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Re: 14th & Girard Concrete Park

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  • tealspider
    I get a kick out of the liberal do-gooders that think everything is peachy dandy, all it will take is a little neighborhly love to just chip in and clean up
    Message 1 of 18 , Dec 31, 2004
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      I get a kick out of the liberal do-gooders that think everything is
      peachy dandy, all it will take is a little neighborhly love to just
      chip in and clean up the park.

      It's not the park that's the problem, stupid.

      It's the people. Spaced-out druggies, drunks, crack whores and your
      run of the mill low lifes. Cleaning up the blunt wrappers and Steel
      Reserve cans won't solve the problem.

      Our only hope is that the commercial development will accelerate and
      price-out and chase-out the leeches. Admit it, a Starbucks at that
      corner would solve the problem lickety split.



      --- In columbia_heights@yahoogroups.com, mark mayhew
      <markjmayhew@y...> wrote:
      >
      > --- Jay Phillips <jncapheights@y...> wrote:
      >
      > >
      > > I used to live down the street from this park. Most
      > > of the people
      > > there are somewhat benign and even friendly, tho' I
      > > really didn't
      > > enjoy the constant offer to sell drugs to me or the
      > > occasional
      > > admonishment to "go back where I came from." Funny
      > > that is,
      > > considering that my great-grandfather's family
      > > originally owned most
      > > of CH. If anything, they're the interlopers.
      > >
      > > Admittedly, the park is a public space and citizens
      > > should be able to
      > > use it regularly - in a legal way. If the city
      > > could tame the public
      > > urination and defecation, and the visits from people
      > > who don't live
      > > in the neighborhood, the park wouldn't be too bad.
      > > Dealers from
      > > outside CH are the ones who create the shady
      > > atmosphere.
      > > Unfortunately, the police know who the dealers are
      > > there, so they'd
      > > rather keep tabs on the "known" than sweep them out
      > > for
      > > the "unknown." Nothing like some good old gunfights
      > > for prime turf -
      > > or at least that's how the beat officers once
      > > explained it to me.
      > I don't care much if your great-grandfather owned the
      > Taj Mahal, crack dealers are crack dealers and should
      > go to jail, the longer the better. Those beat police
      > that told you that are wrong, they just didn't want to
      > interupt their donut break to chase some 15 year old
      > crack dealers around (not that they could catch 'em,
      > even if they wanted to).
      > When Steppenwolf did "God damn the pusherman", they
      > didn't say "Goddamn the out of state pusherman, God
      > bless the local pusher"
      >
      > Happy New Year!
      >
      >
      > >
      > > Give it a few more years. The situation will
      > > improve. If you doubt
      > > that, look to other areas in the District that were
      > > once blighted.
      > >
      > > Jay
      > >
      > >
      > > --- In columbia_heights@yahoogroups.com, mark mayhew
      > >
      > > <markjmayhew@y...> wrote:
      > > > I fixed it for you...
      > > > --- "Pansegrouw, David N." <DPansegrouw@a...>
      > > > wrote:
      > > >
      > > > > Don't like the park? Be a part of it. Play
      > > chess,
      > > > > play basketball. Buy, and pass around, some of
      > > the
      > > > best crack you can find in the city. Shop
      > > > there....have you ever seen the Pentium 4 laptops
      > > they
      > > > sell there, for $40?
      > > > >
      > > > > ________________________________
      > > > >
      > > > > From: columbia_heights_native
      > > > > [mailto:columbia_heights_native@y...]
      > > > >
      > > > > Sent: Thursday, December 30, 2004 10:23 PM
      > > > > To: columbia_heights@yahoogroups.com
      > > > > Subject: [columbia_heights] Re: 14th & Girard
      > > > > Concrete Park
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > > I also agree in beautifying and reconstructing
      > > the
      > > > > park. maybe old
      > > > > and new residents should do some volunteer work
      > > > > there? Figure out
      > > > > from residents who live around the park for
      > > years
      > > > > who are not on this
      > > > > list serv and ask them. And mark what we don't
      > > need
      > > > > in this
      > > > > neighborhood is a starbucks.. If you want to sip
      > > on
      > > > > some starbucks
      > > > > coffee walk 4 blocks down to 18 & Columbia.
      > > > >
      > > > > --- In columbia_heights@yahoogroups.com, mark
      > > mayhew
      > > > >
      > > > > <markjmayhew@y...> wrote:
      > > > > > put a StarBucks there and be done with it!
      > > > > >
      > > > > > --- Richard Parker <rparker@l...> wrote:
      > > > > >
      > > > > > > Richard,
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > That is actually a very interesting
      > > web-site.
      > > > > > > Thanks for forwarding.
      > > > > > > Couple of things:
      > > > > > > 1. I was being facetious when I mentioned
      > > > > fencing
      > > > > > > the park off...you
      > > > > > > folks are taking me waaay too seriously (you
      > > > > weren't
      > > > > > > the only one to
      > > > > > > comment to me about that).
      > > > > > > 2. Although I was joking...ANYTHING would
      > > be an
      > > > > > > improvement.
      > > > > > > 3. I'm all for improving that place. Some
      > > of
      > > > > my
      > > > > > > saturday mornings are
      > > > > > > free and I wouldn't mind going down there
      > > and
      > > > > > > helping out...I just
      > > > > > > wouldn't know where to begin. If someone
      > > has
      > > > > some
      > > > > > > ideas I would love to
      > > > > > > hear them. Maybe it would help spur some of
      > > my
      > > > > > > creative juices.
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > Happy Holiday's everyone...lighten up a bit.
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > Rick
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > >>> Richard Layman <rlaymandc@y...> 12/30/04
      > > > > > > 11:52 AM >>>
      > > > > > > The point ought not be to close something as
      > > > > much as
      > > > > > > it is should be to
      > > > > > > improve it. See "How to Turn A Place
      > > Around"
      > > > > > > workshop at www.pps.org.
      > > > > > > Bad designs can all too often have bad
      > > > > consequences.
      > > > > > > The best way to
      > > > > > > get rid of negative behavior is to crowd it
      > > out
      > > > > with
      > > > > > > good-better
      > > > > > > behavior.
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > Correct (what I call) "noxious uses" rather
      > > than
      > > > > try
      > > > > > > to do away with
      > > > > > > them.
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > Is a fenced in basically vacant lot any
      > > better?
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > Richard Layman
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > Rob Williams <rob@r...> wrote:
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > THANK YOU. I have mentioned that park a few
      > > > > times
      > > > > > > on this list serve.
      > > > > > > I was beginning to wonder if I was just out
      > > of
      > > > > touch
      > > > > > > or something. That
      > > > > > > park is ridiculous. I don't know what can
      > > be
      > > > > done
      > > > > > > about it. They need
      > > > > > > to put a fence around that place and close
      > > it
      > > > > off.
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > Rick
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > >>> "fourteenth_fairmont"
      > > > > > > <14th_Fairmont@c...> 12/30/04 9:47 AM
      > > > > > > >>>
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > Neighbors,
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > I was wondering what purpose is served by
      > > having
      > > > > a
      > > > > > > city-run (but
      > > > > > > obviously not maintained) concrete park at
      > > the
      > > > > > > corner of 14th &
      > > > > > > Girard? From my daily observations during
      > > the
      > > > > past
      > > > > > > two years of
      > > > > > > living in Columbia Heights, its function
      > > seems
      > > > > to be
      > > > > > > mainly as an all-
      > > > > > > day/all-night open-air drinking, gambling,
      > > drug
      > >
      > === message truncated ===
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > __________________________________
      > Do you Yahoo!?
      > The all-new My Yahoo! - What will yours do?
      > http://my.yahoo.com
    • columbia_heights_native
      it s real funny how you people complain, and complain, everyday on this listserv.. I mean to tell you the truth thats what you guys are really good at. I mean
      Message 2 of 18 , Jan 1, 2005
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        it's real funny how you people complain, and complain, everyday on
        this listserv.. I mean to tell you the truth thats what you guys are
        really good at. I mean u come to this neighborhood knowing whats
        going on this community, trying to run people out of their own
        neighborhood, and instead of helping with the situation, you guys
        just complain and cry for a starbucks. I guess thats what you guys
        worship the most a nice coffe shop in the community that will solve
        the community problems. Please we don't need more idiots in Columbia
        Heights


