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RE: [coldwarcomms] Re: Carrier heritage, was Huts on Vaults

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  • Blake Bowers
    Thanks for the great info! _____ From: coldwarcomms@yahoogroups.com [mailto:coldwarcomms@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of widebandit Sent: Monday, December 31,
    Message 1 of 55 , Dec 31, 2012
      Thanks for the great info!





      _____

      From: coldwarcomms@yahoogroups.com [mailto:coldwarcomms@yahoogroups.com] On
      Behalf Of widebandit
      Sent: Monday, December 31, 2012 11:13 PM
      To: coldwarcomms@yahoogroups.com
      Subject: [coldwarcomms] Re: Carrier heritage, was Huts on Vaults





      > So do you all figure this was a cable hut before microwave?
      >

      No... It's an original early 50s TD2 Delay-Lens repeater station that was
      converted to Horn-Reflector:
      <http://long-lines.net/places-routes/AdairIA/Adair-IA-NW-1.html>
      <http://long-lines.net/places-routes/ElkHornIA/IMG_0063a.html>
      <http://long-lines.net/places-routes/Yellow_Springs/BSTJ0952-844.jpg>

      Which is also confirmed by the tower:
      <http://www.flickr.com/photos/ashleyandcompany/5732928206/in/set-72157626622
      878449/>
      The internal deck 12'6" below main platform provided a solid floor for
      waveguide installers to run the plumbing from the vertical rectangular
      waveguide run behind the access ladder to the four points where they were
      brought up through the deck and connected to the KS5759 Delay-Lens horns...

      The single WC-281 circular waveguide support outrigger catwalk was added
      when the station was converted to KS15676 horn reflectors...

      These two features - the interior decking, and separate WC-281 catwalks for
      each main-deck KS15676 horn - are the primary giveaways that an A-tower once
      supported Delay-Lens antennas. There are other tower and platform ironwork
      details as well, but these two are what should catch your eye right away.
      It's one of the first things I notice when I look at a Type-A tower...

      BTW - Type-A and its variants (including the 400' special tower in downtown
      DesMoines, the "cabin-in-the-sky" towers seen mainly in Nebraska and
      Colorado, and the wide-batter Type-G predecessors in hurricane territory)
      are the only main-route steel towers to carry Delay Lens. Type-E, -H, and
      later towers were all designed specifically for Horn-Reflector - wa -

      >
      > (only site I ever went into and found a suit of armor)
      >
      >
      http://www.flickr.com/photos/ashleyandcompany/5732369401/in/set-721576266228
      > 78449
      >
      > , David <wb8foz@> wrote:
      > >
      > > <http://www.thecentraloffice.com/PA/PA.htm>
      > >
      > > If Springville wasn't a K Hut originally, I'd be surprised.
      >
      > At face value, I agree, and I put it in the database. There are problems
      > with that scenario though. For Springville to be a K repeater between
      > Scranton and Binghamton N.Y., there would have to be two more (one to each
      > side of Springville) for a total of three, where two would normally do to
      > cover that distance--or-- Scranton and/or Binghamton weren't K carrier
      > "main" stations (with repeaters) on the route.
      >
      > The Scranton-Binghamton cable is the only cable I can find today that goes
      > near there, it passes at the nearest point, 5 miles away. The distance
      from
      > Scranton to Binghamton at 52 miles is (just?) within the distance for VF
      > toll cable w/o the need for any VF repeaters along the way.
      >
      > The distance and location would work better for a Wilkes-Barre to
      Binghamton
      > K; but once again I don't find a cable or huts in the areas they would
      need
      > to be. It does look like Bell System construction, and LL does have a
      > history of selling properties to independents, so this makes much makes
      > sense.
      >
      > I think we're going to need more info to unravel this mystery. In the mean
      > time don't rule out J. Some of the J huts were of the same style. I was
      over
      > a decade trying to figure what a hut near me was that wasn't on any maps
      or
      > known to local folks. It wasn't until last year I found the answer in the
      > recently published BSTJs. It turns out that C carrier had been abandoned
      so
      > long, not the retirees I asked new anything about it--so may be the case
      > here.
      >
      > /cpe
      >





