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Re: Mt. Pony documents

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  • CLDWARHIST@xxx.xxx
    A super combat center? Thats interesting... What really got me interested though was the mention of the SAC Deep Underground Facility, which the DUCC
    Message 1 of 12 , Apr 11, 1999
      A super combat center? Thats interesting... What really got me interested
      though was the mention of the SAC Deep Underground Facility, which the DUCC
      documents indicate was built the year before DUCC was proposed.
      George
    • Mark Foster
      ... The Super Combat Center was proposed in 1959 and withdrawn in 1960. The Combat Operations Center (COC) (AKA 425L Program), began construction in 1961 and
      Message 2 of 12 , Apr 11, 1999
        At 12:18 PM 4/11/99 -0400, you wrote:
        >From: CLDWARHIST@...
        >
        >A super combat center? Thats interesting... What really got me interested
        >though was the mention of the SAC Deep Underground Facility, which the DUCC
        >documents indicate was built the year before DUCC was proposed.
        >George
        >

        The Super Combat Center was proposed in 1959 and withdrawn in 1960. The
        Combat Operations Center (COC) (AKA 425L Program), began construction in
        1961 and NORAD moved from Ent AFB to Cheyenne MT in 1965. I assume the SAC
        Deep Underground Facility you refer to is Cheyenne Mt.

        Cheyenne Mt. was never considered survivable in an all out nuclear
        exchange. Even as it was being built in 1961 the Post Attack Command and
        Control (PACCS) system was being developed. To make PACCS survivable the
        plan was to put a 5,000 foot deep command center under Offutt AFB near
        Omaha. Problems with this system caused the idea to be withdrawn in 1963.
        PACCS existed with a combination of semi hard ground facilities and PACCS
        aircraft. The only PACCS semi hardened facility that I know of is "The
        Notch" at Westover AFB (http://www1.shore.net/~mfoster/PACCS.htm). Efforts
        to find sister facilities at Barksdale AFB, March AFB and Offutt AFB have
        been unsuccessful.
      • CLDWARHIST@xxx.xxx
        In a message dated 4/11/99 12:56:43 PM Eastern Daylight Time, mfoster@shore.net writes:
        Message 3 of 12 , Apr 11, 1999
          In a message dated 4/11/99 12:56:43 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
          mfoster@... writes:

          << I assume the SAC
          Deep Underground Facility you refer to is Cheyenne Mt. >>
          No I dont believe so..Cheyenne Mt construction was only just starting when
          the SAC Deep underground facility was built and Cheyenne has only been a
          NORAD facility. DOD FY 65 Annual Report mentions planning began in 1966 or
          so for a alternate NORAD COC which is at Lamar, Colorado.
          George
        • Mark Foster
          ... Are you saying a 3,500 foot deep SAC facility exists at Lamar? I don t believe any deep facility was ever built.
          Message 4 of 12 , Apr 11, 1999
            At 01:10 PM 4/11/99 -0400, you wrote:
            >From: CLDWARHIST@...
            >
            >In a message dated 4/11/99 12:56:43 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
            >mfoster@... writes:
            >
            ><< I assume the SAC
            > Deep Underground Facility you refer to is Cheyenne Mt. >>
            >No I dont believe so..Cheyenne Mt construction was only just starting when
            >the SAC Deep underground facility was built and Cheyenne has only been a
            >NORAD facility. DOD FY 65 Annual Report mentions planning began in 1966 or
            >so for a alternate NORAD COC which is at Lamar, Colorado.
            >George
            >
            Are you saying a 3,500 foot deep SAC facility exists at Lamar? I don't
            believe any "deep" facility was ever built.
          • CLDWARHIST@xxx.xxx
            In a message dated 4/11/99 9:10:24 PM Eastern Daylight Time, mfoster@shore.net writes:
            Message 5 of 12 , Apr 11, 1999
              In a message dated 4/11/99 9:10:24 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
              mfoster@... writes:

              << Are you saying a 3,500 foot deep SAC facility exists at Lamar? I don't
              believe any "deep" facility was ever built. >>
              No. I'm not sure how deep the SAC DEEPUNDERGROUND FACILITY was, and it was
              pointed out to me by one very old man in Detroit that I have no proof it was
              built.

              I am saying that in Lamar, Colorado, NORAD built an alternate combat
              operations center as a backup to Cheyenne Mountain, CO.
              George
            • Mark Foster
              ... Not to belabor the point but from the official NORAD history web page: 18 Feb 82 -- Construction work began at Peterson AFB on the NORAD Cheyenne Mountain
              Message 6 of 12 , Apr 11, 1999
                At 09:11 PM 4/11/99 -0400, you wrote:
                >From: CLDWARHIST@...
                >
                >In a message dated 4/11/99 9:10:24 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
                >mfoster@... writes:
                >
                ><< Are you saying a 3,500 foot deep SAC facility exists at Lamar? I don't
                > believe any "deep" facility was ever built. >>
                >No. I'm not sure how deep the SAC DEEPUNDERGROUND FACILITY was, and it was
                >pointed out to me by one very old man in Detroit that I have no proof it was
                >built.
                >
                >I am saying that in Lamar, Colorado, NORAD built an alternate combat
                >operations center as a backup to Cheyenne Mountain, CO.
                >George

                Not to belabor the point but from the official NORAD history web page:


                18 Feb 82 -- Construction work began at Peterson AFB on the NORAD Cheyenne
                Mountain command post backup facility.

                15 Jul 82 -- The NORAD Combat Operations Center Backup Facility, on
                Peterson AFB, achieved initial operational capability. It would assume
                command and control functions from the CMC in case that facility
                experienced a failure of was disabled under conditions short of nuclear war.

                16 Nov 82 -- The NORAD Combat Operations Center Backup Facility reached
                Full Operational Capability.
              • CLDWARHIST@xxx.xxx
                In a message dated 4/11/99 10:09:37 PM Eastern Daylight Time, mfoster@shore.net writes:
                Message 7 of 12 , Apr 11, 1999
                  In a message dated 4/11/99 10:09:37 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
                  mfoster@... writes:

                  << Not to belabor the point but from the official NORAD history web pag >>
                  Thats interesting...i wonder what happened to the one i was referring to (i
                  might not of already said it but the alternate Combat Ops Center was first
                  mentioned in 1965 when planning was given a "go-ahead", where as the Peterson
                  facility that Mark mentions began in 1982...)?
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