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Re: Honeymoons (and other conlang related wedding stuff)

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  • Charles W Brickner
    ... Behalf Of Daniel Burgener ... Congratulations! ... it? Among the four Peoples of Sefdaania who practice marriage, the concept of honeymoon does not
    Message 1 of 12 , Jul 1, 2012
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      >From: Constructed Languages List [mailto:CONLANG@...] On
      Behalf Of Daniel Burgener

      >So, I got married last Saturday and just returned from my honeymoon. :)

      Congratulations!

      >What are your cultures wedding traditions (if you have marriage),
      >particularly related to any sort of "honeymoon" concept?
      >If you have such a concept, what "word" or "words" do you use to describe
      it?

      Among the four Peoples of Sefdaania who practice marriage, the concept of
      "honeymoon" does not exist. After the marriage ceremony, which combines
      both religious and civil elements, the newlyweds repair to their new home to
      begin their married life. There is not time for extended periods of leisure
      in these subsistence cultures.

      Charlie
    • Daniel Burgener
      ... ...and... Congratulations! ... Thanks! And congratulations to you as well, Logan! Similarly, the conculture of Mev Pailom is me and my now-wife, but I
      Message 2 of 12 , Jul 1, 2012
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        >
        > Congratulations! I got married on the 8th and returned on the 15th. It
        > is most pleasant.
        >

        ...and...

        Congratulations!
        >

        Thanks! And congratulations to you as well, Logan!

        Similarly, the "conculture" of Mev Pailom is me and my now-wife, but I
        > also completely missed out on creating an expression for "honeymoon".
        > I suppose because it didn't really seem particularly necessary. We
        > just kind of went on a trip and talked about the things that we were
        > doing on the trip without actually giving the whole time period a
        > name.
        > Actually, the development of the language as a whole has been
        > unexpectedly stalled; I was hoping we'd have more time to work on it
        > once wedding stuff was over with, but real life seems to have had
        > other plans and we fell out of using it for casual conversation.


        Yeah, wedding stuff did the exact same thing to us.... It's a busy time.

        Gwr marriages are more like ours, always M+F, and they have a honeymoon
        > period called _jung (lo) tèy (hi-falling)_ [dZuN tæj] 'sweet month'. The
        > couple will usually be acquainted, but definitely not sexually intimate.
        > They avoid weddings in the winter, because of the cold and difficult
        > travel, but wealthy people might go south to one of the Kash nations where
        > it would be warm. In the summer, the couple might go to the mountains. I
        > don't think there's an equivalent of Niagara Falls :-)))
        >
        > Prevli marriages, unlike the Kash, are mostly religious, carried out by a
        > shaman, and are M+F.The couple may or may not be acquainted (arranged
        > marriages were once the rule, but are less common now) and probably not
        > sexually intimate. They might go to one of the larger Kash town nearby, or
        > many just go camp out in the forest for a while. Although they've had very
        > little contact with the Gwr, they use the same term: shurak yulkü 'month
        > sweet'.
        >

        Interesting! Is the honeymoon period a month long? That sounds pretty
        nice to me... :)
      • Padraic Brown
        ... Ande, westhal ye allez! As for honeymoons in Auntimoanye, most folks don t drag out the whole affair after the marriage. There s no concept of a fortnight
        Message 3 of 12 , Jul 1, 2012
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          --- On Sun, 7/1/12, Daniel Burgener <burgener.daniel@...> wrote:

          > > Congratulations! I got married on the 8th and returned
          > on the 15th. It
          > > is most pleasant.
          > >
          >
          > ...and...
          >
          > Congratulations!

          Ande, westhal ye allez!

