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RE: [Covenanted Reformation] Cryptic messages about Bill Ross?

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  • Bill Ross
    -antinomian lawlessness Paul was fiercly antinomian. That is why he was always in trouble. But he was not anomian. That is, he was not without law to
    Message 1 of 4 , Nov 30 7:56 PM
      <Jason>
      -antinomian lawlessness

      Paul was fiercly antinomian. That is why he was always in trouble. But he was not anomian. That is, he was not without law to God because he was under the law of Christ.

      Rom 7:

      7 ¶ What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet. {lust: or, concupiscence}

      8 But sin, taking occasion by the commandment, wrought in me all manner of concupiscence. For without the law sin was dead.

      9 For I was alive without the law once: but when the commandment came, sin revived, and I died.

      10 And the commandment, which was ordained to life, I found to be unto death.

      11 For sin, taking occasion by the commandment, deceived me, and by it slew me.

      12 Wherefore the law is holy, and the commandment holy, and just, and good.

      13 Was then that which is good made death unto me? God forbid. But sin, that it might appear sin, working death in me by that which is good; that sin by the commandment might become exceeding sinful.

      14 ¶ For we know that the law is spiritual: but I am carnal, sold under sin.

      ...

      1 ¶ There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

      2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.

      3 For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh: {for sin: or, by a sacrifice for sin}


      -hating God's Law

      The torah is not the problem. The torah is holy. The problem is that it is surpassed by the glory of the gospel:

      2 Cor 3:

      7 But if the ministration of death, written and engraven in stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not stedfastly behold the face of Moses for the glory of his countenance; which glory was to be done away:

      8 How shall not the ministration of the spirit be rather glorious?

      9 For if the ministration of condemnation be glory, much more doth the ministration of righteousness exceed in glory.

      10 For even that which was made glorious had no glory in this respect, by reason of the glory that excelleth.

      11 For if that which is done away was glorious, much more that which remaineth is glorious.

      12 ¶ Seeing then that we have such hope, we use great plainness of speech: {plainness: or, boldness}

      13 And not as Moses, which put a vail over his face, that the children of Israel could not stedfastly look to the end of that which is abolished:


      -creatio ex materies

      This is the plain teaching of Gen 1!!!

      -rejection of Old Testament

      "Testament" is an archaic word and should not be used in modern discussion of the scriptures. The Mosaic covenant, and the torah are obsolete. There is now a better covenant.

      -denial of One God

      I am a strict monotheist.

      -rejection of God's immutability

      The God of scripture is not static by entirely dynamic and engaged. He does not, however, in any way reneg on his promises.

      Bill Ross
    • Jerry
      Paul was fiercly antinomian. Sir, It is not my practice to boot folks from this list unless I feel I have no other recourse. Please notice the club
      Message 2 of 4 , Nov 30 8:34 PM
        "Paul was fiercly antinomian."

        Sir,

        It is not my practice to boot folks from this list unless I feel I
        have no other recourse. Please notice the club description and ask
        yourself if what you are promoting here falls under that charter.

        Antinomianism is a heresy, and I cannot allow heresy to be openly
        promoted here like you are doing. Several folks have attempted to
        correct you with Scripture, and you are refusing to be corrected or
        instructed. I cannot prevent you from twisting the Scriptures to
        your own destruction, but I can keep you from spreading this garbage
        here. I beseech you, cease and desist.

        In the spare time you will have because you are not writing heretical
        posts here, you would do well to read the following:

        David Dickson's treatment of the Westminster Confession's statement
        on the Moral Law --
        http://www.truecovenanter.com/dickson/truthsvictory19.html

        The Marrow of Modern Divinity, especially (but not only) this
        chapter --
        http://www.mountzion.org/text/marrow/c3s2.html

        Thomas Boston on the Moral Law --
        http://www.truecovenanter.com/sermons/bostonmorallaw.html

        Thomas Watson on the right understanding of the Moral Law --
        http://www.fivesolas.com/watson/10rtunde.htm

        John Calvin (Institutes 2:7:13)-- "Some unskillful persons, from not
        attending to this, boldly discard the whole law of Moses, and do away
        with both its Tables, imagining it unchristian to adhere to a
        doctrine which contains the ministration of death. Far from our
        thoughts be this profane notion. Moses has admirably shown that the
        Law, which can produce nothing but death in sinners, ought to have a
        better and more excellent effect upon the righteous. When about to
        die, he thus addressed the people, 'Set your hearts unto all the
        words which I testify among you this day, which ye shall command your
        children to observe to do, all the words of this law. For it is not a
        vain thing for you; because it is your life,' (Deut. 32: 46, 47.) If
        it cannot be denied that it contains a perfect pattern of
        righteousness, then, unless we ought not to have any proper rule of
        life, it must be impious to discard it. There are not various rules
        of life, but one perpetual and inflexible rule; and, therefore, when
        David describes the righteous as spending their whole lives in
        meditating on the Law, (Psalm 1: 2,) we must not confine to a single
        age, an employment which is most appropriate to all ages, even to the
        end of the world. Nor are we to be deterred or to shun its
        instructions, because the holiness which it prescribes is stricter
        than we are able to render, so long as we bear about the prison of
        the body. It does not now perform toward us the part of a hard
        taskmaster, who will not be satisfied without full payment; but, in
        the perfection to which it exhorts us, points out the goal at which,
        during the whole course of our lives, it is not less our interest
        than our duty to aim. It is well if we thus press onward. Our whole
        life is a race, and after we have finished our course, the Lord will
        enable us to reach that goal to which, at present, we can only aspire
        in wish."

