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Re:SD | Reply to Thomas

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  • physisvnomos
    ... creation_evolution_debate@yahoogroups.com, stevesommers56 ... creation_evolution_debate@yahoogroups.com, physisvnomos ... have ... fund ... the ... the
    Message 1 of 1016 , Aug 1, 2007
      --- In creation_evolution_debate@yahoogroups.com, "stevesommers56"
      <stevesommers56@...> wrote:
      >
      > --- In creation_evolution_debate@yahoogroups.com, "physisvnomos"
      > <physisvnomos@> wrote:
      > >
      > > --- In
      creation_evolution_debate@yahoogroups.com, "stevesommers56"
      > > <stevesommers56@> wrote:
      > > >
      > > > --- In
      creation_evolution_debate@yahoogroups.com, "physisvnomos"
      > > > <physisvnomos@> wrote:
      > > > >
      > > > > --- In
      > > creation_evolution_debate@yahoogroups.com, "stevesommers56"
      > > > > <stevesommers56@> wrote:
      > > > > >
      > > > > > --- In
      > > creation_evolution_debate@yahoogroups.com, "physisvnomos"
      > > > > > <physisvnomos@> wrote:
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > --- In creation_evolution_debate@yahoogroups.com, "Randy
      > > Crum"
      > > > > > > <randy_crum@> wrote:
      > > > > > > >
      > > > > > > > > Timothy:
      > > > > > > > > What is fairness, Bill?
      > > > > > > > > Why is it fair for a person who earns his keep to
      have
      > > > > > > > > some of it taken away and given to a drunk? What is
      > > > > > > > > fair about that?
      > > > > > > >
      > > > > > > > So a person's compassion can't be directed towards an
      > > > > > > > alcoholic?
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > My comment was not about compassion, but about taking a
      > > man's
      > > > > > money
      > > > > > > against his will and giving it to a drunk.
      > > > > >
      > > > > > Yeah. We should have an all volunteer government. I
      > > personally
      > > > > > hate having my money taken against my will and used to
      fund
      > > > > foreign
      > > > > > invasions and all the whiz-bang technoweapons in the U.S.
      > > > > arsenal.
      > > > > > I'd much rather give it to the homeless, the hungry, and
      the
      > > > > > addicted, but that's just my personal preference.
      > > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > > That it is, and you are free to have it. You can give away
      the
      > > > > remainder of your income to the homeless and comany if you
      are
      > > so
      > > > > inclined.
      > > > >
      > > > > I was asking a question about what is fair to make a point
      > about
      > > > the
      > > > > supposed role of fairness in hauman evolution. No doubt
      > fairness
      > > > is
      > > > > very importannt in evolution, but how we define and
      understand
      > > it
      > > > is
      > > > > also important.
      > > >
      > > > You weren't asking that question in this particular message,
      > > > Timothy. It is pretty obvious that you find it odious that
      > taxes
      > > > are taken from you and given to "drunks." Sarcasm aside, I
      > don't
      > > > think an all volunteer government would work very long and
      > that's
      > > > for very similar reasons as to why pure communism will not
      > work.
      > > >
      > > > You may not like your taxes being taken to give to "drunks",
      but
      > > if
      > > > that consideration is given to you then I am due the same
      > > > consideration as to how I'd like my taxes spent. The only way
      > to
      > > do
      > > > it right is to allow us to voluntarily give the amount that we
      > > would
      > > > like to give to fund the government services/programs we would
      > > > like. That is a prescription for anarchy.
      > > >
      > >
      > > Steve,
      > >
      > > It often happens on this list that I make an argument, sometimes
      > > many time over, to make a point. The whole "taxes to drunks"
      > > argument was first used by me on this thread with reference to
      an
      > > effort to indicate that although Social Darwinism is not in
      > fashion,
      > > it has been defeated by something other than a scientific
      > argument.
      >
      > Okay. Science has its limits. I think we all agree on that.
      >
      > > In any case, I am not all that concerned about drunks being
      given
      > > public funds.
      >
      > Glad to know it.
      >
      > >The program that Mr. Crum posted a reference to I
      > > found rather unfortunate, but when we care only about the body,
      > and
      > > the cost, what is one to expect?
      >
      > What else is there that governmental policy should be concerned
      with?
      >


      That its citizens live well, but this is not simple and much
      injustice has been done in the name of citizens living well.

      Timothy E. Kennelly
    • SH
      ... Tin: Excellent. ... Tin: So you are saying that neither meditation nor prayer are enough ? Tin: Did you find evidence that pra
      Message 1016 of 1016 , Jul 28, 2012
        --- In creation_evolution_debate@yahoogroups.com, "gabevee" <gabevee@...> wrote:
        >
        >
        >
        > --- In creation_evolution_debate@yahoogroups.com, "SH" <tinroad66@> wrote:
        > >
        > [snip]
        > > > >
        > > > > But in answer to your question, it is COMPLETELY silly to
        > > > > believe in prayer. If fact it is more likely to have a
        > > > > negative effect than a positive one/
        > > > >
        > > >
        > > > Interesting. This research goes against much of the psychological community findings.
        > > >
        > > > There seems to be many situations like this, where some studies find positive affects, and some negative. Like our discussion about religion being a positive or negative influence on school and community crime, etc.
        > > >
        > > > I replied to Carol with some references that show much psychological benefits of prayer. I won't waste bandwidth re-posting it here.
        > > >
        > > > Bottom line, when it comes to societal benefits of anything (religion, politics, whatever) it seems one can find support on either side of the issue.
        > > >
        > > > GV
        > > >
        > >
        > >
        > > Tin: I agree that prayer does have some beneficial
        > > physical and mental health benefits. I would however
        > > note that it doesn't seem to matter much which God you
        > > pray to and the benefits are similar in character
        > > to meditation.
        > >
        >
        > And I have mentioned that at least twice. "God notwithstanding" was one phrase I used.
        >
        > Yes, the point is speaking out one's problems leads to awareness of the underlying cause and eventual solution.

        Tin: Excellent.

        >
        > And while the calming stress reducing affect is similar to meditation, when one has problems one needs to work out, meditation is not enough.
        >
        > GV
        >


        Tin: So you are saying that neither meditation nor
        prayer are enough ?





        Tin: Did you find evidence that pra
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