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Re: [Covenanted Reformation] Worship Distincive

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  • Larry Bump
    ... I m not really sure he had a point. The main thesis seems to be what we practice isn t really ethically driven, because it can t promote a fellowship by
    Message 1 of 10 , Oct 9, 2009
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      christabella.warren wrote:
      > I need to read this article a little more closely when I have time, but isn't the author's basic point pro-Psalmody? In which case, isn't that a good thing?
      >


      I'm not really sure he had a point.
      The main thesis seems to be what we practice isn't really ethically
      driven, because it can't promote a fellowship by itself.
      But that's not rational or useful.

      Any distinctive has the same shortfall, and that's not the point of
      psalmody.

      The opening statement that we should look at exclusive psalmody and it's
      reasons for being practiced apart from a biblical/ethical position
      invalidates the whole application of the argument to RPW-believing
      Christians.
    • bob_suden
      ... Not to change the subject from the recent flurry of posts, but I agree with Larry on this one. P&R Christian commits hari-kiri in an unconditional and
      Message 2 of 10 , Dec 13, 2009
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        --- In covenantedreformationclub@yahoogroups.com, Larry Bump <lbump@...> wrote:
        >
        > bander1643 wrote:
        > > FWIW
        > > Tom
        > >
        > > Ghostly Echoes: A Eulogy 

        >
        > That is one of the most vastly over-written straw-man arguments I have
        > ever seen.


        Not to change the subject from  the recent flurry of posts, but I agree with Larry on this one.
        P&R Christian  commits hari-kiri in an  unconditional and abject surrender to academic post modernism.

        IOW I found the article pretty confusing. Yes, psalmody was an important part of worship as well as emotional,  but the question is not whether it builds a community or camaraderie, but whether it is true.
        (I also  did not know that Washington Irving's was raised ScotchPresbyterian and quite famous in his  time as an American author. Had to go out and pick up a copy of his Legend of Sleepy Hollow illustrated by  A Rackham to get up to literary speed.)
        Front Porch Republic is also where DG Hart of the OPC  hangs out. He wrote With Reverence and Awe; Returning to the Basics of Reformed Worship in 2002.

        Yet a better defence of psalmody and the RPW  would be  Michael Bushell's Songs of Zion which CColdwell recently announced will be reprinted in the fall of 2010 by   Naptali Press  in an updated and augmented version. 
        While that's a ways off, it should be worth it.  Bushell's title is  still the premier contemporary defense of psalmody imo, blackballed and blacklisted by many modern moderate P&R churches and    unanswered because it is unanswerable.



      • skylermarks
        Thanks for the mention Bob, though Songs of Zion probably will be under my Confessional Presbyterian Press imprint as Naphtali s modus operandi is to publish
        Message 3 of 10 , Dec 13, 2009
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          Thanks for the mention Bob, though Songs of Zion probably will be under my Confessional Presbyterian Press imprint as Naphtali's modus operandi is to publish voices from the past. I'm looking forward to working on it, though it has some challengingly long footnotes to consider in layout. The work is rather unique (in itself and for me) in being around for 30 years and for having gone through several editions prior with Crown & Covenant.

          Sincerely,
          Chris Coldwell
          Naphtali Press http://www.naphtali.com
          The Confessional Presbyterian journal http://www.cpjournal.com
          Westminster Letter Press www.westminsterletterpress.com


          --- In covenantedreformationclub@yahoogroups.com, "bob_suden" <bsuden@...> wrote:
          >
          >
          > --- In covenantedreformationclub@yahoogroups.com, Larry Bump <lbump@>
          > wrote:
          > >
          > > bander1643 wrote:
          > > > FWIW
          > > > Tom
          > > >
          > > > Ghostly Echoes: A Eulogy <http://www.frontporchrepublic.com/?p=6366>
          >
          > >
          > > That is one of the most vastly over-written straw-man arguments I have
          > > ever seen.
          >
          >
          > Not to change the subject from the recent flurry of posts, but I agree
          > with Larry on this one.
          > P&R Christian commits hari-kiri in an unconditional and abject
          > surrender to academic post modernism.
          >
          > IOW I found the article pretty confusing. Yes, psalmody was an important
          > part of worship as well as emotional, but the question is not whether
          > it builds a community or camaraderie, but whether it is true.
          > (I also did not know that Washington Irving's was raised
          > ScotchPresbyterian and quite famous in his time as an American author.
          > Had to go out and pick up a copy of his Legend of Sleepy Hollow
          > illustrated by A Rackham to get up to literary speed.)
          > Front Porch Republic is also where DG Hart of the OPC hangs out. He
          > wrote With Reverence and Awe; Returning to the Basics of Reformed
          > Worship in 2002.
          >
          > Yet a better defence of psalmody and the RPW would be Michael
          > Bushell's Songs of Zion which CColdwell recently announced will be
          > reprinted in the fall of 2010 by Naptali Press
          > <http://www.naphtali.com/2009/11/17/cpp-to-publish-michael-bushells-the-\
          > songs-of-zion/> in an updated and augmented version. While that's a
          > ways off, it should be worth it. Bushell's title is still the premier
          > contemporary defense of psalmody imo, blackballed and blacklisted by
          > many modern moderate P&R churches and unanswered because it is
          > unanswerable.
          >
        • bob_suden
          Greetings Chris, Are you going to be working on this reprint in conjunction with Bushell or separately? I have both previous editions (1977-80, 1993), the last
          Message 4 of 10 , Dec 13, 2009
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            Greetings Chris,