        --- In columbia_heights@yahoogroups.com, "tealspider"
        <tealspider@y...> wrote:
        >
        > I get a kick out of the liberal do-gooders that think everything is
        > peachy dandy, all it will take is a little neighborhly love to just
        > chip in and clean up the park.
        >
        > It's not the park that's the problem, stupid.
        >
        > It's the people. Spaced-out druggies, drunks, crack whores and your
        > run of the mill low lifes. Cleaning up the blunt wrappers and Steel
        > Reserve cans won't solve the problem.
        >
        > Our only hope is that the commercial development will accelerate and
        > price-out and chase-out the leeches. Admit it, a Starbucks at that
        > corner would solve the problem lickety split.
        >
        >
        >
        > --- In columbia_heights@yahoogroups.com, mark mayhew
        > <markjmayhew@y...> wrote:
        > >
        > > --- Jay Phillips <jncapheights@y...> wrote:
        > >
        > > >
        > > > I used to live down the street from this park. Most
        > > > of the people
        > > > there are somewhat benign and even friendly, tho' I
        > > > really didn't
        > > > enjoy the constant offer to sell drugs to me or the
        > > > occasional
        > > > admonishment to "go back where I came from." Funny
        > > > that is,
        > > > considering that my great-grandfather's family
        > > > originally owned most
        > > > of CH. If anything, they're the interlopers.
        > > >
        > > > Admittedly, the park is a public space and citizens
        > > > should be able to
        > > > use it regularly - in a legal way. If the city
        > > > could tame the public
        > > > urination and defecation, and the visits from people
        > > > who don't live
        > > > in the neighborhood, the park wouldn't be too bad.
        > > > Dealers from
        > > > outside CH are the ones who create the shady
        > > > atmosphere.
        > > > Unfortunately, the police know who the dealers are
        > > > there, so they'd
        > > > rather keep tabs on the "known" than sweep them out
        > > > for
        > > > the "unknown." Nothing like some good old gunfights
        > > > for prime turf -
        > > > or at least that's how the beat officers once
        > > > explained it to me.
        > > I don't care much if your great-grandfather owned the
        > > Taj Mahal, crack dealers are crack dealers and should
        > > go to jail, the longer the better. Those beat police
        > > that told you that are wrong, they just didn't want to
        > > interupt their donut break to chase some 15 year old
        > > crack dealers around (not that they could catch 'em,
        > > even if they wanted to).
        > > When Steppenwolf did "God damn the pusherman", they
        > > didn't say "Goddamn the out of state pusherman, God
        > > bless the local pusher"
        > >
        > > Happy New Year!
        > >
        > >
        > > >
        > > > Give it a few more years. The situation will
        > > > improve. If you doubt
        > > > that, look to other areas in the District that were
        > > > once blighted.
        > > >
        > > > Jay
        > > >
        > > >
        > > > --- In columbia_heights@yahoogroups.com, mark mayhew
        > > >
        > > > <markjmayhew@y...> wrote:
        > > > > I fixed it for you...
        > > > > --- "Pansegrouw, David N." <DPansegrouw@a...>
        > > > > wrote:
        > > > >
        > > > > > Don't like the park? Be a part of it. Play
        > > > chess,
        > > > > > play basketball. Buy, and pass around, some of
        > > > the
        > > > > best crack you can find in the city. Shop
        > > > > there....have you ever seen the Pentium 4 laptops
        > > > they
        > > > > sell there, for $40?
        > > > > >
        > > > > > ________________________________
        > > > > >
        > > > > > From: columbia_heights_native
        > > > > > [mailto:columbia_heights_native@y...]
        > > > > >
        > > > > > Sent: Thursday, December 30, 2004 10:23 PM
        > > > > > To: columbia_heights@yahoogroups.com
        > > > > > Subject: [columbia_heights] Re: 14th & Girard
        > > > > > Concrete Park
        > > > > >
        > > > > >
        > > > > >
        > > > > >
        > > > > > I also agree in beautifying and reconstructing
        > > > the
        > > > > > park. maybe old
        > > > > > and new residents should do some volunteer work
        > > > > > there? Figure out
        > > > > > from residents who live around the park for
        > > > years
        > > > > > who are not on this
        > > > > > list serv and ask them. And mark what we don't
        > > > need
        > > > > > in this
        > > > > > neighborhood is a starbucks.. If you want to sip
        > > > on
        > > > > > some starbucks
        > > > > > coffee walk 4 blocks down to 18 & Columbia.
        > > > > >
        > > > > > --- In columbia_heights@yahoogroups.com, mark
        > > > mayhew
        > > > > >
        > > > > > <markjmayhew@y...> wrote:
        > > > > > > put a StarBucks there and be done with it!
        > > > > > >
        > > > > > > --- Richard Parker <rparker@l...> wrote:
        > > > > > >
        > > > > > > > Richard,
        > > > > > > >
        > > > > > > > That is actually a very interesting
        > > > web-site.
        > > > > > > > Thanks for forwarding.
        > > > > > > > Couple of things:
        > > > > > > > 1. I was being facetious when I mentioned
        > > > > > fencing
        > > > > > > > the park off...you
        > > > > > > > folks are taking me waaay too seriously (you
        > > > > > weren't
        > > > > > > > the only one to
        > > > > > > > comment to me about that).
        > > > > > > > 2. Although I was joking...ANYTHING would
        > > > be an
        > > > > > > > improvement.
        > > > > > > > 3. I'm all for improving that place. Some
        > > > of
        > > > > > my
        > > > > > > > saturday mornings are
        > > > > > > > free and I wouldn't mind going down there
        > > > and
        > > > > > > > helping out...I just
        > > > > > > > wouldn't know where to begin. If someone
        > > > has
        > > > > > some
        > > > > > > > ideas I would love to
        > > > > > > > hear them. Maybe it would help spur some of
        > > > my
        > > > > > > > creative juices.
        > > > > > > >
        > > > > > > > Happy Holiday's everyone...lighten up a bit.
        > > > > > > >
        > > > > > > > Rick
        > > > > > > >
        > > > > > > >
        > > > > > > > >>> Richard Layman <rlaymandc@y...> 12/30/04
        > > > > > > > 11:52 AM >>>
        > > > > > > > The point ought not be to close something as
        > > > > > much as
        > > > > > > > it is should be to
        > > > > > > > improve it. See "How to Turn A Place
        > > > Around"
        > > > > > > > workshop at www.pps.org.
        > > > > > > > Bad designs can all too often have bad
        > > > > > consequences.
        > > > > > > > The best way to
        > > > > > > > get rid of negative behavior is to crowd it
        > > > out
        > > > > > with
        > > > > > > > good-better
        > > > > > > > behavior.
        > > > > > > >
        > > > > > > > Correct (what I call) "noxious uses" rather
        > > > than
        > > > > > try
        > > > > > > > to do away with
        > > > > > > > them.
        > > > > > > >
        > > > > > > > Is a fenced in basically vacant lot any
        > > > better?
        > > > > > > >
        > > > > > > > Richard Layman
        > > > > > > >
        > > > > > > > Rob Williams <rob@r...> wrote:
        > > > > > > >
        > > > > > > >
        > > > > > > > THANK YOU. I have mentioned that park a few
        > > > > > times
        > > > > > > > on this list serve.
        > > > > > > > I was beginning to wonder if I was just out
        > > > of
        > > > > > touch
        > > > > > > > or something. That
        > > > > > > > park is ridiculous. I don't know what can
        > > > be
        > > > > > done
        > > > > > > > about it. They need
        > > > > > > > to put a fence around that place and close
        > > > it
        > > > > > off.
        > > > > > > >
        > > > > > > > Rick
        > > > > > > >
        > > > > > > >
        > > > > > > > >>> "fourteenth_fairmont"
        > > > > > > > <14th_Fairmont@c...> 12/30/04 9:47 AM
        > > > > > > > >>>
        > > > > > > >
        > > > > > > >
        > > > > > > > Neighbors,
        > > > > > > >
        > > > > > > > I was wondering what purpose is served by
        > > > having
        > > > > > a
        > > > > > > > city-run (but
        > > > > > > > obviously not maintained) concrete park at
        > > > the
        > > > > > > > corner of 14th &
        > > > > > > > Girard? From my daily observations during
        > > > the
        > > > > > past
        > > > > > > > two years of
        > > > > > > > living in Columbia Heights, its function
        > > > seems
        > > > > > to be
        > > > > > > > mainly as an all-
        > > > > > > > day/all-night open-air drinking, gambling,
        > > > drug
        > > >
        > > === message truncated ===
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > > __________________________________
        > > Do you Yahoo!?
        > > The all-new My Yahoo! - What will yours do?
        > > http://my.yahoo.com
      • tealspider
        And your solution?
        Message 3 of 18 , Jan 1, 2005
        • 0 Attachment
          And your solution?