      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • OZOB99
      More on Wright City: http://www.dnr.mo.gov/shpo/nps-nr/07000039.pdf
      Message 55 of 55 , Jun 11, 2013
        More on Wright City:

        http://www.dnr.mo.gov/shpo/nps-nr/07000039.pdf





        --- In coldwarcomms@yahoogroups.com, "cpe122" <cpe122@...> wrote:
        >
        > I wish the "hunting" was as good in KS & OK as it was last spring in MO (I need maps of the midwest bad) ...
        >
        > http://www.gpsvisualizer.com/display/1356494834-15040-70.16.107.160.html
        >
        > /cpe
        >
        > p.s. Roger that on the bank; Wright City main.
        >
        > --- In coldwarcomms@yahoogroups.com, "Blake Bowers" <bbowerslists@> wrote:
        > >
        > > Got a few more on the route from KC to STL. This site was called Dover,
        > > although later a microwave route made a site in the middle of Dover MO
        > > another Dover. Dover 2 was a junction.
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > > Dover 1, at this link was another two story building.
        > > http://goo.gl/maps/Jwt0f
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > > http://goo.gl/maps/Jwt0f is just outside of Columbia MO
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > > http://goo.gl/maps/rpNrn is at Kingdom City MO.
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > > There is another visible from the interstate closer to STL, used to be an
        > > auto parts store, now I believe it is a bank.
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > > : coldwarcomms@yahoogroups.com [mailto:coldwarcomms@yahoogroups.com] On
        > > Behalf Of cpe122
        > > Sent: Monday, December 24, 2012 10:38 PM
        > > To: coldwarcomms@yahoogroups.com
        > > Subject: [coldwarcomms] Re: Carrier heritage, was Huts on Vaults
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > > --- In coldwarcomms@yahoogroups.com <mailto:coldwarcomms%40yahoogroups.com>
        > > , "Blake Bowers" <bbowerslists@> wrote:
        > > >
        > > > Very nice. North of Joplin includes
        > > >
        > > > http://goo.gl/maps/xCxX1
        > > >
        > > > http://goo.gl/maps/WyGBu
        > > > LaCygne was a major work center in later life.
        > >
        > > Thanks! Finding the rest up through to KC will have to wait until another
        > > day.
        > >
        > > /cpe
        > > >
        > > > _____
        > > >
        > > > From: coldwarcomms@yahoogroups.com <mailto:coldwarcomms%40yahoogroups.com>
        > > [mailto:coldwarcomms@yahoogroups.com <mailto:coldwarcomms%40yahoogroups.com>
        > > ] On
        > > > Behalf Of cpe122
        > > > Sent: Sunday, December 23, 2012 9:45 PM
        > > > To: coldwarcomms@yahoogroups.com <mailto:coldwarcomms%40yahoogroups.com>
        > > > Subject: [coldwarcomms] Re: Carrier heritage, was Huts on Vaults
        > > >
        > > >
        > > >
        > > >
        > > >
        > > > Blake,
        > > >
        > > > Link below shows repeater locations for the Tulsa,OK - Joplin,MO VF cable
        > > > (via Vinita RS) [big blue circles] overlaid with K carrier [little yellow
        > > > circles], which I believe was done mid-late 30's. The temporary map is
        > > > interactive and the pins are hover and clickable.
        > > >
        > > > http://www.gpsvisualizer.com/display/1356319271-30345-70.16.107.160.html
        > > >
        > > > It would appear the distance from Joplin to Tulsa was too great for five
        > > > early K1(?) repeaters (where the fifth one would be expected at Vinita
        > > RS);
        > > > so there apparently were six resulting in a compressed repeater layout (15
        > > > miles +/-) (where the middle span skips over Vinita RS).
        > > >
        > > > /cpe
        > > > --- In coldwarcomms@yahoogroups.com
        > > <mailto:coldwarcomms%40yahoogroups.com>
        > > <mailto:coldwarcomms%40yahoogroups.com>
        > > > , "Blake Bowers" <bbowerslists@> wrote:
        > > > >
        > > > > I am not real sure about 17 miles. Between Claremore OK and Vinita OK,
        > > > they
        > > > > appear to be every 6 miles or so. The smaller red brick huts like the
        > > > > picture that was posted, then ever few sites is one like this one, at
