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Re: Clockwise without clocks

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  • Wesley Parish
    ... I knew one, but it had already encountered the wheel before I was born amongst it in the valleys and hills of Papua Niugini. And the Australian
    Message 1 of 53 , Apr 1, 2005
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      On Fri, 01 Apr 2005 06:47, H. S. Teoh wrote:
      > [Multiple replies to keep total posts down]
      >
      > On Wed, Mar 30, 2005 at 07:35:07PM -0700, Muke Tever wrote:
      > > Gary Shannon <fiziwig@...> wrote:
      >
      > [...]
      >
      > [...]
      > >
      > > But what of those cultures that don't know the wheel?
      >
      > Are there any (real) cultures that don't know the wheel? I can't think
      > of any offhand.

      I knew one, but it had already encountered the wheel before I was born amongst
      it in the valleys and hills of Papua Niugini. And the Australian Aboriginals
      never knew any such thing, nor did the Polynesians, though the Polynesians
      were advanced in material culture enough to the degree of building the most
      advanced stone-age ocean-crossing watercraft - to the degree they make the
      Viking dragon-ships look quite primitive in some respects.
      >
      > > That's why I prefer using the sun as the referent for "clockwise"
      > > motion. I wonder if there is any lexeme in the American Indian
      > > cultures for this concept, prior to colonization.
      >

      Well, the sun has the advantage in being universally known.
      > [...]
      >
      > You mean the pre-colonial Amerindian cultures don't know the wheel?
      > That's interesting.

      It seems to have been related to the development of smelting. Stone Age
      peoples like the pre-colonial Americans never got that far.
      >
      >
      > T
      >
      > --
      > Never step over a puddle, always step around it. Chances are that whatever
      > made it is still dripping.
      Wesley Parish
      --
      Clinersterton beademung, with all of love - RIP James Blish
      -----
      Mau e ki, he aha te mea nui?
      You ask, what is the most important thing?
      Maku e ki, he tangata, he tangata, he tangata.
      I reply, it is people, it is people, it is people.
    • B. Garcia
      ... The Mayans made heavy use of lime for stucco/plaster for covering their pyramids and also for relief work. The Rosalia temple under structure 16 in Copán
      Message 53 of 53 , Apr 18, 2005
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        On 4/17/05, Roger Mills <rfmilly@...> wrote:


        Unless I'm mistaken, that sounds like the primitive way of obtaining lime
        for mortar. Were the Mayan pyramids mortared??? I'd be surprised if they
        were. (In pre-industrial Indonesia they burned coral to produce lime, but
        small quantities. And isn't burning limestone basically the way cement is
        made even today? Cement factories certainly produce a ton of smoke....)

        The Mayans made heavy use of lime for stucco/plaster for covering their pyramids and also for relief work. The Rosalia temple under structure 16 in Copán is an example (it was buried under a larger temple and was intact -- stucco work and even the colors).

        When you burn limestone, you get quicklime, which is essentially what plaster is.

        For actual building cement, you heat limestone and clay together until they almost fuse, then you crush it into a fine powder. When water is added, this gives cement.

        Mayan pyramids were essentially big mounds of rubble faced with limestone blocks. They would often frame off the site, wall it in and then fill it in with rubble, then build another level, and fill that in. After they constructed the building, they'd then coat it all with plaster and then add any ornamentation and plaster work to the outside. They'd also paint the sculpture too (as is the case with pretty much every ancient city... everything was usually painted and plastered).

        All of that construction and plastering required a LOT of limestone. Fortunately the Mayan realm sat atop vast reserves of it.



        I




        --
        They'll have a big parade for every day that you stay clean
        But when the trumpets fade, you'll go under like a submarine
        And you won't see it coming,  no you won't see it coming

        You could have it made up there in San Rafael
        But baby I'm afraid i'll never see you well
        because i've seen the tally
        you're just going through the motions, baby


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