          --- In columbia_heights@yahoogroups.com, "columbia_heights_native"
          <columbia_heights_native@y...> wrote:
          >
          > it's real funny how you people complain, and complain, everyday on
          > this listserv.. I mean to tell you the truth thats what you guys are
          > really good at. I mean u come to this neighborhood knowing whats
          > going on this community, trying to run people out of their own
          > neighborhood, and instead of helping with the situation, you guys
          > just complain and cry for a starbucks. I guess thats what you guys
          > worship the most a nice coffe shop in the community that will solve
          > the community problems. Please we don't need more idiots in Columbia
          > Heights
          >
          >
          > --- In columbia_heights@yahoogroups.com, "tealspider"
          > <tealspider@y...> wrote:
          > >
          > > I get a kick out of the liberal do-gooders that think everything is
          > > peachy dandy, all it will take is a little neighborhly love to just
          > > chip in and clean up the park.
          > >
          > > It's not the park that's the problem, stupid.
          > >
          > > It's the people. Spaced-out druggies, drunks, crack whores and your
          > > run of the mill low lifes. Cleaning up the blunt wrappers and Steel
          > > Reserve cans won't solve the problem.
          > >
          > > Our only hope is that the commercial development will accelerate and
          > > price-out and chase-out the leeches. Admit it, a Starbucks at that
          > > corner would solve the problem lickety split.
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > > --- In columbia_heights@yahoogroups.com, mark mayhew
          > > <markjmayhew@y...> wrote:
          > > >
          > > > --- Jay Phillips <jncapheights@y...> wrote:
          > > >
          > > > >
          > > > > I used to live down the street from this park. Most
          > > > > of the people
          > > > > there are somewhat benign and even friendly, tho' I
          > > > > really didn't
          > > > > enjoy the constant offer to sell drugs to me or the
          > > > > occasional
          > > > > admonishment to "go back where I came from." Funny
          > > > > that is,
          > > > > considering that my great-grandfather's family
          > > > > originally owned most
          > > > > of CH. If anything, they're the interlopers.
          > > > >
          > > > > Admittedly, the park is a public space and citizens
          > > > > should be able to
          > > > > use it regularly - in a legal way. If the city
          > > > > could tame the public
          > > > > urination and defecation, and the visits from people
          > > > > who don't live
          > > > > in the neighborhood, the park wouldn't be too bad.
          > > > > Dealers from
          > > > > outside CH are the ones who create the shady
          > > > > atmosphere.
          > > > > Unfortunately, the police know who the dealers are
          > > > > there, so they'd
          > > > > rather keep tabs on the "known" than sweep them out
          > > > > for
          > > > > the "unknown." Nothing like some good old gunfights
          > > > > for prime turf -
          > > > > or at least that's how the beat officers once
          > > > > explained it to me.
          > > > I don't care much if your great-grandfather owned the
          > > > Taj Mahal, crack dealers are crack dealers and should
          > > > go to jail, the longer the better. Those beat police
          > > > that told you that are wrong, they just didn't want to
          > > > interupt their donut break to chase some 15 year old
          > > > crack dealers around (not that they could catch 'em,
          > > > even if they wanted to).
          > > > When Steppenwolf did "God damn the pusherman", they
          > > > didn't say "Goddamn the out of state pusherman, God
          > > > bless the local pusher"
          > > >
          > > > Happy New Year!
          > > >
          > > >
          > > > >
          > > > > Give it a few more years. The situation will
          > > > > improve. If you doubt
          > > > > that, look to other areas in the District that were
          > > > > once blighted.
          > > > >
          > > > > Jay
          > > > >
          > > > >
          > > > > --- In columbia_heights@yahoogroups.com, mark mayhew
          > > > >
          > > > > <markjmayhew@y...> wrote:
          > > > > > I fixed it for you...
          > > > > > --- "Pansegrouw, David N." <DPansegrouw@a...>
          > > > > > wrote:
          > > > > >
          > > > > > > Don't like the park? Be a part of it. Play
          > > > > chess,
          > > > > > > play basketball. Buy, and pass around, some of
          > > > > the
          > > > > > best crack you can find in the city. Shop
          > > > > > there....have you ever seen the Pentium 4 laptops
          > > > > they
          > > > > > sell there, for $40?
          > > > > > >
          > > > > > > ________________________________
          > > > > > >
          > > > > > > From: columbia_heights_native
          > > > > > > [mailto:columbia_heights_native@y...]
          > > > > > >
          > > > > > > Sent: Thursday, December 30, 2004 10:23 PM
          > > > > > > To: columbia_heights@yahoogroups.com
          > > > > > > Subject: [columbia_heights] Re: 14th & Girard
          > > > > > > Concrete Park
          > > > > > >
          > > > > > >
          > > > > > >
          > > > > > >
          > > > > > > I also agree in beautifying and reconstructing
          > > > > the
          > > > > > > park. maybe old
          > > > > > > and new residents should do some volunteer work
          > > > > > > there? Figure out
          > > > > > > from residents who live around the park for
          > > > > years
          > > > > > > who are not on this
          > > > > > > list serv and ask them. And mark what we don't
          > > > > need
          > > > > > > in this
          > > > > > > neighborhood is a starbucks.. If you want to sip
          > > > > on
          > > > > > > some starbucks
          > > > > > > coffee walk 4 blocks down to 18 & Columbia.
          > > > > > >
          > > > > > > --- In columbia_heights@yahoogroups.com, mark
          > > > > mayhew
          > > > > > >
          > > > > > > <markjmayhew@y...> wrote:
          > > > > > > > put a StarBucks there and be done with it!
          > > > > > > >
          > > > > > > > --- Richard Parker <rparker@l...> wrote:
          > > > > > > >
          > > > > > > > > Richard,
          > > > > > > > >
          > > > > > > > > That is actually a very interesting
          > > > > web-site.
          > > > > > > > > Thanks for forwarding.
          > > > > > > > > Couple of things:
          > > > > > > > > 1. I was being facetious when I mentioned
          > > > > > > fencing
          > > > > > > > > the park off...you
          > > > > > > > > folks are taking me waaay too seriously (you
          > > > > > > weren't
          > > > > > > > > the only one to
          > > > > > > > > comment to me about that).
          > > > > > > > > 2. Although I was joking...ANYTHING would
          > > > > be an
          > > > > > > > > improvement.
          > > > > > > > > 3. I'm all for improving that place. Some
          > > > > of
          > > > > > > my
          > > > > > > > > saturday mornings are
          > > > > > > > > free and I wouldn't mind going down there
          > > > > and
          > > > > > > > > helping out...I just
          > > > > > > > > wouldn't know where to begin. If someone
          > > > > has
          > > > > > > some
          > > > > > > > > ideas I would love to
          > > > > > > > > hear them. Maybe it would help spur some of
          > > > > my
          > > > > > > > > creative juices.
          > > > > > > > >
          > > > > > > > > Happy Holiday's everyone...lighten up a bit.
          > > > > > > > >
          > > > > > > > > Rick
          > > > > > > > >
          > > > > > > > >
          > > > > > > > > >>> Richard Layman <rlaymandc@y...> 12/30/04
          > > > > > > > > 11:52 AM >>>
          > > > > > > > > The point ought not be to close something as
          > > > > > > much as
          > > > > > > > > it is should be to
          > > > > > > > > improve it. See "How to Turn A Place
          > > > > Around"
          > > > > > > > > workshop at www.pps.org.
          > > > > > > > > Bad designs can all too often have bad
          > > > > > > consequences.
          > > > > > > > > The best way to
          > > > > > > > > get rid of negative behavior is to crowd it
          > > > > out
          > > > > > > with
          > > > > > > > > good-better
          > > > > > > > > behavior.
          > > > > > > > >
          > > > > > > > > Correct (what I call) "noxious uses" rather
          > > > > than
          > > > > > > try
          > > > > > > > > to do away with
          > > > > > > > > them.
          > > > > > > > >
          > > > > > > > > Is a fenced in basically vacant lot any
          > > > > better?
          > > > > > > > >
          > > > > > > > > Richard Layman
          > > > > > > > >
          > > > > > > > > Rob Williams <rob@r...> wrote:
          > > > > > > > >
          > > > > > > > >
          > > > > > > > > THANK YOU. I have mentioned that park a few
          > > > > > > times
          > > > > > > > > on this list serve.
          > > > > > > > > I was beginning to wonder if I was just out
          > > > > of
          > > > > > > touch
          > > > > > > > > or something. That
          > > > > > > > > park is ridiculous. I don't know what can
          > > > > be
          > > > > > > done
          > > > > > > > > about it. They need
          > > > > > > > > to put a fence around that place and close
          > > > > it
          > > > > > > off.
          > > > > > > > >
          > > > > > > > > Rick
          > > > > > > > >
          > > > > > > > >
          > > > > > > > > >>> "fourteenth_fairmont"
          > > > > > > > > <14th_Fairmont@c...> 12/30/04 9:47 AM
          > > > > > > > > >>>
          > > > > > > > >
          > > > > > > > >
          > > > > > > > > Neighbors,
          > > > > > > > >
          > > > > > > > > I was wondering what purpose is served by
          > > > > having
          > > > > > > a
          > > > > > > > > city-run (but
          > > > > > > > > obviously not maintained) concrete park at
          > > > > the
          > > > > > > > > corner of 14th &
          > > > > > > > > Girard? From my daily observations during
          > > > > the
          > > > > > > past
          > > > > > > > > two years of
          > > > > > > > > living in Columbia Heights, its function
          > > > > seems
          > > > > > > to be
          > > > > > > > > mainly as an all-
          > > > > > > > > day/all-night open-air drinking, gambling,
          > > > > drug
          > > > >
          > > > === message truncated ===
          > > >
          > > >
          > > >
          > > >
          > > > __________________________________
          > > > Do you Yahoo!?
          > > > The all-new My Yahoo! - What will yours do?
          > > > http://my.yahoo.com
        • William Jordan
          There is NO so called solution , at best the concept of a solution is CYA fantasy for politicians and public servants whose careers depend on baby sitting
          Message 4 of 18 , Jan 2, 2005
          • 0 Attachment

