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Re: [creat] Re: THE MUTATION RATE PARADOX.

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  • randy_crum@datacard.com
    ... Einstein showed that relative time can change depending on differences in the the force of gravity and relative velocity of two bodies. The classic example
    Message 1 of 168 , May 1 7:01 AM
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      >>> vgiovianni: hey, here's a question you will avoid,
      >>> is it possible that time is not steady?

      >> Randy: The reason that I, and probably most
      >> of the other evolutionists, will avoid
      >> talking about this is because it is simply
      >> a hypothetical question with no evidence
      >> to support it.
      >>
      >> Show us some evidence, or at least a mechanism,
      >> and we can talk about it.

      > vgiovianni: On the Nature of Time
      > [snip - discussion of time cut and pasted from
      > the web site http://www.wfu.edu/~brehme/time.htm%5d

      Einstein showed that relative time can change depending on differences in
      the the force of gravity and relative velocity of two bodies.

      The classic example used is sending one of a pair of twin brothers on a
      trip in a space ship moving at a speed close to the speed of light and
      leaving the other brother on Earth. When the space ship returns to Earth,
      the brother on the space ship will have aged less.

      But note that there is a RELATIVE difference in speeds between the two
      brothers. If the brothers had been triplets and two of them had gone on
      the space ship they would have aged the same amount, both less than the
      brother left on Earth.

      You are trying to argue, presumably, that time on Earth has changed. You
      are asking if the measured age of 4.5 billion years couldn't actually be
      something less. The answer to that question is NO! If the Earth was
      moving substantially faster in the past, which could have slowed down time,
      it would have slowed down time for EVERYTHING on Earth, including the
      radioactive decay of the rocks used to determine this age. There are no
      relative differences.

      Randy

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    • randy_crum@datacard.com
      ... This is from a post that is a few weeks old. I wanted to expand on the answer that I gave at that time. Vince clearly feels that these things are evidence
      Message 168 of 168 , May 15 11:17 AM
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        >> vgiovianni: look,

        >> 1. we are the only known intelligent force in the universe.
        >> 2. we have absolute proof of adaptation.
        >> 3. we know we will keep advancing intellectually.
        >> 4. intelligent design does exist we use it everyday.
        >> 5. we will travel into space beyond our solar system.
        >> 6. we currently are working on or have already acheived
        >> the creation of life.
        >> [snip - similar items]

        This is from a post that is a few weeks old. I wanted to expand on the
        answer that I gave at that time.

        Vince clearly feels that these things are evidence that his idea that
        humans will design the universe and all life on Earth. In actuality, they
        aren't.

        These things are all requirements for his ideas to be true. But they do
        not provide evidence that his ideas are true because he doesn't tie them
        together and relate them directly to his claims.

        Let me give an example to make my point. I have previously mentioned a
        couple of times this admittedly ridiculous suggestion:

        Winged pink monkeys will fly out of Saddam Hussein's anatomy if he is
        executed for his crimes against humanity.

        But, using Vince's techniques of argument, I could argue in favor of that
        idea by providing this list:

        1. Monkeys exist
        2. The color pink exists
        3. Winged creaturs exist
        4. Most winged creatures can fly
        5. Saddam Hussein exists
        6. Saddam Hussein has an anatomy
        7. The possibility exists that Saddam Hussein will be executed for crimes
        against humanity.

        So each part of my claim can be shown to exist. But so what? I haven't
        tied them all together. I haven't even demonstrated that there are "winged
        pink monkeys". So I haven't provided ANY real evidence that any such
        monkeys will be doing any flying any time soon.

        That's precisely the problem with vgovianni's "logic". He says that humans
        are capable of designing things. That's accurate. But he hasn't tied that
        piece of information to his overall claim that humans have somehow been
        able to design the universe and all life on Earth. So that particular
        piece of data doesn't really provide ANY evidence supporting his claim.

        So I will continue to say that he has not provided the smallest shred of
        evidence supporting his claims.

        Randy

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