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Re: [Covenanted Reformation] Reformation continuing atAPURITANSMIND.COM

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  • keith dotzler
    AMEN Gerry! It would be hard to believe that any one of us came to the theological convictions we currently hold to over night or even within a few weeks.
    Message 1 of 8 , Jun 7, 2005
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      AMEN Gerry!   It would be hard to believe that any one of us came to
      the theological convictions we currently hold to over night or even
      within a few weeks.  Many times change involves a paradigm shift and
      that will take a bit of time for any one to come to a full and well-
      rounded conviction.

       
      Yes, and the Lord will only send so many to warn him of his error.  By his own admission, I wasn't the first.  The fact that he has taken upon himself the roles he has, makes him all the more accountable.
       
       
      Keith
       
       
      ----- Original Message -----
      Sent: 6/7/2005 11:51:46 AM
      Subject: Re: [Covenanted Reformation] Reformation continuing atAPURITANSMIND.COM

      AMEN Gerry!   It would be hard to believe that any one of us came to
      the theological convictions we currently hold to over night or even
      within a few weeks.  Many times change involves a paradigm shift and
      that will take a bit of time for any one to come to a full and well-
      rounded conviction.

      I do pray that he does become truly convicted and convinced of the
      Covenanted Reformation and becomes a Covenanter as I pray all
      Christians will.

         Thanks for the update Gerry!

      Your Covenanter bro,

      Edgar

      --- In covenantedreformationclub@yahoogroups.com, "gmw"
      <raging.calvinist@v...> wrote:
      > --- In covenantedreformationclub@yahoogroups.com, "keith dotzler"
      > <kdotz@e...> wrote:
      > > "He seems to quote with approbation several authors (including
      the
      > Westminster Confession) which do refer to the Pope as THE
      Antichrist."
      > >
      > > Which is MEANINGLESS, Gerry.  Ask him those 9 questions.  You'll
      see.
      > >
      >
      > Those are your questions, and I'll let you ask them if you find it
      > necessary.  All I'm saying is that a couple years ago this guy was
      a
      > "Reformed Baptist," and now he's fully professing the Westminster
      > Confession of Faith, and is writing books and articles on the
      Solemn
      > League and Covenant ( http://tinyurl.com/7p9l6 )!
      >
      > Are there things I wish he would say instead of the things he's
      > currently saying?  Sure.  His links section still has some smart-
      alec
      > comments about Covenanters and Psalmody, but this does not mean I
      am
      > DIS-pleased to see the direction he's going in.  To the contrary.
      >
      > Let's remember him in prayer, folks.
      >
      > gmw.


    • gmw
      ... No retreat, Keith. Apparently you ve read that article with different glasses on than I did. I found what he wrote very encouraging, while you do not.
      Message 2 of 8 , Jun 7, 2005
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        keith dotzler wrote:

        > What's with the sudden retreat, Gerry?!? You made the assertion that
        > McMahon had /"apparently come around on the pope being antichrist,"/
        > based on a single article he wrote about JPII. When taken to task on
        > your presumption, you then defended your remarks (ignoring what I had
        > said altogether) by stating that: /"He seems to quote with approbation
        > several authors (including the Westminster Confession) which do refer
        > to the Pope as THE Antichrist."/

        No retreat, Keith. Apparently you've read that article with different
        glasses on than I did. I found what he wrote very encouraging, while
        you do not. Apparently that's because of conversations you've had with
        him in the past, and that's fine. I've not had those conversations, and
        so I do not share the negative views. I'm asking folks to continue to
        pray for this man who has continually shown reformation over the past
        few years. I find that encouraging. That's all.

        > In response to your assertions, I gave you 9 questions to ask McMahon
        > -- the answers to which would either verify or disprove what you think
        > McMahon believes about the Antichrist.

        Oh, I don't know. You see, I believe one can believe that the Pope is
        THE Antichrist, and yet not understand, or agree with you, about who the
        little horn is. They are your questions. If you want to re-ask him to
        satisfy your requirements, go ahead. That's ok.


        > I don't _need_ to ask McMahon those 9 questions.....

        And neither does anyone else.

        > I ALREADY HAVE! I supplied them for YOU to ask him, because YOU are
        > the one who seems to be blinded by his clever play on words

        Blinded? I am not blinded. I am being very cautious, yet optimistic as
        I witness the furthering of his reformation. I believe he's been
        heading in the right direction for quite some time now, and I suggest
        that we pray for this to continue, so that he does fully develop his own
        thinking in the Scriptural and Confessional way.


        > One thing I noticed during our e-mail discussion, was McMahon's
        > ignorance of what the Reformers and Puritans actually believed about
        > the identities of the Antichrist and Mystery Babylon (in fact, he
        > couldn't even keep MY position straight).


        Which is part of the reason why I was pleased to see him quote people
        and the Confession which are stating the Reformed and Puritan view.
        Will you not pray for his continued reformation with me?

        > Why won't you ask him those questions, Gerry? Don't you want to know
        > EXACTLY what his position is?

        His answers to your nine questions are less important to me than the
        glimmers of light I am continually seeing come from him over these past
        few years. I do not doubt that if he continues on this path, he will
        come to the right conclusion regarding Antichrist even if he is not 100%
        there already.

        Shoot me for being hopeful, why don't ya?

        :-)


        > 1) Who is *THE* Antichrist _TODAY_?
        > 2) Who is the man of sin _TODAY_?
        > 3) Who is the Little Horn _TODAY_?