            There is NO so called "solution", at best the concept of a solution is  "CYA" fantasy for politicians and public servants whose careers depend on baby sitting adults for whom selfishness and childish behavior is good citizenship.  Sometimes, I wonder if we are more interested in validation of  our own selfishness and biases than a solution anyway.  There are however a series of solutions, processes and approaches that can be used to address this and other issues if community leadership chooses to step up to the plate.   We don't necessarily need community super heroes; what we need is some adherence to the 80/20 rules.  In this case for about 20% of the adults to spend about 20% of on their community responsibility energies working and communicating with each other for the greater good this community and less time with official a community arbitrators.  Their are no Urban Disney short cuts for the self-righteous, just the work sometimes hard of community leaders willing to operate beyond lazy stereo-type driven ass-umptions and using drive by anal-ysis, at least 20% of the time.

            Step 1: Community leaders are going to have to cut some of the time normally spent talking to their “in groups”, political and public officials and spend more of that time dialoguing across “in groups”.  This community is way too diverse for us to be so civically incestuous. At least a quarterly community wide meeting of leaders, lead by jointly by the chairs of the relevant ANC chairs or something like that is needed.   Basically, this greater community has the energy and talent needed to make a tremendous impact on issues ranging from public safety, to  public spaces, to employment to housing; however, we need to spend less time engaged in civic masturbation and more time engaged in true civic intercourse.

            Step 2:  We must take seriously the community and economic development opportunities that this community has before us.  Somehow, we have been convinced that during an economic boom and growth period, that we should adopt a depression like community and economic development policies.  We must immediately reject these regressive development policies, we are being fed in the name of Gentrification, which is a failing policy for community and economic development.  For the most part we are adding some great people to a current base of great people, our location is the best in the city, their is not excuse for the silly us vs. them(es) approach to things. There is way too much opportunity here to be convinced that we should  fight over crumbs.   Our problem is that no matter what the politicians say, Gentrification is not the optimal community and economic development strategy for this community, at least as it is being currently managed and stewarded.

