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Re: [coldwarcomms] Sugar Grove Shuts, Joining Yakima

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  • John Young
    Wonder what use will be made of Sugar Grove and Yakima, as well as other retired comms facilities, whether mothballed, abandoned and locked -- scavenger bait
    Message 1 of 10 , Apr 25, 2013
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      Wonder what use will be made of Sugar Grove and Yakima, as well as
      other retired comms facilities, whether mothballed, abandoned
      and locked -- scavenger bait -- like the Soviets and cohorts, turned
      into historic monuments like missile silos, dismantled to protect
      secrets or transferred for another use, gov, mil, or org.

      Base closures have had a mixed result, impacted by toxic
      clean-ups, soured real estate deals, contracting graft, shallow
      redevelopment design. Mixed uses of mil and com, with a
      bit of edu are intriguing.

      Goodfellow Air Force Base, San Angelo, TX, is a case in point.
      Hosts a military cryptologic training base, commerical outlets,
      educational resources, playgrounds, parks, go-carts, rodeo, and
      what have you, surviving cut-backs since WW2. Not clear where
      the classification stops and civvy stuff begins. Friendly place,
      not bristling with hostility and suspicion and natsec strut like
      say, Bragg, nuclear bases and seriously important outfits.

      Guess it will the old guard and its befuddled recruits will have
      to die off to free up the country from separation of the citizenry
      from its zealous protectors of mil, com, org and religion.

      Goodfellow could be a model, but a threat to the separators.
    • Frank Helton
      John, you are so unknowing, it s a) sad and b) funny. Tell us something that we don t already know! Frank USAF 66-74 USAFSS 72-74 TSGT 304X4 -Original
      Message 2 of 10 , Apr 25, 2013
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        John, you are so unknowing, it's a) sad and b) funny.

        Tell us something that we don't already know!

        Frank
        USAF 66-74
        USAFSS 72-74
        TSGT 304X4


        -Original Message-----
        From: John Young
        Sent: Thursday, April 25, 2013 6:56 PM
        To: coldwarcomms@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: Re: [coldwarcomms] Sugar Grove Shuts, Joining Yakima

        Wonder what use will be made of Sugar Grove and Yakima, as well as
        other retired comms facilities, whether mothballed, abandoned
        and locked -- scavenger bait -- like the Soviets and cohorts, turned
        into historic monuments like missile silos, dismantled to protect
        secrets or transferred for another use, gov, mil, or org.

        Base closures have had a mixed result, impacted by toxic
        clean-ups, soured real estate deals, contracting graft, shallow
        redevelopment design. Mixed uses of mil and com, with a
        bit of edu are intriguing.

        Goodfellow Air Force Base, San Angelo, TX, is a case in point.
        Hosts a military cryptologic training base, commerical outlets,
        educational resources, playgrounds, parks, go-carts, rodeo, and
        what have you, surviving cut-backs since WW2. Not clear where
        the classification stops and civvy stuff begins. Friendly place,
        not bristling with hostility and suspicion and natsec strut like
        say, Bragg, nuclear bases and seriously important outfits.

        Guess it will the old guard and its befuddled recruits will have
        to die off to free up the country from separation of the citizenry
        from its zealous protectors of mil, com, org and religion.

        Goodfellow could be a model, but a threat to the separators.




        ------------------------------------

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      • ajbtelecom
        Hi Frank, As a mere grunt who got the boot for being physically defective [genetic gimpiness], I hesitate to ask this, because I do not want to sound like I am
        Message 3 of 10 , Apr 27, 2013
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          Hi Frank,

          As a mere grunt who got the boot for being physically defective [genetic gimpiness], I hesitate to ask this, because I do not want to sound like I am questioning the authority of an Officer.

          But, I am confused... First you say John is "unknowing," but then you say you already know everything he said, implying that you agree with it. Which is it?

          Personally, I enjoy reading John's posts. Not everyone agrees on everything, or shares the same point of view. That is what makes the internet more interesting than TV [for now].

