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RE: [cooking_rumpolt] Hello

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  • otsisto
    Though I do not know what trachten is in German, in Dutch I think I have heard it to mean something like to try or try to ... But that would be a modern
    Message 1 of 13 , Jun 28, 2007
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      Though I do not know what trachten is in German, in Dutch I think I have
      heard it to mean something like "to try" or "try to"...
      But that would be a modern def.

      De

      -----Original Message-----
      Wow.. I only created the group a few minutes ago, and there were already
      three people
      waiting for approval! Maybe this IS a good idea.

      My first question, how exactly do you translate Trachten?

      Ranvaig
    • ranvaig@columbus.rr.com
      I seem to have accidentally deleted my first message. We have seven members already. I m amazed at the response. I asked how to translate Trachten , as it is
      Message 2 of 13 , Jun 28, 2007
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        I seem to have accidentally deleted my first message.

        We have seven members already. I'm amazed at the response.

        I asked how to translate "Trachten", as it is repeated in each section of Rumpolt. How is a "Trachten" different than a "Speise"?
        Vom Ochsen seind drei und achtzigerlei Speise und Trachten zu machen.

        Ranvaig
      • Kerri Martinsen
        Can you use it in a sentence? Vitha
        Message 3 of 13 , Jun 28, 2007
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          Can you use it in a sentence?
           
          Vitha

           
          On 6/28/07, otsisto <otsisto@...> wrote:
          Though I do not know what trachten is in German, in Dutch I think I have
          heard it to mean something like "to try" or "try to"...
          But that would be a modern def.

          De

          -----Original Message-----
          Wow.. I only created the group a few minutes ago, and there were already
          three people
          waiting for approval!  Maybe this IS a good idea.

          My first question, how exactly do you translate Trachten?

          Ranvaig






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        • Kerri Martinsen
          ok - love this website: http://dict.leo.org/?lang=de LEO is pretty good for modern translation- gives you at least a ball park idea (much better than
          Message 4 of 13 , Jun 28, 2007
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            ok - love this website:
             
            LEO is pretty good for modern translation- gives you at least a ball park idea (much better than Babelfish, etc).
             
            Trachten would be "to try, aspire, endeavor, to seek out"
            Speise = "to dispatch food" or just "food"
             
             
            so ...food and aspire to make...??
             
            Vitha
            (Who took german a LOOOOOONNNNGGG time ago...)

             
            On 6/28/07, ranvaig@... <ranvaig@...> wrote:
            I seem to have accidentally deleted my first message.

            We have seven members already.  I'm amazed at the response.

            I asked how to translate "Trachten", as it is repeated in each section of Rumpolt.  How is a "Trachten" different than a "Speise"?
            Vom Ochsen seind drei und achtzigerlei Speise und Trachten zu machen.

            Ranvaig



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          • tgrcat2001
            I will try to check the Fruehneuhochdeutsche dictionary when I get home but I dont belive in this context it means to try. Trachten (being capitalized) is a
            Message 5 of 13 , Jun 28, 2007
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              I will try to check the Fruehneuhochdeutsche dictionary when I get
              home but I dont belive in this context it means to try.

              Trachten (being capitalized) is a noun just like Speise. Speise is
              indeed food or a dish of food (Nachspeise is dessert literally after
              food.) Trachten modernly is the word for the native costumes, such
              as the Dirndel, Leo also lists livery and dressing as possible
              translations. Im not sure any of them really fit in this context.

              In Service
              Gwen Cat

              --- In cooking_rumpolt@yahoogroups.com, "Kerri Martinsen"
              <kerri.martinsen@...> wrote:
              >
              > ok - love this website:
              > http://dict.leo.org/?lang=de
              >
              > LEO is pretty good for modern translation- gives you at least a
              ball park
              > idea (much better than Babelfish, etc).
              >
              > Trachten would be "to try, aspire, endeavor, to seek out"
              > Speise = "to dispatch food" or just "food"
              >
              >
              > so ...food and aspire to make...??
              >
              > Vitha
              > (Who took german a LOOOOOONNNNGGG time ago...)
              >
              >
              > On 6/28/07, ranvaig@... <ranvaig@...> wrote:
              > >
              > > I seem to have accidentally deleted my first message.
              > >
              > > We have seven members already. I'm amazed at the response.
              > >
              > > I asked how to translate "Trachten", as it is repeated in each
              section of
              > > Rumpolt. How is a "Trachten" different than a "Speise"?
              > > Vom Ochsen seind drei und achtzigerlei Speise und Trachten zu
              machen.
              > >
              > > Ranvaig
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > > Yahoo! Groups Links
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              >
            • ranvaig@columbus.rr.com
              ... Yes, that is a good site. I am fond of this dictionary, because it uses a sound alike search, which is often able to look up the non-standard spelling of
              Message 6 of 13 , Jun 28, 2007
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                ><http://dict.leo.org/?lang=de>http://dict.leo.org/?lang=de

                Yes, that is a good site.