            Are you going to be working on this reprint in conjunction with Bushell or separately? I have both previous editions (1977-80, 1993), the last of which I think, is out of print. Is there any particular reason you decided to reprint Songs of Zion?  (I can't imagine Ian Murray and Nick Needham had anything to do with it - not a chance.)

            cordially
            Bob S



            In covenantedreformationclub@yahoogroups.com, "skylermarks" <naphtali@...> wrote:
            >
            > Thanks for the mention Bob, though Songs of Zion probably will be under my Confessional Presbyterian Press imprint as Naphtali's modus operandi is to publish voices from the past. I'm looking forward to working on it, though it has some challengingly long footnotes to consider in layout. The work is rather unique (in itself and for me) in being around for 30 years and for having gone through several editions prior with Crown & Covenant.
            >
            > Sincerely,
            > Chris Coldwell
            > Naphtali Press http://www.naphtali.com
            > The Confessional Presbyterian journal http://www.cpjournal.com
            > Westminster Letter Press www.westminsterletterpress.com
            >
            >
          • skylermarks
            Bob, Yes; I am working with Mike who approached me about publishing SoZ on the strength of my other work. I took it on because I think I can do a good job and
            Message 5 of 10 , Dec 13, 2009
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              Bob,
              Yes; I am working with Mike who approached me about publishing SoZ on the strength of my other work. I took it on because I think I can do a good job and it is an important work that needs to remain available, and this is a major rewrite which sets it apart from the earlier editions. Right; Needham/Murray had little sway in the decision.;0)

              Sincerely,
              Chris Coldwell
              Naphtali Press http://www.naphtali.com
              The Confessional Presbyterian journal http://www.cpjournal.com
              Westminster Letter Press www.westminsterletterpress.com

              --- In covenantedreformationclub@yahoogroups.com, "bob_suden" <bsuden@...> wrote:
              >
              > Greetings Chris,
              >
              > Are you going to be working on this reprint in conjunction with Bushell
              > or separately? I have both previous editions (1977-80, 1993), the last
              > of which I think, is out of print. Is there any particular reason you
              > decided to reprint Songs of Zion? (I can't imagine Ian Murray and Nick
              > Needham had anything to do with it - not a chance.)
              >
              > cordially
              > Bob S
              >
              >
              >
              > In covenantedreformationclub@yahoogroups.com, "skylermarks"
              > <naphtali@> wrote:
              > >
              > > Thanks for the mention Bob, though Songs of Zion probably will be
              > under my Confessional Presbyterian Press imprint as Naphtali's modus
              > operandi is to publish voices from the past. I'm looking forward to
              > working on it, though it has some challengingly long footnotes to
              > consider in layout. The work is rather unique (in itself and for me) in
              > being around for 30 years and for having gone through several editions
              > prior with Crown & Covenant.
              > >
              > > Sincerely,
              > > Chris Coldwell
              > > Naphtali Press http://www.naphtali.com
              > > The Confessional Presbyterian journal http://www.cpjournal.com
              > > Westminster Letter Press www.westminsterletterpress.com
              > >
              > >
              >
            • Tim
              Hi Chris Are you going to make it available as an E-book? Wishing you a blessed New Year. Tim Cunningham
              Message 6 of 10 , Jan 2, 2010
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                Hi Chris

                Are you going to make it available as an E-book?
                Wishing you a blessed New Year.
                Tim Cunningham

