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Hyperborean (was: A book report...)

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  • R A Brown
    ... Certainly correct. Hyperboreoi (m. pl.) a people supposed to live in the extreme north . The noun is found in the works of Homer and of other ancient
    Message 1 of 20 , Jan 2, 2006
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      Andreas Johansson wrote:
      > Quoting Paul Bennett <paul-bennett@...>:
      >
      >
      >>On Sun, 01 Jan 2006 05:00:30 -0500, Jefferson Wilson
      >><jeffwilson63@...> wrote:
      >>
      >>
      >>> PM Hyperborean, Indian, and artificial languages
      >>
      >>That's a word with which I ought to be familiar, but I'm not. My brain
      >>keeps insisting it means either "having many trees" or "above the trees",
      >>neither of which make much sense. In typing this, though, it has become
      >>apparent that it might mean "from beyond the north".
      >>
      >>Am I even remotely in the right territory?
      >
      >
      > The Hyperboreans, according to ancient geographers, were a people living in the
      > far north, so your last interpretation is probably correct.

      Certainly correct.

      Hyperboreoi (m. pl.) "a people supposed to live in the extreme north".
      The noun is found in the works of Homer and of other ancient Greek
      writers. It is derived thus:
      hyper "above, beyond" + bore- (north, north wind)* + -oi (MASC.PL)

      *the noun for 'north' and 'north wind' was _boreas_ (masc.)

      In modern times the adjective 'Hyperborean' has been applied to a group
      of languages spoken in northeastern Siberia.

      --
      Ray
      ==================================
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      http://www.carolandray.plus.com
      ==================================
      MAKE POVERTY HISTORY
    • Isaac Penzev
      ... Hmm. Aren t they more often called Paleosiberian or Paleoasian ? -- Yitzik
      Message 2 of 20 , Jan 2, 2006
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        R A Brown wrote:


        > In modern times the adjective 'Hyperborean' has been applied to a group
        > of languages spoken in northeastern Siberia.

        Hmm. Aren't they more often called 'Paleosiberian' or 'Paleoasian'?

        -- Yitzik
      • R A Brown
        ... I believe so - my source was Mario Pei The World s Chief Languages , 1949. But the Library of Congress apparently still uses the older term: PM
        Message 3 of 20 , Jan 2, 2006
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          Isaac Penzev wrote:
          > R A Brown wrote:
          >
          >
          >
          >>In modern times the adjective 'Hyperborean' has been applied to a group
          >>of languages spoken in northeastern Siberia.
          >
          >
          > Hmm. Aren't they more often called 'Paleosiberian' or 'Paleoasian'?

          I believe so - my source was Mario Pei "The World's Chief Languages",
          1949. But the Library of Congress apparently still uses the older term:
          PM Hyperborean, Indian, and artificial languages

          In the list quoted yesterday by Jefferson Wilson there is no mention of
          'Paleosiberian' or 'Paleoasian'

          A quick Google on 'hyperborean' will soon show many different latter-day
          uses; I guess the terms 'Pal(a)eosiberian' and 'Pal(a)eoasian' have been
          adopted to avoid confusion with some of these other uses.

          --
          Ray
          ==================================
          ray@...
          http://www.carolandray.plus.com
          ==================================
          MAKE POVERTY HISTORY
        • Jörg Rhiemeier
          Hallo! ... Yep. Losts of crackpots using this term for all sorts of figments of their imagination, including some very unpalatable ones. And northeastern
          Message 4 of 20 , Jan 2, 2006
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            Hallo!

            Ray Brown wrote:

            > Isaac Penzev wrote:
            > > R A Brown wrote:
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > >>In modern times the adjective 'Hyperborean' has been applied to a group
            > >>of languages spoken in northeastern Siberia.
            > >
            > >
            > > Hmm. Aren't they more often called 'Paleosiberian' or 'Paleoasian'?
            >
            > I believe so - my source was Mario Pei "The World's Chief Languages",
            > 1949. But the Library of Congress apparently still uses the older term:
            > PM Hyperborean, Indian, and artificial languages
            >
            > In the list quoted yesterday by Jefferson Wilson there is no mention of
            > 'Paleosiberian' or 'Paleoasian'
            >
            > A quick Google on 'hyperborean' will soon show many different latter-day
            > uses; I guess the terms 'Pal(a)eosiberian' and 'Pal(a)eoasian' have been
            > adopted to avoid confusion with some of these other uses.