                I am fond of this dictionary, because it uses a "sound alike" search, which is often able to look up the non-standard spelling of Rumpolt.
                http://dict.tu-chemnitz.de/dings.cgi?lang=en;service=deen

                >Trachten would be "to try, aspire, endeavor, to seek out"
                >Speise = "to dispatch food" or just "food"
                >
                >so ...food and aspire to make...??

                Vom Ochsen seind drei und achtzigerlei Speise und Trachten zu machen.

                I think it needs to be a noun, not a verb. From the Ox there are 38 dishes and Trachten to make. A similar statement is at the beginning of each chapter. As a noun, Trachten now means costumes, garb, or liveries, which doesn't make sense in this context. Like Speise, it's some kind of collective noun for food, but I'd like to know the exact sense of it.

                Ranvaig
              • Kerri Martinsen
                Maybe Traditional Food ? Kind of like homecooking Flat out guessing here, but it kindof makes sense. Vitha
                Message 7 of 13 , Jun 28, 2007
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                  Maybe "Traditional Food"? Kind of like "homecooking"
                   
                  Flat out guessing here, but it kindof makes sense.
                   
                  Vitha
                   

                  >Trachten would be "to try, aspire, endeavor, to seek out"
                  >Speise = "to dispatch food" or just "food"
                  >
                  >so ...food and aspire to make...??

                  Vom Ochsen seind drei und achtzigerlei Speise und Trachten zu machen.

                  I think it needs to be a noun, not a verb.  From the Ox there are 38 dishes and Trachten to make.  A similar statement is at the beginning of each chapter.  As a noun, Trachten now means costumes, garb, or liveries, which doesn't make sense in this context.  Like Speise, it's some kind of collective noun for food, but I'd like to know the exact sense of it.

                  Ranvaig



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                • grasse@mscd.edu
                  It might be something like home cooking or traditional stuff Im tempted to think it might mean fancy presentation but I have no real proof in any
                  Message 8 of 13 , Jun 28, 2007
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                    It might be something like home cooking or 'traditional stuff' Im
                    tempted to think it might mean 'fancy presentation' but I have no real
                    proof in any direction. I will check that nice little dictionary that
                    has solved a number of mysteries before, but since I frankly skipped
                    that word in the bits I have translated , Im guessing it was not in
                    there.

                    In Service and delighted to be in a group like this - BRILLIANT Ranveig!
                    Gwen Cat

                    ----- Original Message -----
                    From: Kerri Martinsen <kerri.martinsen@...>
                    Date: Thursday, June 28, 2007 10:32 am
                    Subject: Re: [cooking_rumpolt] Hello

                    > Maybe "Traditional Food"? Kind of like "homecooking"
                    >
                    > Flat out guessing here, but it kindof makes sense.
                    >
                    > Vitha
                    >
                    >
                    > >
                    > > >Trachten would be "to try, aspire, endeavor, to seek out"
                    > > >Speise = "to dispatch food" or just "food"
                    > > >
                    > > >so ...food and aspire to make...??
                    > >
                    > > Vom Ochsen seind drei und achtzigerlei Speise und Trachten zu
                    > machen.>
                    > > I think it needs to be a noun, not a verb. From the Ox there
                    > are 38
                    > > dishes and Trachten to make. A similar statement is at the
                    > beginning of
                    > > each chapter. As a noun, Trachten now means costumes, garb, or
                    > liveries,> which doesn't make sense in this context. Like Speise,
                    > it's some kind of
                    > > collective noun for food, but I'd like to know the exact sense
                    > of it.
                    > >
                    > > Ranvaig
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > Yahoo! Groups Links
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    >
                  • otsisto
                    I don t speak Dutch but I picked up the meaning in a conversation once. She was fumbling around for the English word for trachten and to try was what it was.
                    Message 9 of 13 , Jun 28, 2007
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                      I don't speak Dutch but I picked up the meaning in a conversation once. She was fumbling around for the English word for trachten and "to try" was what it was.
                      So to equate with the subject and not knowing the original source for the question.
                      "Here are some recipes for you to try"
                       
                      De
                      -----Original Message-----
                      Can you use it in a sentence?
                       