                --- In covenantedreformationclub@yahoogroups.com, "skylermarks" <naphtali@...> wrote:
                >
                > Bob,
                > Yes; I am working with Mike who approached me about publishing SoZ on the strength of my other work. I took it on because I think I can do a good job and it is an important work that needs to remain available, and this is a major rewrite which sets it apart from the earlier editions. Right; Needham/Murray had little sway in the decision.;0)
                >
                > Sincerely,
                > Chris Coldwell
                > Naphtali Press http://www.naphtali.com
                > The Confessional Presbyterian journal http://www.cpjournal.com
                > Westminster Letter Press www.westminsterletterpress.com
                >
                > --- In covenantedreformationclub@yahoogroups.com, "bob_suden" <bsuden@> wrote:
                > >
                > > Greetings Chris,
                > >
                > > Are you going to be working on this reprint in conjunction with Bushell
                > > or separately? I have both previous editions (1977-80, 1993), the last
                > > of which I think, is out of print. Is there any particular reason you
                > > decided to reprint Songs of Zion? (I can't imagine Ian Murray and Nick
                > > Needham had anything to do with it - not a chance.)
                > >
                > > cordially
                > > Bob S
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > > In covenantedreformationclub@yahoogroups.com, "skylermarks"
                > > <naphtali@> wrote:
                > > >
                > > > Thanks for the mention Bob, though Songs of Zion probably will be
                > > under my Confessional Presbyterian Press imprint as Naphtali's modus
                > > operandi is to publish voices from the past. I'm looking forward to
                > > working on it, though it has some challengingly long footnotes to
                > > consider in layout. The work is rather unique (in itself and for me) in
                > > being around for 30 years and for having gone through several editions
                > > prior with Crown & Covenant.
                > > >
                > > > Sincerely,
                > > > Chris Coldwell
                > > > Naphtali Press http://www.naphtali.com
                > > > The Confessional Presbyterian journal http://www.cpjournal.com
                > > > Westminster Letter Press www.westminsterletterpress.com
                > > >
                > > >
                > >
                >
              • skylermarks
                Tim, No plans to do so; at least by me. The agreement with Mike was for a nice print edition; preferably hardbound since it has only been issued before in
                Message 7 of 10 , Jan 2, 2010
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                  Tim,
                  No plans to do so; at least by me. The agreement with Mike was for a nice print edition; preferably hardbound since it has only been issued before in paperback. We should know more as we progress during the early portion of 2010.
                  Sincerely,
                  Chris Coldwell
                  www.naphtali.com
                  www.westminsterletterpress.com
                  www.cpjournal.com
                  www.thebluebanner.com


                  --- In covenantedreformationclub@yahoogroups.com, "Tim" <timmopussycat@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > Hi Chris
                  >
                  > Are you going to make it available as an E-book?
                  > Wishing you a blessed New Year.
                  > Tim Cunningham
                  >
                  > --- In covenantedreformationclub@yahoogroups.com, "skylermarks" <naphtali@> wrote:
                  > >
                  > > Bob,
                  > > Yes; I am working with Mike who approached me about publishing SoZ on the strength of my other work. I took it on because I think I can do a good job and it is an important work that needs to remain available, and this is a major rewrite which sets it apart from the earlier editions. Right; Needham/Murray had little sway in the decision.;0)
                  > >
                  > > Sincerely,
                  > > Chris Coldwell
                  > > Naphtali Press http://www.naphtali.com
                  > > The Confessional Presbyterian journal http://www.cpjournal.com
                  > > Westminster Letter Press www.westminsterletterpress.com
                  > >
                  > > --- In covenantedreformationclub@yahoogroups.com, "bob_suden" <bsuden@> wrote:
                  > > >
                  > > > Greetings Chris,
                  > > >
                  > > > Are you going to be working on this reprint in conjunction with Bushell
                  > > > or separately? I have both previous editions (1977-80, 1993), the last
                  > > > of which I think, is out of print. Is there any particular reason you
                  > > > decided to reprint Songs of Zion? (I can't imagine Ian Murray and Nick
                  > > > Needham had anything to do with it - not a chance.)
                  > > >
                  > > > cordially
                  > > > Bob S
                  > > >
                  > > >
                  > > >
                  > > > In covenantedreformationclub@yahoogroups.com, "skylermarks"
                  > > > <naphtali@> wrote:
                  > > > >
                  > > > > Thanks for the mention Bob, though Songs of Zion probably will be
                  > > > under my Confessional Presbyterian Press imprint as Naphtali's modus
                  > > > operandi is to publish voices from the past. I'm looking forward to
                  > > > working on it, though it has some challengingly long footnotes to
                  > > > consider in layout. The work is rather unique (in itself and for me) in
                  > > > being around for 30 years and for having gone through several editions
                  > > > prior with Crown & Covenant.
                  > > > >
                  > > > > Sincerely,
                  > > > > Chris Coldwell
                  > > > > Naphtali Press http://www.naphtali.com
                  > > > > The Confessional Presbyterian journal http://www.cpjournal.com
                  > > > > Westminster Letter Press www.westminsterletterpress.com
                  > > > >
                  > > > >
                  > > >
                  > >
                  >
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