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Re: Doing without relative, coordinate and subordinate clauses?

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  • Jeff Rollin
    In the last episode, (On Sunday 01 July 2007 03:44:58), ... Yes, that would probably be more accurate. The model is Chinese, Japanese and other languages that
    Message 1 of 6 , Jul 1, 2007
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      In the last episode, (On Sunday 01 July 2007 03:44:58),
      MorphemeAddict@... wrote:
      > In a message dated 6/30/2007 10:50:11 AM Central Daylight Time,
      >
      > jeff.rollin@... writes:
      > > I
      > > wanted to do without relative, coordinate and subordinate clauses, and
      > > use participles and the like instead, I had no idea how to go about it.
      >
      > From your example it looks like you are not eliminating any of those types
      > of clauses, but only changing the form. The relative clause reminds me of
      > Chinese and Japanese.
      >
      > stevo </HTML>

      Yes, that would probably be more accurate. The model is Chinese, Japanese and
      other languages that are restricted to one finite verb per sentence, not
      Piraha!

      Jeff
      --
      "Please understand that there are small
      European principalities devoted to debating
      Tcl vs. Perl as a tourist attraction."

      -- Cameron Laird
    • Lars Finsen
      ... Urianians are pretty fond of using participle constructions instead of full verbal clauses in such sentences. (I gather they are less frequent in
      Message 2 of 6 , Jul 1, 2007
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        Den 30. jun. 2007 kl. 17.44 skrev Jeff Rollin:

        > Does your conlang do this? How do you do it? Are there natlangs
        > which do this?

        Urianians are pretty fond of using participle constructions instead
        of full verbal clauses in such sentences. (I gather they are less
        frequent in colloquial speech and are considered somewhat 'high
        style' though.) Like any noun the participles take various case-
        endings, which affect its function. This is not uncommon with highly
        inflected languages, I think.

        "I saw the man who owns an Audi and lives on our street in the Post
        Office today"

        Ninsilpostu tuni ajem ura jugan Audet, raznu esan favat.
        (post.office-loc.sg day-inst.sg see-1s.pret man-acc.sg own-
        act.part.nom Audi-acc.sg, street-loc.sg 1p.gen live-stat.part.nom)

        "I'll always remember the tension in her voice //when she spoke of
        her late father/as the train pulled out of the station and receded
        into the distance//"

        In the second sentence I'll use some instrumental participles to
        denote concurrent actions with some duration.

        Ende mindulsam sa dingja irmina, cutzuni sa badra mirin, togja gituni
        staconat oran inan.
        (always remember-1s.fut 3s.gen voice-gen.sg tension-acc.sg, speak.of-
        act.part.inst 3s.gen die-past.part, train-gen.sg start-act.part.inst
        station-abl.sg recede-act.part.nom yonder-acc)

        In the last one I'll use infinitives, and a dative participle.

        "Before I can get it for you, you need to find out how much it is and
        give me the money, please."
        Du ma frangune eng e du jande jungi ger je gegde mi oset, tunzi.
        (2s.dat 1s.gen bring-act.part.dat necessary be-3s.pres 2s.dat
        find.out-inf how.much be.worth-3s.pres and give-inf 1s.acc money-
        acc.pl, friendliness-inst.sg)

        In Urianian, the pronouns are separate when using a participle, but
        there are languages that include them. What you get isn't completely
        collapsed clauses, there is still some clausal structure there, so I
        guess it isn't an answer to your question really. But anyway it's a
        fun exercise, thanks for that.

        LEF
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