Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.

Re: Albatross

Expand Messages
  • Michael Tong
    ... significance of ... Tin: Conspecifics attend to the behavior of their potential mates. They analyze traits and behaviors for genetic quality. Dances of
    Message 1 of 45 , Nov 1, 2003
    • 0 Attachment
      > Michael: Are you saying that female albatrosses knew the
      significance of
      > the dance before males evolved the ability to dance? What selective
      > advantage would there have been for female albatrosses to evolve an
      > ability to recognize something that did not yet exist?
      >

      Tin: Conspecifics attend to the behavior of their potential mates.
      They analyze traits and behaviors for genetic quality. Dances of
      various types display traits such as size, symmetry, coordination,
      vigor, etc. It is not necessary to evolve a separate gene to analyze
      a particular dance. You seem to think it is. Please correct
      yourself.

      Michael: Are you saying that one gene enables a female animal to
      understand the significance of dances, bowers, chuck calls, songs,
      plumage, and bowers? If this were the case, in the same animal species
      some males would dance, others would sing, others would have ornate
      plumage, and still others would build bowers. In fact, in the same
      species, there would be different types of bowers, dances, songs, and
      plumage.

      I
      > have already proposed the following two hypotheses, either one of
      which
      > if proven true would place great doubt on evolution: (1) All races
      > genetically consider Caucasian physical features attractive. (2)
      Most
      > men worldwide genetically find high heels, makeup, earrings, and
      long,
      > polished fingernails on women attractive.

      Tin: Neither of these make any sense. Strike three. ID is out.

      Michael: Don't just say it doesn't make any sense; explain why it doesn't
      make any sense.

      Note that both hypotheses are
      > testable, unlike evolution, which can't really be tested because of
      the
      > long time required.

      Tin: Please describe your testable hypothesis. So far we don't have
      anything scientific. Make sure you have testable, observable,
      SCIENTIFIC way to evaluate ID. Make sure you contrast it with
      biological evolution. I hope it is better than the silliness
      presented above.

      Michael: Explain what further description you need and why you don't
      think the above hypotheses are scientific?

      Yours truly,
      Michael
    • Michael Tong
      Males of one species ... recognize all ... Tin: No, why would they ? Michael: If females have evolved the ability to recognize a variety of healthy traits,
      Message 45 of 45 , Dec 6, 2003
      • 0 Attachment
        Males of one species
        > display only one trait. If females evolved the ability to
        recognize all
        > healthy traits, then males of one species would display a variety of
        > traits; singing, ornate plumage, bower building, dancing etc.

        Tin: No, why would they ?

        Michael: If females have evolved the ability to recognize a variety of
        healthy traits, then there is nothing to prevent males of one species to
        display a variety of traits, rather than just one.

        > Michael: First you claim that culture would be able to explain why
        all
        > races would find Caucasian physical features attractive.

        Tin: NO. First, you have not demonstrated that all races find
        caucasion physical features (most) attractive. It is almost
        certainly WRONG (in addition to being weird). Thus, the rest of your
        comments fall like a house of cards.

        Michael: You claimed that ID is untestable. I have presented a testable
        hypothesis for ID; that all races find Caucasian physical features
        attractive. It is a hypothesis. If I can already prove it, it wouldn't
        be a hypothesis.

        The point is that if
        > studies show that all races find Caucasian physical features
        attractive,
        > then the reason must be genetics and evolution would be doomed
        because
        > the only explanation would be Intelligent Design.

        Tin: This is your second layer of error. Even if your false claim
        were correct it could still be explained by culture. Your third
        layer of error is that even if it were genetics and not culture there
        is absolutely no reason to indicate that ID would be a better
        explanation than real science like biological evolution.

        Of course the whole scenario is so damn goofy I hate mention the
        serious science of evolution in the same paragraph as this blonde,
        high heels junk. I wish we could get you move into an area that we
        can take more seriously.

        Michael: Okay. Let's assume that all races find Caucasian physical
        features attractive. Now, explain it using culture. Then let us assume
        that all races genetically find Caucasian physical features attractive.
        Explain it using evolution.

        Yours truly,
        Michael
      Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.