          As for honeymoons in Auntimoanye, most folks don't drag out the whole
          affair after the marriage. There's no concept of a fortnight holiday
          down on the sunny beaches of Panpam. The word itself does exist: maltalthus
          and means, literally, the time of honey; but it has the older sense of
          a time of sweetness and warm fuzzies that accompany the new relationship
          rather than the newer sense of a postnuptial trip. There is also the word
          maltmênô and literally is "honey moon". But, as the sceuves tell us: swo
          wunnet wahhse se mênô all swo wunnet wane se mênô. Meaning "give em a
          month and they'll be as out of love as they were just in!"

          Now, where they have the parties is beforehand. There's always a feast
          during the trothplighting, on the anniversary and then during the wedding
          itself (i.e., two years after). The trothplighting and the wedding
          themselves always take place as part of the feast, rather than as separate
          events.

          Padraic

          > >
          >
          > Thanks!  And congratulations to you as well, Logan!
          >
          > Similarly, the "conculture" of Mev Pailom is me and my
          > now-wife, but I
          > > also completely missed out on creating an expression
          > for "honeymoon".
          > > I suppose because it didn't really seem particularly
          > necessary. We
          > > just kind of went on a trip and talked about the things
          > that we were
          > > doing on the trip without actually giving the whole
          > time period a
          > > name.
          > > Actually, the development of the language as a whole
          > has been
          > > unexpectedly stalled; I was hoping we'd have more time
          > to work on it
          > > once wedding stuff was over with, but real life seems
          > to have had
          > > other plans and we fell out of using it for casual
          > conversation.
          >
          >
          > Yeah, wedding stuff did the exact same thing to us.... 
          > It's a busy time.
          >
          > Gwr marriages are more like ours, always M+F, and they have
          > a honeymoon
          > > period called _jung (lo) tèy (hi-falling)_ [dZuN tæj]
          > 'sweet month'. The
          > > couple will usually be acquainted, but definitely not
          > sexually intimate.
          > > They avoid weddings in the winter, because of the cold
          > and difficult
          > > travel, but wealthy people might go south to one of the
          > Kash nations where
          > > it would be warm. In the summer, the couple might go to
          > the mountains. I
          > > don't think there's an equivalent of Niagara Falls
          > :-)))
          > >
          > > Prevli marriages, unlike the Kash, are mostly
          > religious, carried out by a
          > > shaman, and are M+F.The couple may or may not be
          > acquainted (arranged
          > > marriages were once the rule, but are less common now)
          > and probably not
          > > sexually intimate. They might go to one of the larger
          > Kash town nearby, or
          > > many just go camp out in the forest for a while.
          > Although they've had very
          > > little contact with the Gwr, they use the same term:
          > shurak yulkü 'month
          > > sweet'.
          > >
          >
          > Interesting!  Is the honeymoon period a month
          > long?  That sounds pretty
          > nice to me... :)
          >
        • Douglas Koller
          ... Félicitations! ... Of the languages I m familiar with, there seems to be a whole lot of calquing going on since this is a relatively new concept, and a
          Message 4 of 12 , Jul 1, 2012
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            > Date: Sat, 30 Jun 2012 14:04:00 -0400
            > From: burgener.daniel@...
            > Subject: Honeymoons (and other conlang related wedding stuff)
            > To: CONLANG@...

            > So, I got married last Saturday and just returned from my honeymoon. :)

            Félicitations!

            > question: What are your cultures wedding traditions (if you have
            > marriage), particularly related to any sort of "honeymoon" concept? If you
            > have such a concept, what "word" or "words" do you use to describe it?

            Of the languages I'm familiar with, there seems to be a whole lot of calquing going on since this is a relatively new concept, and a trip to Wiki seems to bear this out. And so the Géarthnuns word will be "uspíetöirhíans", the calque of "honey-moon". Many languages also seem to have another word for the concept of the wedding trip, so we'll add that, too:
            "araupímaths." I suppose, in a pinch, one could also throw in "haunímuns" or "hönímuns" if one wanted to say where it came from, or for humorous effect, but I shan't rush to add that to the lexicon.