            In the middle of a housing and construction boom, the unemployment rate in Ward 1 has gone from 6.0% January 2001, to 5.4% January 2002 to today's 7.7% as of October 2004.   Yes as many of our property tax assessments have about doubled since 2001, the number of unemployed has increased from 2,359 to 3,355 persons.  This when just in Columbia Heights NCRC related projects are estimated to produce 2,345 and 1,715 permanent and construction jobs respectively. This does not include parcel 34 or the Lincoln/Bell project.   There is no excuse for the unemployment rate in Ward 1 to be going up.  Why is this employment opportunity being missed, because childish petty and personal politics is dictating it be this way.  I'm not going to start on our half-ass housing strategy. This community should be a model on how to do quality housing the serves all levels of income well in an integrated environment. 

            With the amount of publicly owned land in this community there no excuse to have a community and economic development strategy that will leave us with more density and less quality public spaces at the end than when we started.  It is silly for us to be infighting over a few pocket parks when the opportunity to increase the quantity and quality of theses types of space should at least tripled.  Instead of pointing figures at each other we should be demanding the creativity from ourselves and others to at least triple parks and public spaces in this community.  While I'm on public space and parks, we have a Public Realm Plan designed by a partnership between citizens and government for our community designed over 18 months ago.  It is currently unfunded, instead of having to fight for funding for this plan we should be at a point of refining it and expanding it to cover more and more of this greater community.   Finally it is pure folly for a community that is less than a half mile from the city's largest park, Rock Creek, and not have a plan to better access this resource.  We want to spend too much energy calling names. This is intellectually way beneath us. This is especially the case when I know myself of at least 6 planning, transportation and architectural experts who live in this community. Let alone all the talent I know nothing of. 

            In conclusion, if we just step outside of our petty and childish political culture just 20% of the time we have more than enough resources and talent to address most issues and opportunities before us.  Hell, even if we get into nasty fights we have professional mediators that live in this community,  that could help us work through most things.  There is no excuse for this community not to be clearly on a path to greatness.  We only need put aside our childish things and attitudes 20% of the time.  There is not one issue of importance that some one or group in this community is not working on.  Some need help, some support, some a light kick in the pants.  We just must find the internal strength  to work beyond our “in groups” 20% of the time. I don't exclude myself from this.

            William















            tealspider wrote:
            And your solution?
            
            
            --- In columbia_heights@yahoogroups.com, "columbia_heights_native"
            <columbia_heights_native@y...> wrote:
              
            it's real funny how you people complain, and complain, everyday on 
            this listserv.. I mean to tell you the truth thats what you guys are 
            really good at.  I mean u come to this neighborhood knowing whats 
            going on this community, trying to run people out of their own 
            neighborhood, and instead of helping with the situation, you guys 
            just complain and cry for a starbucks. I guess thats what you guys 
            worship the most a nice coffe shop in the community that will solve 
            the community problems. Please we don't need more idiots in Columbia 
            Heights
            
            
            --- In columbia_heights@yahoogroups.com, "tealspider" 
            <tealspider@y...> wrote:
                
            I get a kick out of the liberal do-gooders that think everything is
            peachy dandy, all it will take is a little neighborhly love to just
            chip in and clean up the park.  
            
            It's not the park that's the problem, stupid.  
            
            It's the people.  Spaced-out druggies, drunks, crack whores and your
            run of the mill low lifes.  Cleaning up the blunt wrappers and Steel
            Reserve cans won't solve the problem.  
            
            Our only hope is that the commercial development will accelerate and
            price-out and chase-out the leeches.  Admit it, a Starbucks at that
            corner would solve the problem lickety split.
            
            
            
            --- In columbia_heights@yahoogroups.com, mark mayhew
            <markjmayhew@y...> wrote:
                  
            --- Jay Phillips <jncapheights@y...> wrote:
            
                    
            I used to live down the street from this park.  Most
            of the people 
            there are somewhat benign and even friendly, tho' I
            really didn't 
            enjoy the constant offer to sell drugs to me or the
            occasional 
            admonishment to "go back where I came from."  Funny
            that is, 
            considering that my great-grandfather's family
            originally owned most 
            of CH.  If anything, they're the interlopers.
            
            Admittedly, the park is a public space and citizens
            should be able to 
            use it regularly - in a legal way.  If the city
            could tame the public 
            urination and defecation, and the visits from people
            who don't live 
            in the neighborhood, the park wouldn't be too bad. 
            Dealers from 
            outside CH are the ones who create the shady
            atmosphere.  
            Unfortunately, the police know who the dealers are
            there, so they'd 
            rather keep tabs on the "known" than sweep them out
            for 
            the "unknown."  Nothing like some good old gunfights
            for prime turf - 
            or at least that's how the beat officers once
            explained it to me.
                      
            I don't care much if your great-grandfather owned the
            Taj Mahal, crack dealers are crack dealers and should
            go to jail, the longer the better.  Those beat police
            that told you that are wrong, they just didn't want to
            interupt their donut break to chase some 15 year old
            crack dealers around (not that they could catch 'em,
            even if they wanted to).
            When Steppenwolf did "God damn the pusherman", they
            didn't say "Goddamn the out of state pusherman, God
            bless the local pusher"
            
            Happy New Year!
            
            
                    
            Give it a few more years.  The situation will
            improve.  If you doubt 
            that, look to other areas in the District that were
            once blighted.  
            
            Jay
            
            
            --- In columbia_heights@yahoogroups.com, mark mayhew
            
            <markjmayhew@y...> wrote:
                      
            I fixed it for you...
            --- "Pansegrouw, David N." <DPansegrouw@a...>
            wrote:
            
                        
            Don't like the park? Be a part of it. Play
                          
            chess,
                      
            play basketball. Buy, and pass around, some of
                          
            the
                      
            best crack you can find in the city.  Shop
            there....have you ever seen the Pentium 4 laptops
                        
            they
                      
            sell there, for $40? 
                        
            ________________________________
            
            From: columbia_heights_native
            [mailto:columbia_heights_native@y...]
            
            Sent: Thursday, December 30, 2004 10:23 PM
            To: columbia_heights@yahoogroups.com
            Subject: [columbia_heights] Re: 14th & Girard
            Concrete Park
            
            
            
            
            I also agree in beautifying and reconstructing
                          
            the
                      
            park. maybe old 
            and new residents should do some volunteer work
            there? Figure out 
            from residents who live around the park for
                          
            years
                      
            who are not on this 
            list serv and ask them. And mark what we don't
                          
            need
                      
            in this 
            neighborhood is a starbucks.. If you want to sip
                          
            on
                      
            some starbucks 
            coffee walk 4 blocks down to 18 & Columbia. 
            
            --- In columbia_heights@yahoogroups.com, mark
                          
            mayhew
                      
            <markjmayhew@y...> wrote:
                          
            put a StarBucks there and be done with it!
            
            --- Richard Parker <rparker@l...> wrote:
            
                            
            Richard,
            
            That is actually a very interesting
                              
            web-site. 
                      
            Thanks for forwarding.
            Couple of things:
            1. I was being facetious when I mentioned
                              
            fencing
                          
            the park off...you
            folks are taking me waaay too seriously (you
                              
            weren't
                          
            the only one to
            comment to me about that).
            2.  Although I was joking...ANYTHING would
                              
            be an
                      
            improvement.
            3.  I'm all for improving that place.  Some
                              
            of
                      
            my
                          
            saturday mornings are
            free and I wouldn't mind going down there
                              
            and
                      
            helping out...I just
            wouldn't know where to begin.  If someone
                              
            has
                      
            some
                          
            ideas I would love to
            hear them.  Maybe it would help spur some of
                              
            my
                      
            creative juices.  
            
