195210Re: The evolution of Angosey: 5 Translations of the same poem across 11 years
- Feb 18, 2013On 2/16/2013 11:12 PM, Daniel Bowman wrote:
> Hello All,That's one nice thing about having the same language for 11 years. Since
> Last weekend Alex Fink, Herman Miller and I met over brunch and had a
> great discussion about conlangs. I look forward to bringing up
> several things we touched on during the conversation. The first is
> the evolution of my conlang Angosey over the last eleven years. I
> mentioned that I retranslate the same poem every so often, and I can
> trace the changes that have occurred (both phonological,
> orthographical, and grammatical) in Angosey via my past translations.
> Alex mentioned that he'd be interested in hearing more about it, so
> I've written a blog post that shows examples from this poem that
> highlight the evolution of my language. Here's the link in case
> other list members are curious:
I haven't been developing Jarda continuously, I study the old texts for
examples of "correct" grammar and vocabulary usage. So Jarda hasn't
evolved in the same way. I can compare different translations from
different time periods (Relay 3 and Relay 18), but I haven't got
examples of retranslating the same text. I do have examples in Tirelat
of texts that I edited to keep up to date with the language as it
changed, but a retranslation would be more interesting.
(Relay 3 has an interesting example of a postposition "śa" in Jarda, but
this could be a result of poetic word order.)
From the glossarch page:
> The Angosey of Oct0ber 2002 (the first time I translated this poem)That pretty much describes Olaetian in the early stages; it had definite
> had no sounds that English lacked. The word order was different, but
> I was still stuck in the English/Romance language paradigm. There
> was nothing truly new about it.
Romance influences. The only non-English languages I knew much about at
the time were French and Spanish, so that to me was just how "foreign"
languages worked. Over time Olaetian acquired all sorts of foreign
sounds and a few non-Romance features like noun cases, but it
fundamentally still looks something like a Romance language.
I was creating all sorts of sketchy languages back then, only a few as
well developed as Olaetian, but it was nice to have a lot of languages
to pick from when I discovered a new sound or a new grammatical feature.
When I found out about ergativity, for example, I created a new ergative
> The Angosey of February 2013 does not sound like any version ofWe were talking about how ergativity was a conlanging fad for a time,
> English I know of. Its phonetic repertoire spans Europe, Africa, and
> Asia. The grammar is richer and reflects specific ontological
> choices that suite my way of thinking, from the distinction between
> emotive and non emotive speaking, to its noun categorization, to its
> ergative/absolutive verb system.
but in a number of ways it seems more convenient than the usual
nominative-accusative system. I mentioned that Jarda had the same word
for "fall" and "drop" but I must have been thinking of another language,
since it appears to be a gap in the Jarda vocabulary! I'll need to fix
that. But what it does have is a single word for "die" and "kill" (rav).
> Angosey has also acquired six noun classes: “au ziramei” means “theI tried that with Tirelat, but it didn't work out. Maybe it would be a
> (physical object) ‘pearl.’”
good idea for a new Sangari language. Jarda has a set of various
classifiers (like in Chinese or Japanese), so maybe some other member of
the Jardic family has reduced these to a fixed set of noun classes.
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