            Dutch, Norwegian, and, Danish seem to have white bread flitting about in the concept -- wonder what that's about (thrown about like rice?). And speaking of flitting, under the German "Flitterwochen", they mention that it's not related to "sequins", although that would make honeymoons absolutely FABulous, but that it's from an older term "gevlitter" meaning "heimliches Lachen", which I originally took to mean "homely laughter". When I looked up "heimlich" in the dictionary, however, I found it meant "secret(ive)". "Secretive laughter" sounds to me like newlywed tee-hee-heeing under the covers during the honeymoon. Still, I do like the notion of "homely laughter" and that will be a new Géarthnuns word. Less pressing would be a word for tee-hee-heeing under the covers, but that's a fun concept, too -- it could happen.

            Meanwhile, I don't know if there is *any* connection, but one of the Czech words for 'honeymoon' is "líbánky", which reminds me of "libum". That word came into Géarthnuns a while ago as "líbuns" and I wanted to have libums (or liba?) in the Géarthtörs culture like the Japanese have もち (mochi), perhaps in a pile at New Year's (Google "libum" and there's a nice picture of a few with some bay leaves (à la kagami mochi with orange and greenery) -- one day I will try my hand at making these). But since it's a honey-based cake, why not *also* have that kick off the honeymoon with a snort of mead ("uspíetemníaks")? That's as far forward as I've moved the idea.

            Kou
          • Charles W Brickner
            ... Of course, calquing! Although the concept of the honeymoon did not exist in the original culture, contemporary speakers of Senjecas have made the
            Message 5 of 12 , Jul 1, 2012
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              >From: Constructed Languages List [mailto:CONLANG@...] On Behalf Of Douglas Koller
              >Subject: Re: Honeymoons (and other conlang related wedding stuff)

              >Of the languages I'm familiar with, there seems to be a whole lot of calquing going on....

              Of course, calquing! Although the concept of the honeymoon did not exist in the original culture, contemporary speakers of Senjecas have made the requisite calque:

              Dutch, Norwegian, and, Danish seem to have white bread flitting about in the concept -- wonder what that's about (thrown about like rice?). And speaking of flitting, under the German "Flitterwochen", they mention that it's not related to "sequins", although that would make honeymoons absolutely FABulous, but that it's from an older term "gevlitter" meaning "heimliches Lachen", which I originally took to mean "homely laughter". When I looked up "heimlich" in the dictionary, however, I found it meant "secret(ive)". "Secretive laughter" sounds to me like newlywed tee-hee-heeing under the covers during the honeymoon. Still, I do like the notion of "homely laughter" and that will be a new Géarthnuns word. Less pressing would be a word for tee-hee-heeing under the covers, but that's a fun concept, too -- it could happen.

              Meanwhile, I don't know if there is *any* connection, but one of the Czech words for 'honeymoon' is "líbánky", which reminds me of "libum". That word came into Géarthnuns a while ago as "líbuns" and I wanted to have libums (or liba?) in the Géarthtörs culture like the Japanese have もち (mochi), perhaps in a pile at New Year's (Google "libum" and there's a nice picture of a few with some bay leaves (à la kagami mochi with orange and greenery) -- one day I will try my hand at making these). But since it's a honey-based cake, why not *also* have that kick off the honeymoon with a snort of mead ("uspíetemníaks")? That's as far forward as I've moved the idea.

              Kou
            • Charles W Brickner
              ... Putting the send button right under the paste button does not seem to work well for me. Sorry for the previous incomplete sending. ... Of course,
              Message 6 of 12 , Jul 1, 2012
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                >From: Constructed Languages List [mailto:CONLANG@...] On Behalf Of Douglas Koller
                >Subject: Re: Honeymoons (and other conlang related wedding stuff)

                Putting the "send" button right under the "paste" button does not seem to work well for me. Sorry for the previous incomplete sending.

                >Of the languages I'm familiar with, there seems to be a whole lot of calquing going on....

