10950Re: [Covenanted Reformation] Re: Historic Presbypics
- Sep 1, 2004Dear Riley;
Do you know who your session is descended from, in the sense of what part of
the Church, during the times of Cameron? This is an important question, for
if they stood not with Cameron during that time, they would need to repent
publicly for the sins against Christ and brethern ...you must understand
this already, from your studies right? I mean the principle found over and
over in scripture of those confessing the sins of their forefathers. My
elders were faced with this when they first became aware of that great wrong
done three hundred years ago.
It would be most wonderful if your session would study this, and come to
love the reformers as you seem to.
But Riley, if you continue in the way you are going, and your session does
not follow in agreement with you. You'll find you'll be at a cross road of
decision just like Cameron and Cargill came to. You'll have to leave your
session, or continue to be a part of that compromise.
Anyway, I'm sure some of the men on the list could give a better account for
what should be done and said on this topic.
Riley, by the Lord's mercy, may no wavering be found in you or I !
Peace be to the brethern, and love with faith, from God the Father and the
Lord Jesus Christ, Grace be with all them that love our Lord Jesus Christ
in sicerity, Amen.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Dan Fraas" <fraasrd@...>
Sent: Tuesday, August 31, 2004 10:00 PM
Subject: [Covenanted Reformation] Re: Historic Presbypics
> --- In firstname.lastname@example.org, "Soles"
> <dsranch@y...> wrote:
> > Riley this is very good that you found the whole to be agreeable.
> > And please understand that I'm not trying to catch you out or
> anything with
> > this next question. Would your session be in total agreement with
> the paper?
> Of course I can't say for sure. I know they would agree with a great
> deal of it. Our pastor has briefly used Cameron's story (and those
> of other covenanters) to illustrate some of the truths of Scripture
> in his sermons. He's also preached on the biblical model of
> presbyterial church government as a divine ordinance. So I believe
> our session would find a great deal of agreement with this article.
> I've never discussed with them the proper grounds and justification
> for resisting the civil power by force, but I know at least our
> pastor thinks it can be justified in some cases. In discussing the
> original Westminster Confession, chap 23, section 3 it seems from
> talking to each of our elders that they would agree with me in
> preferring the original to the revised portion from the American
> However I will say that as far as politics go it's not something that
> our session ever brings up in a teaching setting, except to exhort us
> not to put our hope in governments on earth or human politicians, but
> to seek a better country and to be prepared to endure persecution if
> and when it comes. I'd say there's a general feeling that our
> original US constitution has flaws but its a moot point to debate
> about the civil laws when we can't even get the politicians to follow
> the laws that are written.
> Blessings in Christ,
> > Thanks for responding so quickly.
> > ~Cathie~
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Dan Fraas" <fraasrd@y...>
> > To: <email@example.com>
> > Sent: Tuesday, August 31, 2004 8:11 PM
> > Subject: [Covenanted Reformation] Re: Historic Presbypics
> > >
> > > > So now, I'll just ask you if you are in agreement with the paper
> > > that
> > > > Cargill and Cameron framed?
> > > >
> > > > Titled*** The Queensferry Paper, June 4th 1680*** this can be
> > > at
> > > > http://www.truecovenanter.com/ look part way down till you see
> > > > it listed under Documents of the United Societies.
> > >
> > > Dear Cathie,
> > >
> > > Thank you for providing that great reading! I thoroughly enjoyed
> > > it. I found the whole to be agreeable.
> > >
> > > Riley
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