        Not my style. YOUR style, maybe. Not mine. Mine would be more like,
        "Hey, I just wanted to drop you a note of encouragement. I've read many
        of your articles over the years and noticed that more and more you truly
        are evidencing "A Puritan's Mind." I'm especially pleased that you've
        reconsidered your position on infant baptism, adopting the Westminster
        Standards, and the Solemn League and Covenant. I appreciated your
        article on the Pope, too. Tell me, are you convinced that the
        Confession's statement on the Pope is true, that the Pope is THE
        predicted Antichrist, THAT Man of Sin?"

        That would be more like my style.

        > My posts to you were never about McMahon's "direction." You said he
        > had apparently _COME AROUND_ to the Pope being antichrist.

        Apparently was the word I used. Yes. So sorry it caused you so much
        offense. ;)

        gmw.
      • personalwg@chartermi.net
        Interesting dialogue. Nicely written Gerry! You and Keith are in my prayers.
        Message 3 of 8 , Jun 7, 2005
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          Interesting dialogue. Nicely written Gerry! You and Keith are in my
          prayers.

          gmw wrote:

          >
          >
          > keith dotzler wrote:
          >
          > > What's with the sudden retreat, Gerry?!? You made the assertion that
          > > McMahon had /"apparently come around on the pope being antichrist,"/
          > > based on a single article he wrote about JPII. When taken to task on
          > > your presumption, you then defended your remarks (ignoring what I had
          > > said altogether) by stating that: /"He seems to quote with approbation
          > > several authors (including the Westminster Confession) which do refer
          > > to the Pope as THE Antichrist."/
          >
          > No retreat, Keith. Apparently you've read that article with different
          > glasses on than I did. I found what he wrote very encouraging, while
          > you do not. Apparently that's because of conversations you've had with
          > him in the past, and that's fine. I've not had those conversations, and
          > so I do not share the negative views. I'm asking folks to continue to
          > pray for this man who has continually shown reformation over the past
          > few years. I find that encouraging. That's all.
          >
          > > In response to your assertions, I gave you 9 questions to ask McMahon
          > > -- the answers to which would either verify or disprove what you think
          > > McMahon believes about the Antichrist.
          >
          > Oh, I don't know. You see, I believe one can believe that the Pope is
          > THE Antichrist, and yet not understand, or agree with you, about who the
          > little horn is. They are your questions. If you want to re-ask him to
          > satisfy your requirements, go ahead. That's ok.
          >
          >
          > > I don't _need_ to ask McMahon those 9 questions.....
          >
          > And neither does anyone else.
          >
          > > I ALREADY HAVE! I supplied them for YOU to ask him, because YOU are
          > > the one who seems to be blinded by his clever play on words
          >
          > Blinded? I am not blinded. I am being very cautious, yet optimistic as
          > I witness the furthering of his reformation. I believe he's been
          > heading in the right direction for quite some time now, and I suggest
          > that we pray for this to continue, so that he does fully develop his own
          > thinking in the Scriptural and Confessional way.
          >
          >
          > > One thing I noticed during our e-mail discussion, was McMahon's
          > > ignorance of what the Reformers and Puritans actually believed about
          > > the identities of the Antichrist and Mystery Babylon (in fact, he
          > > couldn't even keep MY position straight).
          >
          >
          > Which is part of the reason why I was pleased to see him quote people
          > and the Confession which are stating the Reformed and Puritan view.
          > Will you not pray for his continued reformation with me?
          >
          > > Why won't you ask him those questions, Gerry? Don't you want to know
          > > EXACTLY what his position is?
          >
          > His answers to your nine questions are less important to me than the
          > glimmers of light I am continually seeing come from him over these past
          > few years. I do not doubt that if he continues on this path, he will
          > come to the right conclusion regarding Antichrist even if he is not 100%
          > there already.
          >
          > Shoot me for being hopeful, why don't ya?
          >
          > :-)
          >
          >
          > > 1) Who is *THE* Antichrist _TODAY_?
          > > 2) Who is the man of sin _TODAY_?
          > > 3) Who is the Little Horn _TODAY_?
          >
          > Not my style. YOUR style, maybe. Not mine. Mine would be more like,
          > "Hey, I just wanted to drop you a note of encouragement. I've read many
          > of your articles over the years and noticed that more and more you truly
          > are evidencing "A Puritan's Mind." I'm especially pleased that you've
          > reconsidered your position on infant baptism, adopting the Westminster
          > Standards, and the Solemn League and Covenant. I appreciated your
          > article on the Pope, too. Tell me, are you convinced that the
          > Confession's statement on the Pope is true, that the Pope is THE
          > predicted Antichrist, THAT Man of Sin?"
          >
          > That would be more like my style.
          >
          > > My posts to you were never about McMahon's "direction." You said he
          > > had apparently _COME AROUND_ to the Pope being antichrist.
          >
          > Apparently was the word I used. Yes. So sorry it caused you so much
          > offense. ;)
          >
          > gmw.
          >
          >
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        • gmw
          Well, thank you for the compliment, and for the prayers. You might arnot know it by our current discussion, but I consider Keith and me to be buds! gmw.
          Message 4 of 8 , Jun 7, 2005
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            Well, thank you for the compliment, and for the prayers. You might
            arnot know it by our current discussion, but I consider Keith and me
            to be buds!

            gmw.

            --- In covenantedreformationclub@yahoogroups.com, personalwg@c... wrote:
            > Interesting dialogue. Nicely written Gerry! You and Keith are in my
            > prayers.
            >
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