            Yep. Losts of crackpots using this term for all sorts of figments
            of their imagination, including some very unpalatable ones.

            And northeastern Siberia probably doesn't have the least to do
            with the Hyperborea of the ancients at all (where's the friendly
            temperate climate and all that?); IMHO, "Hyperborea" refers to
            pre-Celtic Britain. Which also means that the term "Hyperborean"
            applies better to - Albic ;-) But I will stick to the name "Albic":
            it is shorter, it is unambiguous, it is better.

            Greetings,

            Jörg.
          • Adam Walker
            ... Roy Andrew ... I have and read that one. It was interesting. Adam Jin xividjilud djal suñu ed falud ul Jozevu pomu instanchid ul andjelu djul Dominu
            Message 5 of 20 , Jan 3, 2006
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              --- caeruleancentaur <caeruleancentaur@...>
              wrote:

              > --- In conlang@yahoogroups.com, "Mark J. Reed"
              > <markjreed@M...> wrote:
              Roy Andrew
              > Miller's "Japanese and the Other Altaic Languages."
              > If anyone is
              > interested in it, please let me know.

              I have and read that one. It was interesting.

              Adam

              Jin xividjilud djal suñu ed falud ul Jozevu pomu instanchid ul andjelu djul Dominu sivi, ed idavi achibid jun al su sposa. Ed nun aved cuñuxud ad sivi ancha nadud jan ad ul sua huiju primodjindu ed cuamad il su numi ul Jezu.

              Machu 1:24-25
            • Andreas Johansson
              ... The Swedish 17th C historian Olof Rudbeck thought it refered to Scandinavia, and claimed the word was derived from Scandinavian _yverboren_ highborn . He
              Message 6 of 20 , Jan 3, 2006
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                Quoting Jörg Rhiemeier <joerg_rhiemeier@...>:

                > Hallo!
                >
                > Ray Brown wrote:
                >
                > > Isaac Penzev wrote:
                > > > R A Brown wrote:
                > > >
                > > >
                > > >
                > > >>In modern times the adjective 'Hyperborean' has been applied to a group
                > > >>of languages spoken in northeastern Siberia.
                > > >
                > > >
                > > > Hmm. Aren't they more often called 'Paleosiberian' or 'Paleoasian'?
                > >
                > > I believe so - my source was Mario Pei "The World's Chief Languages",
                > > 1949. But the Library of Congress apparently still uses the older term:
                > > PM Hyperborean, Indian, and artificial languages
                > >
                > > In the list quoted yesterday by Jefferson Wilson there is no mention of
                > > 'Paleosiberian' or 'Paleoasian'
                > >
                > > A quick Google on 'hyperborean' will soon show many different latter-day
                > > uses; I guess the terms 'Pal(a)eosiberian' and 'Pal(a)eoasian' have been
                > > adopted to avoid confusion with some of these other uses.
                >
                > Yep. Losts of crackpots using this term for all sorts of figments
                > of their imagination, including some very unpalatable ones.
                >
                > And northeastern Siberia probably doesn't have the least to do
                > with the Hyperborea of the ancients at all (where's the friendly
                > temperate climate and all that?); IMHO, "Hyperborea" refers to
                > pre-Celtic Britain. Which also means that the term "Hyperborean"
                > applies better to - Albic ;-) But I will stick to the name "Albic":
                > it is shorter, it is unambiguous, it is better.

                The Swedish 17th C historian Olof Rudbeck thought it refered to Scandinavia, and
                claimed the word was derived from Scandinavian _yverboren_ "highborn". He
                should've taken more Greek classes, but you'll still occasionally hear
                _yverboren_ as joking characterization of overly patriotic folks.

                Andreas
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