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Re: Secret Societies

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  • bob_suden
    Dear Walter, Your previous promises to refrain from public bashing and scurrilous screeds notwithstanding, as should be obvious, in your most recent, you
    Message 1 of 3 , Mar 11, 2007

      Dear Walter,
      Your previous promises to refrain from public bashing and scurrilous screeds notwithstanding, as should be obvious, in your most recent, you unfortunately make no mention of secret session meetings, (nor for that matter,  of secret general meetings) of  which no one is notified of  in the RPNA(GM). Even further, these same secret session meetings not only  preceded, but they have continued after the demise of the temporary group which was provoked to get together and question the document which justifies this kind of pseudo presbyterian behavior, much more the pseudo presbyterian court itself. And why is there no mention? Because it would become all too  apparent and obvious just who provoked who to wrath and justifiable resistance. In other words,  again 
      as exemplified in the PPSA, we see the favorite modus operandi in the RPNA(GM)  in action. Divert attention from the material question - the lawfulness of the court and name of the RPNA(GM) - by bringing up everything and the kitchen sink in reply. Being an elder or member of the " court" means never having to  answer to anybody or say you are sorry.
      But to whom much is given much is required. There is also  no mention in all of the apologies for the RPNA(GM) including your recent five, that ever since June `03 there has been any number of instances where the elders have not done their job and have abused the patience and longsuffering of those in the former RPNA.
      1. The letter of 6/14/03  from the elders explicitly appeals to the power of order or G. Price's office as a pastor, to be sufficient enough to administer the sacraments, contra the suppression –  if not outright contradiction  – of that same letter and the proper exposition of the power of order in the PPSA  6/4/06 (pp.13,14,21)
      2. There was no explanation of the name change to the "Session of the RPNA(GM)" 10/31/04  though the PG Society asked the elders about "the Session" 9/24/04, while the Washington Society asked the elders about the GM 10/28/04 &  1/16/05  without receiving respectively any where near a timely or substantial answer.
      3. The excommunications of Kathy Soles 4/13/05 and Shelly Barrow 10/23/05 leave something very much  to be desired as far as due process goes.
      4. The restructuring of the church was promised 1/1/06  and 3/29/06, much more a forum in the last.
      5. The Jan./Feb. `06  phony affidavit and June/July `06  phony analogy  email scandals as orchestrated by the proxy elders did not endear the supposed neutrality of the "court" to anyone who might have questions on the PPSA 6/4/06 which only defended the status quo rather than set forth a plan for restructuring. Rather intimidation seem to be the aim of these two public and elder approved scandals. Who let the dogs out? is not a question that should have to be directed at the elders in a genuine RP church.
      6.The subsequent administering of a confidential loyalty oath  to defendants - not witnesses -  previous to trial and without any specifications of charges beginning on 10/4/06, much more claiming that the same oath was implicit in the terms of membership, when all parties still adhere to the same terms of communion again did not confirm the objectivity of the asserted "court".

      Thank you very much,
      cordially
      Bob S

      --- In covenantedreformationclub@yahoogroups.com, "humbled.learner" <humbled.learner@...> wrote:
      >
      > RESOURCE 6. GEORGE, R.J.
      > Secret Societies
      >
      > Shows why secret societies are condemned in Scripture and why they are
      > also destructive to the church, state and family.
      >
      > (Rare Bound Photocopy) $9.95-70%= (US funds) $2.99
      > (Hardcover photocopy) $15.00 (US funds)
      >
      > + This book is also available on Reformation Bookshelf CD volume 18
      > (CD SUPER SALE) at:
      > http://www.swrb.com/Puritan/reformation-bookshelf-CDs.htm
      >
    • desire_pure_heart
      Good morning list; You know it is amazing, what typing down someone s name will do... hello, this is Katrina Schumacher, formerly known as ~Cathie-Iris:Soles~.
      Message 2 of 3 , Mar 12, 2007
        Good morning list;


        You know it is amazing, what typing down someone's name will do...
        hello, this is Katrina Schumacher, formerly known as
        ~Cathie-Iris:Soles~.

        I've not read any posts since early January, and had set my groups to
        no mail, for I've been very busy here at the Ranch.


