## Re: Strictly OT - conworlding with 92% or thereabouts commonality with curren...

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• In a message dated 1/4/2008 3:50:28 AM Central Standard Time, ... How are basic physical laws connected with a mathematical counting progression? stevo
Message 1 of 6 , Jan 4, 2008
In a message dated 1/4/2008 3:50:28 AM Central Standard Time,
wes.parish@... writes:

> What I'm thinking of is a skewed set of basic physical laws where the basic
> mathematical progression is not the binary one-two-plusone-plusone-plusone...
> into infinity, but instead the integer prime sequence having prime importance
> and the binary sequence being of secondary importance.
>

How are basic physical laws connected with a mathematical counting
progression?

stevo </HTML>
• ... Sorry I m late in responding - tech difficulties. ;) As I see it, mathematics is the interface - if we can call it that - of the engine that drives the
Message 2 of 6 , Jan 6, 2008

> In a message dated 1/4/2008 3:50:28 AM Central Standard Time,
> wes.parish@... writes:
>
>
> > What I'm thinking of is a skewed set of basic physical laws where the
> basic
> > mathematical progression is not the binary
> one-two-plusone-plusone-plusone...
> > into infinity, but instead the integer prime sequence having prime
> importance
> > and the binary sequence being of secondary importance.
> >
>
> How are basic physical laws connected with a mathematical counting
> progression?

Sorry I'm late in responding - tech difficulties. ;)

As I see it, mathematics is the "interface" - if we can call it that - of the
"engine" that drives the universe/s.

So a mathematics that privileges the prime numbers instead of the base-two,
would have a much greater range of physical variation/s than a universe with the
opposite focus. A much more detailed explanation of the idea can be found in
Morris Kline's "Mathematics for the Nonmathematician", dealing with the concept
of non-Euclidian geometries.

At any rate, that's what I'm working on, and my stories seem to involve memories
of some physics experimenters who spent their time and lives trying to survive
in threespace, avoiding bifurcation/trifurcation and fractalization - though
there is an ancient curse on troublemakers, wishing them the worst John, Ivanna
and Johanna can do them.

Just my 0.02c worth!

Wesley Parish
>
> stevo </HTML>
>

"Sharpened hands are happy hands.
"Brim the tinfall with mirthful bands"
- A Deepness in the Sky, Vernor Vinge

"I me. Shape middled me. I would come out into hot!"
I from the spicy that day was overcasked mockingly - it's a symbol of the
other horizon. - emacs : meta x dissociated-press
• In a message dated 1/6/2008 5:08:19 AM Central Standard Time, ... Mathematics doesn t privilege any particular. Numbers don t have a base, until and unless
Message 3 of 6 , Jan 6, 2008
In a message dated 1/6/2008 5:08:19 AM Central Standard Time,
wes.parish@... writes:

> As I see it, mathematics is the "interface" - if we can call it that - of
> the
> "engine" that drives the universe/s.
>
> So a mathematics that privileges the prime numbers instead of the base-two,
> would have a much greater range of physical variation/s than a universe with
> the
> opposite focus. A much more detailed explanation of the idea can be found in
> Morris Kline's "Mathematics for the Nonmathematician", dealing with the
> concept
> of non-Euclidian geometries.
>
> At any rate, that's what I'm working on, and my stories seem to involve
> memories
> of some physics experimenters who spent their time and lives trying to
> survive
> in threespace, avoiding bifurcation/trifurcation and fractalization - though
> there is an ancient curse on troublemakers, wishing them the worst John,
> Ivanna
> and Johanna can do them.
>
Mathematics doesn't 'privilege' any particular. Numbers don't have a base,
until and unless someone chooses a base to express them in.
Prime numbers are still just numbers, and they don't have an inherent base
either. Perhaps the mathematicians (or everyone) in your conworld use primes
for the basis of math, but I don't see how it can be an inherent feature of the
math itself.

stevo
</HTML>
• In a message dated 1/6/2008 9:10:12 AM Central Standard Time, ... ... any particular base. stevo
Message 4 of 6 , Jan 6, 2008
In a message dated 1/6/2008 9:10:12 AM Central Standard Time,

> Mathematics doesn't 'privilege' any particular.

