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Re: Mt. Pony documents

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  • Mark Foster
    ... The Super Combat Center was proposed in 1959 and withdrawn in 1960. The Combat Operations Center (COC) (AKA 425L Program), began construction in 1961 and
    Message 1 of 12 , Apr 11, 1999
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      At 12:18 PM 4/11/99 -0400, you wrote:
      >From: CLDWARHIST@...
      >
      >A super combat center? Thats interesting... What really got me interested
      >though was the mention of the SAC Deep Underground Facility, which the DUCC
      >documents indicate was built the year before DUCC was proposed.
      >George
      >

      The Super Combat Center was proposed in 1959 and withdrawn in 1960. The
      Combat Operations Center (COC) (AKA 425L Program), began construction in
      1961 and NORAD moved from Ent AFB to Cheyenne MT in 1965. I assume the SAC
      Deep Underground Facility you refer to is Cheyenne Mt.

      Cheyenne Mt. was never considered survivable in an all out nuclear
      exchange. Even as it was being built in 1961 the Post Attack Command and
      Control (PACCS) system was being developed. To make PACCS survivable the
      plan was to put a 5,000 foot deep command center under Offutt AFB near
      Omaha. Problems with this system caused the idea to be withdrawn in 1963.
      PACCS existed with a combination of semi hard ground facilities and PACCS
      aircraft. The only PACCS semi hardened facility that I know of is "The
      Notch" at Westover AFB (http://www1.shore.net/~mfoster/PACCS.htm). Efforts
      to find sister facilities at Barksdale AFB, March AFB and Offutt AFB have
      been unsuccessful.
    • CLDWARHIST@xxx.xxx
      In a message dated 4/11/99 12:56:43 PM Eastern Daylight Time, mfoster@shore.net writes:
      Message 2 of 12 , Apr 11, 1999
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        In a message dated 4/11/99 12:56:43 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
        mfoster@... writes:

        << I assume the SAC
        Deep Underground Facility you refer to is Cheyenne Mt. >>
        No I dont believe so..Cheyenne Mt construction was only just starting when
        the SAC Deep underground facility was built and Cheyenne has only been a
        NORAD facility. DOD FY 65 Annual Report mentions planning began in 1966 or
        so for a alternate NORAD COC which is at Lamar, Colorado.
        George
      • Mark Foster
        ... Are you saying a 3,500 foot deep SAC facility exists at Lamar? I don t believe any deep facility was ever built.
        Message 3 of 12 , Apr 11, 1999
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          At 01:10 PM 4/11/99 -0400, you wrote:
          >From: CLDWARHIST@...
          >
          >In a message dated 4/11/99 12:56:43 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
          >mfoster@... writes:
          >
          ><< I assume the SAC
          > Deep Underground Facility you refer to is Cheyenne Mt. >>
          >No I dont believe so..Cheyenne Mt construction was only just starting when
          >the SAC Deep underground facility was built and Cheyenne has only been a
          >NORAD facility. DOD FY 65 Annual Report mentions planning began in 1966 or
          >so for a alternate NORAD COC which is at Lamar, Colorado.
          >George
          >
          Are you saying a 3,500 foot deep SAC facility exists at Lamar? I don't
          believe any "deep" facility was ever built.
        • CLDWARHIST@xxx.xxx
          In a message dated 4/11/99 9:10:24 PM Eastern Daylight Time, mfoster@shore.net writes:
          Message 4 of 12 , Apr 11, 1999
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            In a message dated 4/11/99 9:10:24 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
            mfoster@... writes:

            << Are you saying a 3,500 foot deep SAC facility exists at Lamar? I don't
            believe any "deep" facility was ever built. >>
            No. I'm not sure how deep the SAC DEEPUNDERGROUND FACILITY was, and it was
            pointed out to me by one very old man in Detroit that I have no proof it was
            built.

            I am saying that in Lamar, Colorado, NORAD built an alternate combat
            operations center as a backup to Cheyenne Mountain, CO.
            George
          • Mark Foster
            ... Not to belabor the point but from the official NORAD history web page: 18 Feb 82 -- Construction work began at Peterson AFB on the NORAD Cheyenne Mountain
            Message 5 of 12 , Apr 11, 1999
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              At 09:11 PM 4/11/99 -0400, you wrote:
              >From: CLDWARHIST@...
              >
              >In a message dated 4/11/99 9:10:24 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
              >mfoster@... writes:
              >
              ><< Are you saying a 3,500 foot deep SAC facility exists at Lamar? I don't
              > believe any "deep" facility was ever built. >>
              >No. I'm not sure how deep the SAC DEEPUNDERGROUND FACILITY was, and it was
              >pointed out to me by one very old man in Detroit that I have no proof it was
              >built.
              >
              >I am saying that in Lamar, Colorado, NORAD built an alternate combat
              >operations center as a backup to Cheyenne Mountain, CO.
              >George

              Not to belabor the point but from the official NORAD history web page:


              18 Feb 82 -- Construction work began at Peterson AFB on the NORAD Cheyenne
              Mountain command post backup facility.

              15 Jul 82 -- The NORAD Combat Operations Center Backup Facility, on
              Peterson AFB, achieved initial operational capability. It would assume
              command and control functions from the CMC in case that facility
              experienced a failure of was disabled under conditions short of nuclear war.

              16 Nov 82 -- The NORAD Combat Operations Center Backup Facility reached
              Full Operational Capability.
            • CLDWARHIST@xxx.xxx
              In a message dated 4/11/99 10:09:37 PM Eastern Daylight Time, mfoster@shore.net writes:
              Message 6 of 12 , Apr 11, 1999
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                In a message dated 4/11/99 10:09:37 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
                mfoster@... writes:

                << Not to belabor the point but from the official NORAD history web pag >>
                Thats interesting...i wonder what happened to the one i was referring to (i
                might not of already said it but the alternate Combat Ops Center was first
                mentioned in 1965 when planning was given a "go-ahead", where as the Peterson
                facility that Mark mentions began in 1982...)?
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