          Jim Bennett
          ==================================================
          Speaking from a secure undisclosed location.

          --- In coldwarcomms@yahoogroups.com, "Frank Helton" <f_helton@...> wrote:
          >
          > John, you are so unknowing, it's a) sad and b) funny.
          >
          > Tell us something that we don't already know!
          >
          > Frank
          > USAF 66-74
          > USAFSS 72-74
          > TSGT 304X4
          >
        • Frank Helton
          Not an officer here, Jim, I worked for a living per the old saying. I was just a little put off at the time by the old guard and its befuddled recruits
          Message 4 of 10 , Apr 27, 2013
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            Not an officer here, Jim, "I worked for a living" per the old saying. I was
            just a little put off at the time by the "old guard and its befuddled
            recruits" and "zealous protectors" rhetoric, but no biggie. In hindsight,
            to have reacted at all was inappropriate for this forum.

            Frank



            -----Original Message-----
            From: ajbtelecom
            Sent: Saturday, April 27, 2013 9:15 AM
            To: coldwarcomms@yahoogroups.com
            Subject: [coldwarcomms] Re: Sugar Grove Shuts, Joining Yakima

            Hi Frank,

            As a mere grunt who got the boot for being physically defective [genetic
            gimpiness], I hesitate to ask this, because I do not want to sound like I am
            questioning the authority of an Officer.

            But, I am confused... First you say John is "unknowing," but then you say
            you already know everything he said, implying that you agree with it. Which
            is it?

            Personally, I enjoy reading John's posts. Not everyone agrees on
            everything, or shares the same point of view. That is what makes the
            internet more interesting than TV [for now].

            Jim Bennett
            ==================================================
            Speaking from a secure undisclosed location.

            --- In coldwarcomms@yahoogroups.com, "Frank Helton" <f_helton@...> wrote:
            >
            > John, you are so unknowing, it's a) sad and b) funny.
            >
            > Tell us something that we don't already know!
            >
            > Frank
            > USAF 66-74
            > USAFSS 72-74
            > TSGT 304X4
            >




            ------------------------------------

            Yahoo! Groups Links
          • ajbtelecom
            Frank, It s all good. This is the open discussion that our founding fathers intended, because as they understood, the truth usually lies somewhere in the
            Message 5 of 10 , Apr 27, 2013
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              Frank,

              It's all good. This is the open discussion that our founding fathers intended, because as they understood, the truth usually lies somewhere in the middle. The "two sides of the aisle" syndrome that the country is enduring these days is really not new at all, and it actually still seems to be working OK, even if it does seem overblown sometimes.

              At the end of the day, I would not want to be governed by either extreme: Having Abbie Hoffman's people running the show would be equally as horrible as having Joseph McCarthy's people at the helm. Most of the country, thankfully, reside somewhere between those two endpoints, and hopefully the most reasonable of them have the important jobs: Making the real decisions that count, based on real world knowledge and experience.

              As far as working for a living, I can certainly relate to that. A lot of people here worked on things that were truly huge, stuff that they still aren't allowed to talk about. Others have such a wealth of technical knowledge and skill that I would get an inferiority complex if I wasn't insulated by my huge ego :^) Then I remember the old saying: All jobs need to be done, and they need to be done well. However small my contribution was[1], I am proud to have done something to help advance the technology that makes this conversation possible.

              [1] Tending to the more menial aspects of growing and doping amorphous silicon, which tends to involve breathing toxic nasties and risking hell fire. Trust me, there is a reason we don't do much of that in this country anymore. I don't miss trying to teach summer interns the proper handling procedures for pyrophoric gasses.

              Jim Bennett
              ==================================================
              Speaking from a secure undisclosed location.