                Of course, calquing! Although the concept of the honeymoon did not exist in the original Sefdaanian culture, contemporary speakers of Senjecas have made the requisite calque: mèliþmę́nsas < melítos, honey, and mę́nses, moon. The root melit- undergoes lenition before the <m>. Mę́nses, moon, is in the -es animate declension, but as an expression of time is put in the -as abstraction declension.

                >When I looked up "heimlich" in the dictionary, however, I found it meant "secret(ive)".
                >"Secretive laughter" sounds to me like newlywed tee-hee-heeing under the covers during the honeymoon.

                Maybe it's akin to Brenda Lee's "sweet nothings"!

                Charlie
              • Matthew Turnbull
                @ Daniel: congratulations! Jorayn speaking people have temporary mariages that have to be renewed every year and that typically would happen in summer. Thrre
                Message 7 of 12 , Jul 3, 2012
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                  @ Daniel: congratulations! Jorayn speaking people have temporary mariages
                  that have to be renewed every year and that typically would happen in
                  summer. Thrre wouldn't really be a honeymoon, so I suspect they would call
                  the honey moon either lun da miiyel or some kind of calque.

                  @Roger: Winnipeg used to have a really, really nice world class beach a
                  couple hours away...and stuff is really cheap here I guess. I don't think
                  it's normally any cooler here than in South Dakota in June (wikipedia seems
                  to agree) but maybe I underestimate the heat in South Dakota.
                  On 2012-06-30 1:04 PM, "Daniel Burgener" <burgener.daniel@...> wrote:

                  > So, I got married last Saturday and just returned from my honeymoon. :)
                  >
                  > The maid of honor purchased for my wife and I towels that say "his" and
                  > "hers" in our group conlang, Brenjak, and immediately after the ceremony
                  > one of my groomsmen congratulated us with:
                  >
                  > "pakunku'o iv la'op"
                  > 2.pl-go-imp-eternal associated-with joy
                  >
                  > He translated it as "Go forward eternally with joy", which is a fair
                  > translation, although "iv" conveys a more close association than "with",
                  > it's more of an "associated with", as though people would say "oh, Daniel,
                  > he's the joyful one".
                  >
                  > Anyways, while I was on my honeymoon, it got me thinking about what word to
                  > use for "honeymoon" in Brenjak. The "conculture" of the lang is my and my
                  > friends, so we definitely should have a word for that concept, but I don't
                  > have much in the way of thoughts about coining one. This leads me to a
                  > question: What are your cultures wedding traditions (if you have
                  > marriage), particularly related to any sort of "honeymoon" concept? If you
                  > have such a concept, what "word" or "words" do you use to describe it?
                  >
                  > -Daniel
                  >
                • Douglas Koller
                  ... Brenda Lee s a *little* before my time. Perhaps Pillow Talk , a film with Doris Day and Rock Hudson, also before my time, but as my step-mother is an
                  Message 8 of 12 , Jul 3, 2012
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                    > Date: Sun, 1 Jul 2012 20:26:00 -0400
                    > From: tepeyachill@...
                    > Subject: Re: Honeymoons (and other conlang related wedding stuff)
                    > To: CONLANG@...

                    > >From: Constructed Languages List [mailto:CONLANG@...] On Behalf Of Douglas Koller
                    > >Subject: Re: Honeymoons (and other conlang related wedding stuff)

                    > >When I looked up "heimlich" in the dictionary, however, I found it meant "secret(ive)".
                    > >"Secretive laughter" sounds to me like newlywed tee-hee-heeing under the covers during the honeymoon.

                    > Maybe it's akin to Brenda Lee's "sweet nothings"!

                    Brenda Lee's a *little* before my time. Perhaps "Pillow Talk", a film with Doris Day and Rock Hudson, also before my time, but as my step-mother is an aficionada of all things Doris, I've seen it enough times to be able to lip-synch many of the lines along with the characters.

                    Or perhaps, "bill and coo". But I'm still musing on a term for "homely laughter".

                    Kou
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