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Re: [comets-ml] Did a comet hit Jupiter?

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  • KDConod
    Yes, but I think the line Following up on a tip by an amateur astronomer, Anthony Wesley of Australia, is still understating Anthony s discovery.
    Message 1 of 32 , Jul 21, 2009
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      Yes, but I think the line "Following up on a tip by an amateur
      astronomer, Anthony Wesley of Australia," is still understating
      Anthony's discovery. Professional jealousy, perhaps?

      Probably not - just an uniformed overly eager PR officer.


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      Hi Vegas,   My friend used the word perhaps . I ve never seen any data about a asteriod impact on Jupiter. Heck, as far as I know that perhaps this maybe
      Message 32 of 32 , Jul 24, 2009
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        Hi Vegas,
        My friend used the word "perhaps". I've never seen any data about a asteriod impact on Jupiter. Heck, as far as I know that perhaps this maybe have been a piece of Io blown off because of tidal stress. Just food for thought.

        --- On Fri, 7/24/09, Vegas Luna <vegas_luna@...> wrote:

        From: Vegas Luna <vegas_luna@...>
        Subject: Re: [comets-ml] Re: Did a comet hit Jupiter?
        To: comets-ml@yahoogroups.com
        Date: Friday, July 24, 2009, 12:47 PM


        Does your friend have any data to compare this with an asteroid impact?

        Have we ever even seen an asteroid impact Jupiter?

        It would seem like we need some kind of data to compare it with to come to
        a conclusion that it was an asteroid strike?

        Like we have data to compare to a comet impact they are identical.

        But do we actually know what kind of impact scar an asteroid would leave
        on Jupiter if they do leave impact scars like this?

        Thank you everyone ..

        Vegas Luna

        ____________ _________ _________ __
        From: FRANK GUTOWSKI <fgutowski@yahoo. com>
        To: comets-ml@yahoogrou ps.com
        Sent: Friday, July 24, 2009 6:07:16 AM
        Subject: Re: [comets-ml] Re: Did a comet hit Jupiter?

        This has been a good discussion here about the impact. A good friend of mine who is a member of the local astronomy club has this to say about this event:

        Here is something,

        As I look at the images being shown about the resent impact on Jupiter it brings me back to 94 with Shoemaker-Levy 9 and its after effects. This is when debates opened up about Jupiter's atmosphere its layers and chemistry.

        Jupiter, much has been speculated about its interior but here is the general consensus. From the outermost layers extending down perhaps some 15 to 20 thousand miles is its outer shell of hydrogen. As the outer shell temperature and pressure builds at depth to approximately 4 million bars Liquid Metallic Hydrogen then forms which then extend all the way to what may be the highly speculated rocky core. It would be this Liquid Metallic Hydrogen that would give Jupiter its magnetic field.

        The general chemistry of Jupiter from the observed cloud layers puts its composition at approximately 90 percent hydrogen, 10 percent helium with water, methane and ammonia in trace amounts.

        Now this is where Shoemaker-Levy 9s data is relevant to the recent impact on Jupiter. The ejecta noted in the 94 event was then typically referred to as soot. And it is this soot that you see now with this new event. The spectroscopy attained in 94 from the soot yielded a number of light elements like Lithium, Sodium, Magnesium, Manganese, Iron, Silica and Sulfur and also molecules such as NH3, CO, H2O, the famed hydrogen cyanide or HCN, H2S, CS, CS2, S2; CH4, C2H2, C2H6 as a few examples. Though no new molecules were found in that event it is interesting to note the high incidence of the elements hydrogen and carbon found in the mix. Here the atmosphere of Jupiter has bonded through heat and pressure with the exploding mater or perhaps carbon components resident in some lower atmospheric layer brought to the surface as impact ejecta as is now seen as soot.

        The energy requirement to form a plume of soot the likes of what is now seen on Jupiter given the data from the 21 impacts that occurred back in 94 labeled impacts from fragments A through W minus I and O in the alphabet ranged from the difficult to detect as with F and the largest notable fragment G which was estimated to have the kinetic yield of 6 Terra Tons. What we are looking at is somewhere in the median range as compared to 94 of a 200 to perhaps 600 maybe a little more Giga Ton event, with a probable impact velocity using the 94 event as a bench mark plus or minus the lower one hundred thousand miles per hour range. Of course the last sentence is speculative but reasonably placed within the range of the ball park

        I throw this out there to demonstrate the probable stark reality of what it is we are dealing with here when it comes to this most recent Jupiter impact. It kind of makes you think a little bit about the vulnerability of Earth now just a little bit. Out of nowhere it came, it just appeared, perhaps an indication of a dark asteroid impact.

        Just thinking of old man Jupiter is all,



        --- On Thu, 7/23/09, cnj999 <jbortle@aol. com> wrote:

        From: cnj999 <jbortle@aol. com>
        Subject: [comets-ml] Re: Did a comet hit Jupiter?
        To: comets-ml@yahoogrou ps.com
        Date: Thursday, July 23, 2009, 5:07 PM

        --- In comets-ml@yahoogrou ps.com, Don Pearce <dpearce2@.. .> wrote:
        > The discovery magnitude of SL9, as reported by Shoemaker, et al, (using
        > the Palomar 18-inch Schmidt Camera) was 14.0 ....Don Pearce
        > Mr Wyatt wrote:
        > >
        > >
        > > What was the mag of SL-9 upon discovery?
        > >
        > > It would be very hard to detect a comet out around 5.2 AU wouldnt it??
        > > Unless of course it was as disrupted as SL-9.
        > >
        > > Cheers!
        > > Chris Wyatt
        > >

        However, that was more than likely a result of the comet's disruption. The "average" long period comet might be expected to be 17 magnitude as seen from Earth at Jupiter's distance, while the "average" periodic comet would be closer to 20-21 magnitude under the same circumstances.


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