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Re: IB: Holy Roman Emperor Claus I

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  • tomhchappell
    ... I like that. ... Would quisling be a current term in IB? *There*, did *there* s Quisling do in *there* s GW2 what *here* s Quisling did *here* in
    Message 1 of 31 , Oct 4, 2008
      ---In conculture@yahoogroups.com, Padraic Brown <elemtilas@...> wrote:
      >[snip]
      >Perhaps he could end up being something like *here*'s current
      >Hapsburg emperor -- something of a senior statesman, dashing around
      >Europe talking on this or that key topic of the day.

      I like that.

      >If he started out as a quisling for the Allies, he doesn't have to
      >remain one in his old age!

      Would "quisling" be a current term in IB? *There*, did *there*'s
      Quisling do in *there*'s GW2 what *here*'s Quisling did *here* in
      *here*'s WW2?

      >[snip]
      >Me, I'd kind of like for him to still be around and in the news.

      Me, too.

      >[snip]
      >I don't mean for our emperor to be taken as an actual traitor, but,
      >at least *originally*, as a yes-man for the Allies.

      >I also don't think a Norwegian emperor would be appropriate. Leave
      >Quisling his due!

      >I don't think the emperor's weak-kneed kowtowing
      >would be particularly terrible given the circumstances; and I don't
      >think it could really be construed as "treason" -- after all, he
      >didn't collaborate with the enemy. He just bowed to the victors.
      >Perhaps his bowing and scraping was a little too low and a little
      >too unctious, but there you are.

      (unctuous. (lyke Aye nevverr mispel ennytheng.))

      Good points, all.

      So he'd be more like Maréchal Philippe Pétain of Vichy France than
      like Minister President Vidkun Abraham Lauritz Jonssøn Quisling of
      Norway.

      >[snip]
      >>If the Emperor is both a head of a noble house, and an elected head
      >>of a member-state of the HRE, if he loses or resigns his elective
      >>office (or simply allows it to lapse), does he lose his Imperium
      >>(or have to be re-elected Emperor)?
      >
      >I would think that if he abdicates his office as emperor, he'd have
      >to be reelected (though isn't there a rule that bars the same house
      >from putting up a candidate twice in a row?), so he'd have to wait a
      >while.
      >If he abdicates or otherwise loses a lower office, I don't think
      >that would necessarily interfere with his imperium.

      So, he's OK as long as he's the head of an eligible noble house, and
      doesn't step down from heading that noble house.

      >Except for republican emperors, whose term of office has a set
      >expiry date.

      So, if an elected HoS who has a one-year term as elected HoS, gets
      elected Emperor, and his term as HoS of a Land expires but he's re-
      elected to the Diet, nevertheless his term as Emperor expires and
      he's not eligible for immediate re-election? Does that suck or what?

      >>What if he's the "heir-apparent" to the headship of a noble house,
      >>and also an elective head of a member-state? And he loses, resigns,
      >>or allows-to-lapse his elective HoS position, before he inherits
      >>his head-of-noble-house position?
      >
      >I think such titles as attach to the person (an inherited head of
      >house role) are separate from any elected positions, such as an
      >elected head of state role.

      But the point was that at the time he loses his elective Diet
      position (HoS of a Land) he has not yet inherited his "head of noble
      house" position.
      So he is no longer in the Diet and no longer eligible to be elected
      Emperor, by virtue of being the elected HoS of a Land and a member of
      the Diet; and not yet eligible to be elected Emperor, by virtue of
      being the head of a noble house.
      So mustn't he lose his Imperium until such time as he is either re-
      elected to the Diet as HoS of a Land, or inherits/succeeds to the
      head position of his noble house? When, of course he becomes re-
      eligible, but does not necessarily become Emperor unless and until
      elected.

      Might an elder head of an Emperor's noble house abdicate in favor of
      the Emperor in order to let his heir remain Emperor?

      And, by the way, this sets up the possibility of a bunch of "Grover
      Cleveland"-style two-(or-more)-term Emperors, doesn't it? If the HRE
      lasts long enough. (Though if there've been only 4 or 5 Emperors so
      far there probably haven't been any split-term Emperors yet. Unless
      you want to give Claus I a split term? That way he can be first post-
      GW2 Emperor, and also have his second term end in 1963, without
      preventing anyone else from being Emperor in between. But that would
      require that he had been HoS of a Land, but not yet head of his noble
      house, at the end of GW2, and also not yet head of his noble house at
      the end of his first term.)

      (This actually would work with any "republican Emperor", whether or
      not he was noble, much less in line for the head of his noble house.)

      >Padraic

      Thanks!
    • Padraic Brown
      ... Or better, for years. ... I m sure they d sort things out well enough. It s not necessarily a Bad Thing. There are many old sayings, such as: Every day
      Message 31 of 31 , Oct 5, 2008
        --- On Sun, 10/5/08, Ben Karnell <bencarnehl@...> wrote:

        > The whole thing has a tantalyzing "IB", or at
        > least "constructed
        > culture," feel to it. I hope it doesn't really
        > happen, because the
        > governmental apparatus of the country would be paralyzed
        > for months;

        Or better, for years.

        > and yet, deep down I also wouldn't mind seeing it happen...

        I'm sure they'd sort things out well enough.

        It's not necessarily a Bad Thing. There are many old sayings, such as:

        "Every day that Congress is not in session, the taxpayers save millions of dollars."

        "About the only time Congress conforms to the will of the people is when it decides to adjourn."

        "Nothing in life is certain, at least while Congress is in session."

        "No one's pocketbook is safe while Congress is in session."

        Etc.

        Once could insert one's parliament of choice, to be sure! ;)))

        Padraic
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