        But in the wee hours of the morning, I felt drawn to come read over
        the postings here Jer, and see that my brother Bob has written my
        name down along with Shelly Barrow's name....Reg Barrow of Still
        Waters Revival Books wife; Shelly is also Elder Greg Barrow's sister-
        in-law. This poor sister in Christ has been so mishandled...I guess
        that is another story about men wanting to build the Kingdom of God,
        but not taking care of the dear ones that the Lord has entrusted to a
        man. I continually pray that the Lord will send comfort to Shelly and
        her children.


        I want to address the list about the attack by Walt of the brethren
        who were excommunicated, and for the brethren who are facing being
        excommunicated over putting questions forward to the three Elders of
        the former RPNA....not all the members agree with the treatment of
        the x-ed...and this will probably lead to more rending.

        These excommuned breathren, most of them I know personally through
        either they being part of my family, or the dear Saints that have
        traveled to Canada to visit with my family while I lived at Prince
        George, or were involved with the wedding celebrations of my
        daughters, and/or were the Dear Saints who gave fellowship and
        financial support to my first husband Grant Soles as he was dying
        from the Asbestos related cancer... I weep as I write this, to have
        this hurt applied to these dear brethern, brethern of good, noble
        Christian character and maturity....to read here posts from someone
        who ought to know better, Walt, you ought to know better pouring gall
        into their wounds calling them liars...and worse. Shame, shame,
        shame, the fruit of all this is Rotten....the treatment of these
        godly men and women atrocious.

        My understanding is there was and is no Secret Society, but instead
        believers who wanted to put their concern and questions forward in a
        decent and proper manner to the Elders, to not stir up discontent, to
        not cause gossip, but to go privately at first to the Elders and have
        their concerns addressed. There was no ill will involved that I can
        tell, there was hope on their part that the Lord would lead to their
        concerns being taken care of...and even though I'm a parent I was not
        told about any of their concerns, not until some time had passed
        after their excommunications, for out of maturity and Christian love,
        they wanted to treat their Elders properly...it was only after weeks
        had passed, and they saw no mercy being extended by their former
        Elders, did they tell me of the history of their concerns, and that
        they had been x-ed.

        BUT, the treatment of them, the treatment of their concerns has not
        been orderly, or proper, and definitely not GOD HONORING....a rending
        of the flock instead, a continually beating, a refusal to address or
        care for them, a casting off, no balm for their wounds, no cloak to
        bring to them warmth.....and a brother (Walt) promising to bring
        charges of lying. More Insult added to Injury.


        What we are witnessing is HISTORY repeating itself.... the Pharisees
        excommunicating the former Blind man whom Jesus healed on the
        Sabbath, just as Paul held the cloaks as he was splattered by Blood
        from the deacon Stephen's stone bashed body.... men so consumed by
        their importance, so consumed by their dreams, so consumed by the
        power they think they have for the Kingdom....have done this wrong,
        and they just as the Pharisees did not repent,the Pharisees'
        attitudes/spirit were the same, the Pharisees in their hardened heart
        state; went ahead and had the Son of God murdered.... Unless, some
        mighty event happens to these three Elders, and the scale of blindness
        (as in Paul's case) is removed, they are bent on continuing in this
        manner.

        Is the Lord honored in this? NOT AT ALL? No, I'll correct that, none
        of this has caught the Lord unaware, He has a purpose, it all fell
        out by His Providence.... if these brethren who have been so cruelly
        treated, manage to **not** become buried under BITTERNESS, manage to
        continue in life to raise their families for the Lord, develop the
        skills and gifts that the Lord has graced them with....follow the
        example of Joseph in Exile among the Egyptians...then the Lord will
        be and is HONORED, but He is not honored by the three Elders or the
        members who support their ungodly actions.

        The Lord is God and we shall PRAISE Him.



        Katrina Schumacher
        as Bob wrote x-ed unjustly by the former RPNA
        Presently communicate member of CRCNA
        Rimbey, Alberta
        Canada