            Happy Holiday's everyone...lighten up a bit.
            
            Rick
            
            
                              
            Richard Layman <rlaymandc@y...> 12/30/04
                                    
            11:52 AM >>>
            The point ought not be to close something as
                              
            much as
                          
            it is should be to
            improve it.  See "How to Turn A Place
                              
            Around"
                      
            workshop at www.pps.org. 
            Bad designs can all too often have bad
                              
            consequences.
                          
             The best way to
            get rid of negative behavior is to crowd it
                              
            out
                      
            with
                          
            good-better
            behavior. 
             
            Correct (what I call) "noxious uses" rather
                              
            than
                      
            try
                          
            to do away with
            them.
             
            Is a fenced in basically vacant lot any
                              
            better?
                      
             
            Richard Layman
            
            Rob Williams <rob@r...> wrote:
            
            
            THANK YOU.  I have mentioned that park a few
                              
            times
                          
            on this list serve. 
            I was beginning to wonder if I was just out
                              
            of
                      
            touch
                          
            or something.  That
            park is ridiculous.  I don't know what can
                              
            be
                      
            done
                          
            about it.  They need
            to put a fence around that place and close
                              
            it
                      
            off. 
                          
            Rick
            
            
                              
            "fourteenth_fairmont"
                                    
            <14th_Fairmont@c...> 12/30/04 9:47 AM
                              
            Neighbors,
             
            I was wondering what purpose is served by
                              
            having
                      
            a
                          
            city-run (but 
            obviously not maintained) concrete park at
                              
            the
                      
            corner of 14th & 
            Girard?   From my daily observations during
                              
            the
                      
            past
                          
            two years of 
            living in Columbia Heights, its function
                              
            seems
                      
            to be
                          
            mainly as an all-
            day/all-night open-air drinking, gambling,
                              
            drug
            
                      
            === message truncated ===
            
            
            
            		
            __________________________________ 
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          • tealspider
            Nice think-tank rhetoric for the Georgetown coffee houses, but kind of fuzzy as it relates to the immediate problem of getting rid of the drugging boozing, and
            Message 5 of 18 , Jan 2, 2005
            • 0 Attachment
              Nice think-tank rhetoric for the Georgetown coffee houses, but kind of
              fuzzy as it relates to the immediate problem of getting rid of the
              drugging boozing, and harassment of passer-byes in the concrete park area.

              I'll propose a solution - how about we take the lead from NYC and once
              a day round them up in a police van and arrent them for public
              loitering until it stops. Seems to have worked wonders in NYC.



