age).

      Daniel 12:1-3
      "At that time Michael, the great prince who protects your people,
      will arise. There will be a time of distress such as has not happened
      from the beginning of nations until then. But at that time your
      people-everyone whose name is found written in the book-will be
      delivered. Multitudes who sleep in the dust of the earth will awake:
      some to everlasting life, others to shame and everlasting contempt.
      Those who are wise will shine like the brightness of the heavens, and
      those who lead many to righteousness, like the stars for ever and
      ever.

      Isaiah 26:1, 19, 21
      In that day this song will be sung in the land of Judah:
      We have a strong city;
      God makes salvation
      its walls and ramparts.
      ...But your dead will live;
      their bodies will rise.
      You who dwell in the dust,
      wake up and shout for joy.
      Your dew is like the dew of the morning;
      the earth will give birth to her dead.
      ...See, the LORD is coming out of his dwelling
      to punish the people of the earth for their sins.
      The earth will disclose the blood shed upon her;
      she will conceal her slain no longer.

      These do look like clear statements of resurrection on the "last
      day". In fact, to me they look very close to the expectations for
      the end times we find in both the Synoptics, and in Paul. Why do
      Wise & Co. think that they are not clear?

      Also, do they (or anyone else) present the original Greek of 4Q521?

      Thank you,

      Brian Trafford
      Calgary, AB, Canada
    • Ted Weeden
      Dear Listers, I had indicated two weeks ago that I would submit my own response to responses of others re the thread Messiah in spite of himself in an
      Message 76 of 76 , Dec 18, 2003
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        Dear Listers,

        I had indicated two weeks ago that I would submit my own response to
        responses of others re the thread "Messiah in spite of himself" in an
        article which Jeffrey Gibson has offered to upload to the Xtalk articles
        page. With the demand of other matters, it has taken far longer than I had
        envisioned to complete the article. And with the holidays at hand, it
        looks like I cannot get this article out until after the first of the year.
        I plan in the article not only to deal with matters related to the "Messiah"
        thread but also to incorporate in it issues related to the "4Q521" thread
        and the "Gospel of Mary Magdalene" thread, which I had introduced.

        Happy holidays to you all.

        Ted Weeden
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