              --- In coldwarcomms@yahoogroups.com, "Frank Helton" <f_helton@...> wrote:
              >
              > Not an officer here, Jim, "I worked for a living" per the old saying. I was
              > just a little put off at the time by the "old guard and its befuddled
              > recruits" and "zealous protectors" rhetoric, but no biggie. In hindsight,
              > to have reacted at all was inappropriate for this forum.
              >
              > Frank
              >
            • John Young
              My mouse has been soap-washed. In US Army 53-56, loved it, GI Bill sent me to college. Should have stayed in, retired after 20 or 30, instead of still working,
              Message 6 of 10 , Apr 27, 2013
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                My mouse has been soap-washed.

                In US Army 53-56, loved it, GI Bill sent me to college.
                Should have stayed in, retired after 20 or 30, instead
                of still working, very slowly, after almost 60 of civvy.
                Yeah, I know it's boing to excuse loose lip bowels to
                being old. But really old is a war story you gotta put
                up with.

                Thank you for your service, Frank. And you others
                with MOS'es beyond my grade. May not believe it, but
                I'm still a die-hard grunt fan, still bitching about moping
                brass's puke.

                At 10:36 AM 4/27/2013, you wrote:
                >
                >
                >Not an officer here, Jim, "I worked for a living" per the old saying. I was
                >just a little put off at the time by the "old guard and its befuddled
                >recruits" and "zealous protectors" rhetoric, but no biggie. In hindsight,
                >to have reacted at all was inappropriate for this forum.
                >
                >Frank
              • Frank Helton
                Just to set the working for a living thing straight, Jim - the divide between officer and enlisted was pronounced. So when you referred to me as an
                Message 7 of 10 , Apr 27, 2013
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                  Just to set the "working for a living" thing straight, Jim - the divide
                  between officer and enlisted was pronounced. So when you referred to me as
                  an "officer", I just wanted to make it clear that I was an enlisted man, an
                  NCO, not a commissioned officer. That was just a humorous way of putting
                  it.

                  And thanks for your thoughts, John.

                  Frank



                  -----Original Message-----
                  From: ajbtelecom
                  Sent: Saturday, April 27, 2013 10:35 AM
                  To: coldwarcomms@yahoogroups.com
                  Subject: [coldwarcomms] Re: Sugar Grove Shuts, Joining Yakima

                  Frank,

                  It's all good. This is the open discussion that our founding fathers
                  intended, because as they understood, the truth usually lies somewhere in
                  the middle. The "two sides of the aisle" syndrome that the country is
                  enduring these days is really not new at all, and it actually still seems to
                  be working OK, even if it does seem overblown sometimes.

                  At the end of the day, I would not want to be governed by either extreme:
                  Having Abbie Hoffman's people running the show would be equally as horrible
                  as having Joseph McCarthy's people at the helm. Most of the country,
                  thankfully, reside somewhere between those two endpoints, and hopefully the
                  most reasonable of them have the important jobs: Making the real decisions
                  that count, based on real world knowledge and experience.

                  As far as working for a living, I can certainly relate to that. A lot of
                  people here worked on things that were truly huge, stuff that they still
                  aren't allowed to talk about. Others have such a wealth of technical
                  knowledge and skill that I would get an inferiority complex if I wasn't
                  insulated by my huge ego :^) Then I remember the old saying: All jobs need
                  to be done, and they need to be done well. However small my contribution
                  was[1], I am proud to have done something to help advance the technology
                  that makes this conversation possible.

                  [1] Tending to the more menial aspects of growing and doping amorphous
                  silicon, which tends to involve breathing toxic nasties and risking hell
                  fire. Trust me, there is a reason we don't do much of that in this country
                  anymore. I don't miss trying to teach summer interns the proper handling
                  procedures for pyrophoric gasses.

                  Jim Bennett
                  ==================================================
                  Speaking from a secure undisclosed location.

                  --- In coldwarcomms@yahoogroups.com, "Frank Helton" <f_helton@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > Not an officer here, Jim, "I worked for a living" per the old saying. I
                  > was
                  > just a little put off at the time by the "old guard and its befuddled
                  > recruits" and "zealous protectors" rhetoric, but no biggie. In hindsight,
                  > to have reacted at all was inappropriate for this forum.
                  >
                  > Frank
                  >



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