              --- In columbia_heights@yahoogroups.com, William Jordan <whj@m...> wrote:
              >
              > There is NO so called "solution", at best the concept of a solution is
              > "CYA" fantasy for politicians and public servants whose careers depend
              > on baby sitting adults for whom selfishness and childish behavior is
              > good citizenship. Sometimes, I wonder if we are more interested in
              > validation of our own selfishness and biases than a solution anyway.
              > There are however a series of solutions, processes and approaches that
              > can be used to address this and other issues if community leadership
              > chooses to step up to the plate. We don't necessarily need community
              > super heroes; what we need is some adherence to the 80/20 rules. In
              > this case for about 20% of the adults to spend about 20% of on their
              > community responsibility energies working and communicating with each
              > other for the greater good this community and less time with official a
              > community arbitrators. Their are no Urban Disney short cuts for the
              > self-righteous, just the work sometimes hard of community leaders
              > willing to operate beyond lazy stereo-type driven ass-umptions and
              using
              > drive by anal-ysis, at least 20% of the time.
              >
              > Step 1: Community leaders are going to have to cut some of the time
              > normally spent talking to their "in groups", political and public
              > officials and spend more of that time dialoguing across "in groups".
              > This community is way too diverse for us to be so civically incestuous.
              > At least a quarterly community wide meeting of leaders, lead by jointly
              > by the chairs of the relevant ANC chairs or something like that is
              > needed. Basically, this greater community has the energy and talent
              > needed to make a tremendous impact on issues ranging from public
              safety,
              > to public spaces, to employment to housing; however, we need to spend
              > less time engaged in civic masturbation and more time engaged in true
              > civic intercourse.
              >
              > Step 2: We must take seriously the community and economic development
              > opportunities that this community has before us. Somehow, we have been
              > convinced that during an economic boom and growth period, that we
              should
              > adopt a depression like community and economic development policies.
              We
              > must immediately reject these regressive development policies, we are
              > being fed in the name of Gentrification, which is a failing policy for
              > community and economic development. For the most part we are adding
              > some great people to a current base of great people, our location is
              the
              > best in the city, their is not excuse for the silly us vs. them(es)
              > approach to things. There is way too much opportunity here to be
              > convinced that we should fight over crumbs. Our problem is that no
              > matter what the politicians say, Gentrification is not the optimal
              > community and economic development strategy for this community, at
              least
              > as it is being currently managed and stewarded.
              >
              > In the middle of a housing and construction boom, the unemployment rate
              > in Ward 1 has gone from 6.0% January 2001, to 5.4% January 2002 to
              > today's 7.7% as of October 2004. Yes as many of our property tax
              > assessments have about doubled since 2001, the number of unemployed has
              > increased from 2,359 to 3,355 persons. This when just in Columbia
              > Heights NCRC related projects are estimated to produce 2,345 and 1,715
              > permanent and construction jobs respectively. This does not include
              > parcel 34 or the Lincoln/Bell project. There is no excuse for the
              > unemployment rate in Ward 1 to be going up. Why is this employment
              > opportunity being missed, because childish petty and personal politics
              > is dictating it be this way. I'm not going to start on our half-ass
              > housing strategy. This community should be a model on how to do quality
              > housing the serves all levels of income well in an integrated
              environment.
              >
              > With the amount of publicly owned land in this community there no
              excuse
              > to have a community and economic development strategy that will
              leave us
              > with more density and less quality public spaces at the end than
              when we
              > started. It is silly for us to be infighting over a few pocket parks
              > when the opportunity to increase the quantity and quality of theses
              > types of space should at least tripled. Instead of pointing figures at
              > each other we should be demanding the creativity from ourselves and
              > others to at least triple parks and public spaces in this community.
              > While I'm on public space and parks, we have a Public Realm Plan
              > designed by a partnership between citizens and government for our
              > community designed over 18 months ago. It is currently unfunded,
              > instead of having to fight for funding for this plan we should be at a
              > point of refining it and expanding it to cover more and more of this
              > greater community. Finally it is pure folly for a community that is
              > less than a half mile from the city's largest park, Rock Creek, and not
              > have a plan to better access this resource. We want to spend too much
              > energy calling names. This is intellectually way beneath us. This is
              > especially the case when I know myself of at least 6 planning,
              > transportation and architectural experts who live in this community.
              Let
              > alone all the talent I know nothing of.
              >
              > In conclusion, if we just step outside of our petty and childish
              > political culture just 20% of the time we have more than enough
              > resources and talent to address most issues and opportunities before
              > us. Hell, even if we get into nasty fights we have professional
              > mediators that live in this community, that could help us work through
              > most things. There is no excuse for this community not to be
              clearly on
              > a path to greatness. We only need put aside our childish things and
              > attitudes 20% of the time. There is not one issue of importance that
              > some one or group in this community is not working on. Some need help,
              > some support, some a light kick in the pants. We just must find the
              > internal strength to work beyond our "in groups" 20% of the time. I
              > don't exclude myself from this.
              >
              > William
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > tealspider wrote:
              >
              > >And your solution?
              > >
              > >
              > >--- In columbia_heights@yahoogroups.com, "columbia_heights_native"
              > ><columbia_heights_native@y...> wrote:
              > >
              > >
              > >>it's real funny how you people complain, and complain, everyday on
              > >>this listserv.. I mean to tell you the truth thats what you guys are
              > >>really good at. I mean u come to this neighborhood knowing whats
              > >>going on this community, trying to run people out of their own
              > >>neighborhood, and instead of helping with the situation, you guys
              > >>just complain and cry for a starbucks. I guess thats what you guys
              > >>worship the most a nice coffe shop in the community that will solve
              > >>the community problems. Please we don't need more idiots in Columbia
              > >>Heights
              > >>
              > >>
              > >>--- In columbia_heights@yahoogroups.com, "tealspider"
              > >><tealspider@y...> wrote:
              > >>
              > >>
              > >>>I get a kick out of the liberal do-gooders that think everything is
              > >>>peachy dandy, all it will take is a little neighborhly love to just
              > >>>chip in and clean up the park.
              > >>>
              > >>>It's not the park that's the problem, stupid.
              > >>>
              > >>>It's the people. Spaced-out druggies, drunks, crack whores and your
              > >>>run of the mill low lifes. Cleaning up the blunt wrappers and Steel
              > >>>Reserve cans won't solve the problem.
              > >>>
              > >>>Our only hope is that the commercial development will accelerate and
              > >>>price-out and chase-out the leeches. Admit it, a Starbucks at that
              > >>>corner would solve the problem lickety split.
              > >>>
              > >>>
              > >>>
              > >>>--- In columbia_heights@yahoogroups.com, mark mayhew
              > >>><markjmayhew@y...> wrote:
              > >>>
              > >>>
              > >>>>--- Jay Phillips <jncapheights@y...> wrote:
              > >>>>
              > >>>>
              > >>>>
              > >>>>>I used to live down the street from this park. Most
              > >>>>>of the people
              > >>>>>there are somewhat benign and even friendly, tho' I
              > >>>>>really didn't
              > >>>>>enjoy the constant offer to sell drugs to me or the
              > >>>>>occasional
              > >>>>>admonishment to "go back where I came from." Funny
              > >>>>>that is,
              > >>>>>considering that my great-grandfather's family
              > >>>>>originally owned most
              > >>>>>of CH. If anything, they're the interlopers.
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>>Admittedly, the park is a public space and citizens
              > >>>>>should be able to
              > >>>>>use it regularly - in a legal way. If the city
              > >>>>>could tame the public
              > >>>>>urination and defecation, and the visits from people
              > >>>>>who don't live
              > >>>>>in the neighborhood, the park wouldn't be too bad.
              > >>>>>Dealers from
              > >>>>>outside CH are the ones who create the shady
              > >>>>>atmosphere.
              > >>>>>Unfortunately, the police know who the dealers are
              > >>>>>there, so they'd
              > >>>>>rather keep tabs on the "known" than sweep them out
              > >>>>>for
              > >>>>>the "unknown." Nothing like some good old gunfights
              > >>>>>for prime turf -
              > >>>>>or at least that's how the beat officers once
              > >>>>>explained it to me.
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>I don't care much if your great-grandfather owned the
              > >>>>Taj Mahal, crack dealers are crack dealers and should
              > >>>>go to jail, the longer the better. Those beat police
              > >>>>that told you that are wrong, they just didn't want to
              > >>>>interupt their donut break to chase some 15 year old
              > >>>>crack dealers around (not that they could catch 'em,
              > >>>>even if they wanted to).
              > >>>>When Steppenwolf did "God damn the pusherman", they
              > >>>>didn't say "Goddamn the out of state pusherman, God
              > >>>>bless the local pusher"
              > >>>>
              > >>>>Happy New Year!
              > >>>>
              > >>>>
              > >>>>
              > >>>>
              > >>>>>Give it a few more years. The situation will
              > >>>>>improve. If you doubt
              > >>>>>that, look to other areas in the District that were
              > >>>>>once blighted.
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>>Jay
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>>--- In columbia_heights@yahoogroups.com, mark mayhew
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>><markjmayhew@y...> wrote:
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>>>I fixed it for you...
              > >>>>>>--- "Pansegrouw, David N." <DPansegrouw@a...>
              > >>>>>>wrote:
              > >>>>>>
              > >>>>>>
              > >>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>Don't like the park? Be a part of it. Play
              > >>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>
              > >>>>>chess,
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>>>>play basketball. Buy, and pass around, some of
              > >>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>
              > >>>>>the
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>>>best crack you can find in the city. Shop
              > >>>>>>there....have you ever seen the Pentium 4 laptops
              > >>>>>>
              > >>>>>>
              > >>>>>they
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>>>sell there, for $40?
              > >>>>>>
              > >>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>________________________________
              > >>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>From: columbia_heights_native
              > >>>>>>>[mailto:columbia_heights_native@y...]
              > >>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>Sent: Thursday, December 30, 2004 10:23 PM
              > >>>>>>>To: columbia_heights@yahoogroups.com
              > >>>>>>>Subject: [columbia_heights] Re: 14th & Girard
              > >>>>>>>Concrete Park
              > >>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>I also agree in beautifying and reconstructing
              > >>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>
              > >>>>>the
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>>>>park. maybe old
              > >>>>>>>and new residents should do some volunteer work
              > >>>>>>>there? Figure out
              > >>>>>>>from residents who live around the park for
              > >>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>
              > >>>>>years
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>>>>who are not on this
              > >>>>>>>list serv and ask them. And mark what we don't
              > >>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>
              > >>>>>need
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>>>>in this
              > >>>>>>>neighborhood is a starbucks.. If you want to sip
              > >>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>
              > >>>>>on
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>>>>some starbucks
              > >>>>>>>coffee walk 4 blocks down to 18 & Columbia.
              > >>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>--- In columbia_heights@yahoogroups.com, mark
              > >>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>
              > >>>>>mayhew
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>>>><markjmayhew@y...> wrote:
              > >>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>put a StarBucks there and be done with it!
              > >>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>--- Richard Parker <rparker@l...> wrote:
              > >>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>>Richard,
              > >>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>>That is actually a very interesting
              > >>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>web-site.
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>>Thanks for forwarding.
              > >>>>>>>>>Couple of things:
              > >>>>>>>>>1. I was being facetious when I mentioned
              > >>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>fencing
              > >>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>>the park off...you
              > >>>>>>>>>folks are taking me waaay too seriously (you
              > >>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>weren't
              > >>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>>the only one to
              > >>>>>>>>>comment to me about that).
              > >>>>>>>>>2. Although I was joking...ANYTHING would
              > >>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>be an
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>>improvement.
              > >>>>>>>>>3. I'm all for improving that place. Some
              > >>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>of
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>>>>my
              > >>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>>saturday mornings are
              > >>>>>>>>>free and I wouldn't mind going down there
              > >>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>and
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>>helping out...I just
              > >>>>>>>>>wouldn't know where to begin. If someone
              > >>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>has
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>>>>some
              > >>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>>ideas I would love to
              > >>>>>>>>>hear them. Maybe it would help spur some of
              > >>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>my
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>>creative juices.
              > >>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>>Happy Holiday's everyone...lighten up a bit.
              > >>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>>Rick
              > >>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>>>>>Richard Layman <rlaymandc@y...> 12/30/04
              > >>>>>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>>11:52 AM >>>
              > >>>>>>>>>The point ought not be to close something as
              > >>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>much as
              > >>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>>it is should be to
              > >>>>>>>>>improve it. See "How to Turn A Place
              > >>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>Around"
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>>workshop at www.pps.org.
              > >>>>>>>>>Bad designs can all too often have bad
              > >>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>consequences.
              > >>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>> The best way to
              > >>>>>>>>>get rid of negative behavior is to crowd it
              > >>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>out
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>>>>with
              > >>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>>good-better
              > >>>>>>>>>behavior.
              > >>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>>Correct (what I call) "noxious uses" rather
              > >>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>than
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>>>>try
              > >>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>>to do away with
              > >>>>>>>>>them.
              > >>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>>Is a fenced in basically vacant lot any
              > >>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>better?
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>>Richard Layman
              > >>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>>Rob Williams <rob@r...> wrote:
              > >>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>>THANK YOU. I have mentioned that park a few
              > >>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>times
              > >>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>>on this list serve.
              > >>>>>>>>>I was beginning to wonder if I was just out
              > >>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>of
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>>>>touch
              > >>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>>or something. That
              > >>>>>>>>>park is ridiculous. I don't know what can
              > >>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>be
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>>>>done
              > >>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>>about it. They need
              > >>>>>>>>>to put a fence around that place and close
              > >>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>it
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>>>>off.
              > >>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>>Rick
              > >>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>>>>>"fourteenth_fairmont"
              > >>>>>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>><14th_Fairmont@c...> 12/30/04 9:47 AM
              > >>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>>Neighbors,
              > >>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>>I was wondering what purpose is served by
              > >>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>having
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>>>>a
              > >>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>>city-run (but
              > >>>>>>>>>obviously not maintained) concrete park at
              > >>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>the
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>>corner of 14th &
              > >>>>>>>>>Girard? From my daily observations during
              > >>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>the
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>>>>past
              > >>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>>two years of
              > >>>>>>>>>living in Columbia Heights, its function
              > >>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>seems
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>>>>to be
              > >>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>>mainly as an all-
              > >>>>>>>>>day/all-night open-air drinking, gambling,
              > >>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>>>>>
              > >>>>>drug
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>>
              > >>>>=== message truncated ===
              > >>>>
              > >>>>
              > >>>>
              > >>>>
              > >>>>__________________________________
              > >>>>Do you Yahoo!?
              > >>>>The all-new My Yahoo! - What will yours do?
              > >>>>http://my.yahoo.com
              > >>>>
              > >>>>
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >URL to this page on the web:
              http://groups.yahoo.com/group/columbia_heights/
              > >
              > >Yahoo! Groups Links
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
            • Andrew Foster
              Thanks for all the posts about the park. I live right by the park and pass it twice a day. As an avid gambler, I was very upset when the casino petition didnt
              Message 6 of 18 , Jan 3, 2005
              • 0 Attachment
                Thanks for all the posts about the park. I live right by the park and pass
                it twice a day. As an avid gambler, I was very upset when the casino
                petition didnt pass a few months back, it is great to know I now have a
                public place to play craps. Also, did not realize there was an open air drug
                market going on at all times....to think I've been wasting valuable time
                walking down to Euclid street for over a year. Re: chicken bones.....I don't
                actually enjoy throwing out my finished chicken bones, but in Texas, we just
                waste a bunch of money on campaigns such as the great, "don't mess with
                Texas". Considering everyone on this serv has too much time on their hands,
                maybe we can some up with a snappy slogan about chicken bones. Free five
                piece w/ french fries to the best slogan, in advance please throw your bones
                in the proper trash receptacle. Here's to a new year of great postings!