                      Vitha

                       
                    • Serena da Riva
                      ... when I get home but I dont belive in this context it means to try. Greetings, When checking this dictionary, would it be possible for you to pass along
                      Message 10 of 13 , Jun 28, 2007
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                        --- In cooking_rumpolt@yahoogroups.com, "tgrcat2001" <grasse@...> wrote:
                        >
                        > Gwen Cat> I will try to check the Fruehneuhochdeutsche dictionary
                        when I get home but I dont belive in this context it means to try.

                        Greetings,

                        When checking this dictionary, would it be possible for you to pass
                        along the ISBN number. I very much need such a dictionary but have
                        been unable to locate one.

                        Glad Tidings,
                        Serena da Riva
                      • ranvaig@columbus.rr.com
                        ... That would make sense, that Spiese are regular dishes and Trachten the fancy ones.. the ones you endeavor, strive, worked harder for, the subtleties.
                        Message 11 of 13 , Jun 28, 2007
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                          > Im tempted to think it might mean 'fancy presentation' but I have no real
                          >proof in any direction.

                          That would make sense, that Spiese are regular dishes and Trachten the fancy ones.. the ones you endeavor, strive, worked harder for, the subtleties. Especially since the book is aimed at the cooks for kings, and lords and such, and so many of the dishes ARE fancy.

                          Ranvaig
                        • tgrcat2001
                          ... have no real ... the fancy ones.. the ones you endeavor, strive, worked harder for, the subtleties. Especially since the book is aimed at the cooks for
                          Message 12 of 13 , Jun 28, 2007
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                            --- In cooking_rumpolt@yahoogroups.com, ranvaig@... wrote:
                            >
                            > > Im tempted to think it might mean 'fancy presentation' but I
                            have no real
                            > >proof in any direction.
                            >
                            > That would make sense, that Spiese are regular dishes and Trachten
                            the fancy ones.. the ones you endeavor, strive, worked harder for,
                            the subtleties. Especially since the book is aimed at the cooks for
                            kings, and lords and such, and so many of the dishes ARE fancy.
                            >

                            Ok, so here is what the dictionary says:
                            trachten = handeln (as in bargaining I think)
                            trachtung = tracht, kleidung (clothing)
                            HOWEVER
                            tracht, drag, trahte F (feminine) 1. Getreide, Nahrungsmittel; 2.
                            Gericht, Essen Speise.

                            In other words FOOD ;-) Specifically translated :
                            1) grains, foodstuffs 2) Dish, food, dish (sorry Gericht and Speise
                            are too similar for me to differentiate this time of night. I would
                            say Speise is fancier, Gericht is more what mom makes. A word
                            for 'dining' is speisen, as opposed to eating or essen.

                            This information is taken from my most useful book:
                            Kleines fruehneuhochdeutsches Woerterbuch by Christa Baufeld,
                            published by Niemeyer. 3-484-10268-3

                            So, I would think it is two different words for dishes. There are
                            times I think Rumpolt is trying to sound impressive so he uses 2
                            words where one would do.

                            In Service
                            Gwen Cat
                            ps am helping some friends do a whole spit roasted hog tomorrow, so
                            likely no computer access, Saturday is a Fencing tourney (Talons of
                            Fury) and Sunday I have renfair tix, so I may be really out of touch
                            till Monday (too bad, cause this is FUN!)
                          • tgrcat2001
                            ... Done (in the other post) with the caveat, that I purchased this book at Dr. Glonings reccomendation (note to self, update the weblinks AGAIN dagnabit) when
                            Message 13 of 13 , Jun 28, 2007
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                              --- In cooking_rumpolt@yahoogroups.com, "Serena da Riva"
                              <bobvox8@...> wrote:
                              >
                              > --- In cooking_rumpolt@yahoogroups.com, "tgrcat2001" <grasse@>
                              wrote:
                              > >
                              > > Gwen Cat> I will try to check the Fruehneuhochdeutsche dictionary
                              > when I get home but I dont belive in this context it means to try.
                              >
                              > Greetings,
                              >
                              > When checking this dictionary, would it be possible for you to pass
                              > along the ISBN number. I very much need such a dictionary but have
                              > been unable to locate one.
                              >
                              > Glad Tidings,
                              > Serena da Riva
                              >

                              Done (in the other post)
                              with the caveat, that I purchased this book at Dr. Glonings
                              reccomendation (note to self, update the weblinks AGAIN dagnabit)
                              when I got serious about Rumpolt (so more than 7 years ago...)

                              In Service
                              Gwen Cat
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