        --- In covenantedreformationclub@yahoogroups.com, "bob_suden"
        <bsuden@...> wrote:
        >
        >
        > Dear Walter,
        > Your previous promises to refrain from public bashing and scurrilous
        > screeds notwithstanding, as should be obvious, in your most recent,
        you
        > unfortunately make no mention of secret session meetings, (nor for
        that
        > matter, of secret general meetings) of which no one is notified
        of in
        > the RPNA(GM). Even further, these same secret session meetings not
        only
        > preceded, but they have continued after the demise of the temporary
        > group which was provoked to get together and question the document
        which
        > justifies this kind of pseudo presbyterian behavior, much more the
        > pseudo presbyterian court itself. And why is there no mention?
        Because
        > it would become all too apparent and obvious just who provoked who
        to
        > wrath and justifiable resistance. In other words, again as
        exemplified
        > in the PPSA, we see the favorite modus operandi in the RPNA(GM) in
        > action. Divert attention from the material question - the
        lawfulness of
        > the court and name of the RPNA(GM) - by bringing up everything and
        the
        > kitchen sink in reply. Being an elder or member of the " court"
        means
        > never having to answer to anybody or say you are sorry.
        > But to whom much is given much is required. There is also no
        mention in
        > all of the apologies for the RPNA(GM) including your recent five,
        that
        > ever since June `03 there has been any number of instances where the
        > elders have not done their job and have abused the patience and
        > longsuffering of those in the former RPNA.
        > 1. The letter of 6/14/03
        > <http://reformedveritas.blogspot.com/2006/11/dissolution-of-
        reformed-pre\
        > sbytery-of.html> from the elders explicitly appeals to the power
        of
        > order or G. Price's office as a pastor, to be sufficient enough to
        > administer the sacraments, contra the suppression – if not outright
        > contradiction – of that same letter and the proper exposition of
        > the power of order in the PPSA
        > <http://docs.google.com/Doc?id=dfpdhc2h_11gnvc5f> 6/4/06
        (pp.13,14,21)
        > 2. There was no explanation of the name change to the "Session of
        > the RPNA(GM)" 10/31/04
        > <http://reformedveritas.blogspot.com/2006/12/oct-31-04-first-
        announcemen\
        > t-by-session.html> though the PG Society asked the elders about
        > "the Session" 9/24/04, while the Washington Society asked the
        > elders about the GM 10/28/04 & 1/16/05
        > <http://reformedveritas.blogspot.com/2006/10/0405-washington-
        society-cor\
        > respondence.html> without receiving respectively any where near a
        > timely or substantial answer.
        > 3. The excommunications of Kathy Soles 4/13/05 and Shelly Barrow
        > 10/23/05 leave something very much to be desired as far as due
        process
        > goes.
        > 4. The restructuring of the church was promised 1/1/06
        > <http://reformedveritas.blogspot.com/2006/12/jan-1-06-announcements-
        re-e\
        > lders-health.html> and 3/29/06
        > <http://reformedveritas.blogspot.com/2006/12/mar-29-06-update-on-
        church.\
        > html> , much more a forum in the last.
        > 5. The Jan./Feb. `06 phony affidavit and June/July `06 phony
        > analogy <http://docs.google.com/Doc?id=dfpdhc2h_15cb4gzp> email
        > scandals as orchestrated by the proxy elders did not endear the
        supposed
        > neutrality of the "court" to anyone who might have questions on
        > the PPSA 6/4/06 which only defended the status quo rather than set
        forth
        > a plan for restructuring. Rather intimidation seem to be the aim of
        > these two public and elder approved scandals. Who let the dogs out?
        is
        > not a question that should have to be directed at the elders in a
        > genuine RP church.
        > 6.The subsequent administering of a confidential loyalty oath
        > <http://reformedveritas.blogspot.com/2006/11/new-essential-oath-of-
        membe\
        > rship-in.html> to defendants - not witnesses - previous to trial
        and
        > without any specifications of charges beginning on 10/4/06, much
        more
        > claiming that the same oath was implicit in the terms of membership,
        > when all parties still adhere to the same terms of communion again
        did
        > not confirm the objectivity of the asserted "court".
        >
        > Thank you very much,
        > cordially
        > Bob S
        >
        > --- In covenantedreformationclub@yahoogroups.com, "humbled.learner"
        > <humbled.learner@> wrote:
        > >
        > > RESOURCE 6. GEORGE, R.J.
        > > Secret Societies
        > >
        > > Shows why secret societies are condemned in Scripture and why
        they are
        > > also destructive to the church, state and family.
        > >
        > > (Rare Bound Photocopy) $9.95-70%= (US funds) $2.99
        > > (Hardcover photocopy) $15.00 (US funds)
        > >
        > > + This book is also available on Reformation Bookshelf CD volume
        18
        > > (CD SUPER SALE) at:
        > > http://www.swrb.com/Puritan/reformation-bookshelf-CDs.htm
        > >
        >
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