        gmw.
      • Crown Rights Book Company
        ... Hi Bill, What do you mean by the above phrase, dynamic and engaged ? Just curious. Libertas inestimabilis res est, Greg Loren Durand Crown Rights Book
        Message 3 of 4 , Dec 1, 2002
          At 09:56 PM 11/30/02 -0600, you wrote:

          >-rejection of God's immutability
          >
          >The God of scripture is not static by entirely dynamic and engaged. He
          >does not, however, in any way reneg on his promises.
          >
          >Bill Ross

          Hi Bill,

          What do you mean by the above phrase, "dynamic and engaged"? Just curious.

          Libertas inestimabilis res est,
          Greg Loren Durand

          Crown Rights Book Company
          http://www.crownrights.com

          ------

          Husband of:
          Lisa Regina (wife of 9 years)

          Father of:
          Brianna Marie (8)
          Virginia Ruth (6)
          Georgia Esther (5)
          Robert Lee (3)
          Carolina Rachel (1)

          http://www.crownrights.com/durand.jpg
        • PuritanPresbyterian
          Bill, Have you ever read Matthew 5:17-19? He (Christ) tells us that He has NOT abolished the Law. In other words it continues, this is how we measure our
          Message 4 of 4 , Dec 2, 2002
            Bill,
             
               Have you ever read Matthew 5:17-19?  He (Christ) tells us that He has NOT abolished the Law.  In other words it continues, this is how we measure our sanctification!!!  We are no longer under the curse of the Law, for Christ became the curse for us. 
             
             
                 You want us to deny Christ's Word (OLD & NEW Covenant), I'm afraid you will be called least....
             
            With Humbleness,
             
            Edgar
             
            ----- Original Message -----
            From: Bill Ross
            Sent: Saturday, November 30, 2002 7:56 PM
            Subject: RE: [Covenanted Reformation] Cryptic messages about Bill Ross?

            <Jason>
            -antinomian lawlessness

            Paul was fiercly antinomian. That is why he was always in trouble. But he was not anomian. That is, he was not without law to God because he was under the law of Christ.

            Rom 7:

                  7 ¶ What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet. {lust: or, concupiscence}

                  8 But sin, taking occasion by the commandment, wrought in me all manner of concupiscence. For without the law sin was dead.

                  9 For I was alive without the law once: but when the commandment came, sin revived, and I died.

                  10 And the commandment, which was ordained to life, I found to be unto death.

                  11 For sin, taking occasion by the commandment, deceived me, and by it slew me.

                  12 Wherefore the law is holy, and the commandment holy, and just, and good.

                  13 Was then that which is good made death unto me? God forbid. But sin, that it might appear sin, working death in me by that which is good; that sin by the commandment might become exceeding sinful.

                  14 ¶ For we know that the law is spiritual: but I am carnal, sold under sin.

                  ...

                  1 ¶ There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

                  2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.

                  3 For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh: {for sin: or, by a sacrifice for sin}


            -hating God's Law

            The torah is not the problem. The torah is holy. The problem is that it is surpassed by the glory of the gospel:

            2 Cor 3:

                  7 But if the ministration of death, written and engraven in stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not stedfastly behold the face of Moses for the glory of his countenance; which glory was to be done away:

                  8 How shall not the ministration of the spirit be rather glorious?

                  9 For if the ministration of condemnation be glory, much more doth the ministration of righteousness exceed in glory.

                  10 For even that which was made glorious had no glory in this respect, by reason of the glory that excelleth.

                  11 For if that which is done away was glorious, much more that which remaineth is glorious.

                  12 ¶ Seeing then that we have such hope, we use great plainness of speech: {plainness: or, boldness}

                  13 And not as Moses, which put a vail over his face, that the children of Israel could not stedfastly look to the end of that which is abolished:


            -creatio ex materies

            This is the plain teaching of Gen 1!!!

            -rejection of Old Testament

            "Testament" is an archaic word and should not be used in modern discussion of the scriptures. The Mosaic covenant, and the torah are obsolete. There is now a better covenant.

            -denial of One God

            I am a strict monotheist.

            -rejection of God's immutability

            The God of scripture is not static by entirely dynamic and engaged. He does not, however, in any way reneg on his promises.

            Bill Ross


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