... any particular base.

stevo

</HTML>
• ... I don t fully understand what he s talking about, but my impression is that he s not using base two in the usual sense. ... mathematical progression is
Message 5 of 6 , Jan 7, 2008
On Jan 6, 2008 8:02 AM, <MorphemeAddict@...> wrote:
> In a message dated 1/6/2008 5:08:19 AM Central Standard Time,
> wes.parish@... writes:

> > So a mathematics that privileges the prime numbers instead of the base-two,
> > would have a much greater range of physical variation/s than a universe with
> > the
> > opposite focus. A much more detailed explanation of the idea can be
> Mathematics doesn't 'privilege' any particular. Numbers don't have a base,
> until and unless someone chooses a base to express them in.

I don't fully understand what he's talking about, but my impression
is that he's not using "base two" in the usual sense.
He wrote in his original post:

>>What I'm thinking of is a skewed set of basic physical laws where the basic
mathematical progression is not the binary one-two-plusone-plusone-plusone...
into infinity, but instead the integer prime sequence having prime importance
and the binary sequence being of secondary importance.
<<

I can't figure out what he's talking about exactly, -- do the primes
exist without being embedded in and defined by
the sequence of natural numbers, in his world? --
but he doesn't seem to be using "binary" and "base two"
in the usual sense to denote a notational method, but rather
to denote the counting numbers or natural numbers as
opposed to the primes.

Wesley, can you explain further?

--
Jim Henry
http://www.pobox.com/~jimhenry
• ... My concept, idea, whathaveyou, comes from something I realized after taking up mathematics for a degree about ten years ago - that half of the integers
Message 6 of 6 , Jan 8, 2008
Quoting Jim Henry <jimhenry1973@...>:

> On Jan 6, 2008 8:02 AM, <MorphemeAddict@...> wrote:
> > In a message dated 1/6/2008 5:08:19 AM Central Standard Time,
> > wes.parish@... writes:
>
> > > So a mathematics that privileges the prime numbers instead of the
> base-two,
> > > would have a much greater range of physical variation/s than a
> universe with
> > > the
> > > opposite focus. A much more detailed explanation of the idea can be
> > Mathematics doesn't 'privilege' any particular. Numbers don't have a
> base,
> > until and unless someone chooses a base to express them in.
>
> I don't fully understand what he's talking about, but my impression
> is that he's not using "base two" in the usual sense.
> He wrote in his original post:
>
> >>What I'm thinking of is a skewed set of basic physical laws where the
> basic
> mathematical progression is not the binary
> one-two-plusone-plusone-plusone...
> into infinity, but instead the integer prime sequence having prime
> importance
> and the binary sequence being of secondary importance.
> <<
>
> I can't figure out what he's talking about exactly, -- do the primes
> exist without being embedded in and defined by
> the sequence of natural numbers, in his world? --
> but he doesn't seem to be using "binary" and "base two"
> in the usual sense to denote a notational method, but rather
> to denote the counting numbers or natural numbers as
> opposed to the primes.
>
> Wesley, can you explain further?

My concept, idea, whathaveyou, comes from something I realized after taking up
mathematics for a degree about ten years ago - that half of the integers were
divisible by two, the other half were not divisible by any such overarching
factor. And of that other half, a certain percentage were not divisible by
anything except themselves and the number one.

The term "The binary sequence" derives from that, my humble apologies to anyone
who I confused - it directly relates to that fact, that two divides half the
integers, and nothing even remotely equivalent divides the other half of the
integers.

As far as the primes go, and as far as my conworlding goes, I would link it to
fractals - in so far as I understand anything about fractals - and say for this
world, the primes are the linkages for the fractals/chaos to the "Euclidean"
world of common perception. And the "binary sequence" doesn't play any such
role in this conworld, which I am happy to say, is just a thought-experiment of
mine own, with no relation to any "real" world.

As far as "privileging" any base goes, I was always worried about the use of
binary in computers as an adolescent, mostly because it didn't seem to take into
account of the alternate value "maybe" and even some others that I didn't think
of at the time. But "fuzzy logic" seems to have answered that, with scales of
values expressed in binary logic.

Just my 0.02c, FWLIW!

Wesley Parish
>
> --
> Jim Henry
> http://www.pobox.com/~jimhenry
>

"Sharpened hands are happy hands.
"Brim the tinfall with mirthful bands"
- A Deepness in the Sky, Vernor Vinge

"I me. Shape middled me. I would come out into hot!"
I from the spicy that day was overcasked mockingly - it's a symbol of the
other horizon. - emacs : meta x dissociated-press
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