Re: [Covenanted Reformation] Re: Law of Nature
- Dear Frederick,I think the reason one hears non christian men and women make disparaging remarks about women who breastfeed in public is because our culture has so perverted the natural function of breasts so that they are seen to be more a play thing for men than a source of comfort and nourishment for babies. I would be very surprised to hear that they are complaining against Christian women only who breastfeed in public. They are not making disparaging remarks against the Church per se, but against breastfeeding itself. The pressure on women in this regard is such that close to 90% of women who start out breastfeeding are no longer doing so by the time their babies are 3 months old. Thus their little ones are deprived of the means that God designed for their feeding. Compare this to the rest of the world where breastfeeding usually lasts for up to 3 years and sometimes more. I see this as part of the whole anti-baby mentality that our culture has. The current model of beauty is almost androgenous in her lack of curves, and the ripeness of a pregnant body is disdained or only tolerated in limited fashion. Childbearing and all the functions that go with it and sustaining the baby are the real offense to most non Christians, and sadly, even among those that name the Name.By God's grace I have borne 11 children over the last 22 years and nursed them all. Initially it was sheer determination that kept me at it with my first baby in the face of disgust from my mother's generation who all bottlefed because breastfeeding was "disgusting" and bottle feeding didn't "hurt" us. That only lasted for 6 months before my daughter was on a bottle. All my subsequent children have nursed from 7 to 24 months with the average being about 15 months. Over the course of my years as a mother I have been in various situations church-wise from places that didn't want children in the worship service to those that actively encouraged it. Not every situation has been such that they had a cry room where moms could feed babies and still hear the service.You know what I think is the most lovely? The churches where each child is received as a blessing from God and no one makes stupid comments like, "Don't you know what is causing that?" These are also the churches where breastfeeding is taken for granted and no one makes a flap over it.This is not advocacy for women "baring all" while they breastfeed. The very fact that we live in a culture that views breasts as being primarily sexual play toys means that women need to use discretion and usually a blanket or a large shirt accomplishes that feat. But I sometimes wonder when I read opinions that wish to send the mothers and babies out of the worship of God that perhaps we have imbibed more of the surrounding culture than we realized.Yours and His,Cheryl----- Original Message -----From: Fredrick FlemingSent: Tuesday, December 31, 2002 9:40 PMSubject: Re: [Covenanted Reformation] Re: Law of NatureI have seen women breast feed in public, I an also
seen men make comments about it and worse of all I
have seen unchristian men make comments about it.
Would a chriatian man want unchristian men to say
thing about there wife his because of her doing this.
I really love the church of God and in no way do I
want anyone to speak reproachful of is. I think all of
us men here, would fight for the christian women, but
what can we do when the woman cause others to speak
again against the church. Even unchristian women at
times speak against public breast feeding.
Let us Honor Christ in this and cause no ofen to the
church of God. Using our christian liberty for Him.
--- Gary Gearon <GGearon@...> wrote:
> I think also if the woman is modestly dressed, when
> she breast feeds, that
> this changes the context of perception. For example,
> if a woman dressed like
> a modern female Pop Idol, is breast feeding, that
> will have an effect on the
> perception by the man.
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Fredrick Fleming"
> To: <firstname.lastname@example.org>
> Sent: Tuesday, December 31, 2002 4:33 PM
> Subject: Re: [Covenanted Reformation] Re: Law of
> > Where is the Christian Love is this? Your child
> > the milk, but you want to fellowship? You cannot
> > a way to do this? I find it hard to see your
> > You cannot feed your child in private and have
> > time with your friends. You have to do it with
> > friends there? Do you think you might find a way
> > do this? Or would your heart be willing to cause
> > christian brother to fall into Lust or temtation,
> > you can do this? Of course you can place the
> blame on
> > the christian brother and say it is his problem!!
> > There is a really show your love for the christian
> > brother.
> > --- "nocost2great <nocost2great@...>"
> > <nocost2great@...> wrote:
> > > --- In
> > > Thomas Roche
> > > <tertullianus_2000@y...> wrote:
> > > > you have also never been a man. Men are
> > > to
> > > > lust at the sight of female breasts, and
> > > > women need to appreciate this. Obviously,
> > > > feeding is a natural activity, but there are
> > > of
> > > > natural activities one does not do in public.
> > >
> > > Thomas,
> > > You are correct... but if a man is going to lust
> > > while I breastfeed
> > > my baby (with all skin covered either by my
> > > or a blanket)
> > > then he is going to lust anyway. I try to be
> > > discreet. What I don't
> > > like is beibg shooed off in another room while
> > > everyone else enjoys
> > > fellowship.
> > >
> > > Dee Dee (who really doesn't understand the
> > > thing cuz when I
> > > am breastfeeding I feel more like a cow than
> > > anything else.) :)
> > >
> > >
> > __________________________________________________
> > Do you Yahoo!?
> > Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up
> > http://mailplus.yahoo.com
> > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
> > [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Pike Online,
> > [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Pike Online,
> [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Pike Online,
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now.
To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
- Well said, Susan. You really ought to write a book.
Susan <susan_wilkinson@...> wrote:
> To: email@example.com------------------------------------------------------
> From: "Susan <susan_wilkinson@...>" <susan_wilkinson@...>
> Date: Sat, 28 Dec 2002 21:37:31 -0000
> Subject: [Covenanted Reformation] Re: Law of Nature
> One can nurse, even publicly, without showing anything. I understand
> that our culture has perverted their perception of the female form
> into something ungodly, but we need to be careful of making an over
> correction and using the worlds perverseness as justification for
> needless exposure.
> --- In firstname.lastname@example.org, "Gary Gearon"
> <GGearon@p...> wrote:
>> I think the issue as to cleavage can also become legalistic.
> Revealed cleavage, needs to be assesed as to the motive (to attract
> immodestly, or for nursing).
>> I recall a story related to me, wherein a soldier walked by a
> maternity ward in an Arabic country. The women were breast feeding,
> with no upper garment, when a man walked by. They ran to cover their
> heads upon the sight of the man, and not their breasts...as you would
> expect in other parts of the "post-Christian" world. Also, if you have
> a copy of the Shorter Catechism Explained (Banner of Truth), you will
> see a woman with a bare breast and head covered, nursing her child in
> the Catechism class, on the front cover.
>> ----- Original Message -----
[This E-mail scanned for viruses by Pike Online, Inc.]