        > > > Dover
        > > > > MO. http://goo.gl/maps/mBZVU two story building.
        > > > >
        > > > >
        > > > >
        > > > > _____
        > > > >
        > > > > From: coldwarcomms@yahoogroups.com
        > > <mailto:coldwarcomms%40yahoogroups.com>
        > > <mailto:coldwarcomms%40yahoogroups.com>
        > > > [mailto:coldwarcomms@yahoogroups.com
        > > <mailto:coldwarcomms%40yahoogroups.com>
        > > <mailto:coldwarcomms%40yahoogroups.com>
        > > > ] On
        > > > > Behalf Of David
        > > > > Sent: Friday, December 14, 2012 12:51 PM
        > > > > To: coldwarcomms@yahoogroups.com <mailto:coldwarcomms%40yahoogroups.com>
        > > <mailto:coldwarcomms%40yahoogroups.com>
        > > > > Subject: Re: [coldwarcomms] Carrier heritage, was Huts on Vaults
        > > > >
        > > > >
        > > > >
        > > > >
        > > > >
        > > > > On 12/14/12 9:58 AM, Boardwalk One wrote:
        > > > >
        > > > > > This is your photo, thanks again. Getting back to my interest in these
        > > > > > buildings:
        > > > > >
        > > > > > If the equipment in underground in the vaults, what equipment would be
        > > > > > found in a building like the one in the picture?
        > > > >
        > > > > Roger:
        > > > >
        > > > > You are mixing apples and rutabagas.
        > > > >
        > > > > The brick "hut" is clearly K-Carrier. K-carrier is a circa 1930 twisted
        > > > > pair cable technology; used until the mid 1970's, it appears. The
        > > > buildings
        > > > > were every 17 miles apart as I recall. They were CRAMMED with vacuum
        > > tube
        > > > > racks.
        > > > >
        > > > > See Vol. 17(1), 80, 1938 A Carrier Telephone System for Toll Cables.
        > > > >
        > > > > The buildings they built were so study they often are still in existence
        > > &
        > > >
        > > > > used for newer technology.
        > > > >
        > > > > Coaxial carrier started with L1 from Stevens Point WI, to MSP.
        > > > > Vol. 17(1), 80, 1938 A Carrier Telephone System for Toll Cables
        > > > > It used circular mini-silos every 8 miles, I think.
        > > > >
        > > > > It was followed by L3 in 1953, with repeaters every 4 miles. It too was
        > > > > vacuum tube technology; a friend worked on it in the 1950's. It had huts
        > > > or
        > > > > houses. The huts may have been concrete poured to look like wood siding.
        > > > >
        > > > > At some point L3I for Improved came about. Some of it was underground, I
        > >
        > > > > know little - I'd love to find out more about it.
        > > > >
        > > > > L4 came in 1969:
        > > > > Vol. 48(4), 821, 1969 L-4 System: The L-4 Coaxial System
        > > > > and was not just buried, but hardened: 48" down, with the repeater
        > > vaults
        > > > > every two miles & 2 ft thick walled underground main stations every 150
        > > > > miles. It was Her first solid-state system.
        > > > >
        > > > > There were huts over some L4 vaults but all they seem to have had was a
        > > > > fan, heaters and shade; nothing essential for operation. Maybe that's
        > > > where
        > > > > the poor road craftsman got to stretch out his sleeping bag....despite
        > > the
        > > >
        > > > > Colesville Stipulation.
        > > > >
        > > > > L5 followed, with 1 mile spacing. The first was Lillyville-Hillsburo.
        > > > >
        > > > > L5E {?Enhanced?} was invented, but by then it seems the AR6A SSB
        > > microwave
        > > >
        > > > > was working, and fiber was coming up fast. I don't know where it was
        > > > > actually deployed.
        > > > >
        > > > > You can browse the BJST titles via Sam's link
        > > > > <http://etler.com/docs/BSTJ/bstj.html>
        > > > >
        > > > >
        > > > >
        > > > >
        > > > >
        > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        > > > >
        > > >
        > > >
        > > >
        > > >
        > > >
        > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        > > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        > >
        >
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