                its function seems to be mainly as an all-
                day/all-night open-air drinking, gambling, drug market with constant
                yelling at, and intimidation of, passersby. Is it legal to be
                obviously drinking in the open, intoxicated all hours of the day, and
                openly betting money on who know what? Not to mention its status as
                a dining venue where you don't even have to bother with throwing your
                carryout boxes away, hell, just throw them on the ground. Who cares
                if the trash can is merely at the entrance? It is pretty annoying
                trying to make sure your dog doesn't choke on the chicken and pork
                chop bones scattered all over the place.



                >From: columbia_heights@yahoogroups.com
                >Reply-To: columbia_heights@yahoogroups.com
                >To: columbia_heights@yahoogroups.com
                >Subject: [columbia_heights] Digest Number 1730
                >Date: 31 Dec 2004 18:02:14 -0000
              • caseycallister
                Many folks like to post problems, I like to post solutions. When good neighbors of 14th and Girard start using the park for what it was meant, the illegal
                Message 7 of 18 , Jan 5, 2005
                • 0 Attachment
                  Many folks like to post problems, I like to post solutions.
                   
                  When good neighbors of 14th and Girard start using the park for what it was meant,  the illegal uses will  fade away. 
                   
                  I organize community sports leagues in and around Columbia Heights.  Lets put a recreational Basket Ball League at 14th and Girard in the Spring. Lets meet our neighbors through sports and clean up the park by using it properly.
                   
                  If anyone is interested in helping me set-up a Basket Ball league for the Spring at the Park respond back directly.
                   
                  I will sponsor court clean up, new basket ball nets, and take care of the league overhead responsibilities such as player insurance and player registrations. I just need a league coordinator !
                   
                  Thanks,
                   
                   - Casey
                   
                  ----- Original Message -----
                  Sent: Monday, January 03, 2005 12:23 PM
                  Subject: [columbia_heights] 14th & Girard Concrete Park



                  Thanks for all the posts about the park. I live right by the park and pass
                  it twice a day. As an avid gambler, I was very upset when the casino
                  petition didnt pass a few months back, it is great to know I now have a
                  public place to play craps. Also, did not realize there was an open air drug
                  market going on at all times....to think I've been wasting valuable time
                  walking down to Euclid street for over a year. Re: chicken bones.....I don't
                  actually enjoy throwing out my finished chicken bones, but in Texas, we just
                  waste a bunch of money on campaigns such as the great, "don't mess with
                  Texas". Considering everyone on this serv has too much time on their hands,
                  maybe we can some up with a snappy slogan about chicken bones. Free five
                  piece w/ french fries to the best slogan, in advance please throw your bones
                  in the proper trash receptacle. Here's to a new year of great postings!

                  its function seems to be mainly as an all-
                  day/all-night open-air drinking, gambling, drug market with constant
                  yelling at,  and intimidation of, passersby.  Is it legal to be
                  obviously drinking in the open, intoxicated all hours of the day, and
                  openly betting money on who know what?  Not to mention its status as
                  a dining venue where you don't even have to bother with throwing your
                  carryout boxes away, hell, just throw them on the ground.  Who cares
                  if the trash can is merely at the entrance?  It is pretty annoying
                  trying to make sure your dog doesn't choke on the chicken and pork
                  chop bones scattered all over the place.



                  >From: columbia_heights@yahoogroups.com
                  >Reply-To: columbia_heights@yahoogroups.com
                  >To: columbia_heights@yahoogroups.com
                  >Subject: [columbia_heights] Digest Number 1730
                  >Date: 31 Dec 2004 18:02:14 -0000




                  URL to this page on the web: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/columbia_heights/


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