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HELP (Shore power problem) update & solution & a new question

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  • Mike VanPelt
    Well, here s the poop on our problem child. First, thanks to David, Jon, Dutch, Bob, Dale, Jack, Ron, Jerry, and everyone else who chipped in with their help.
    Message 1 of 20 , May 31, 2008
    • 0 Attachment
      Well, here's the poop on our problem child. First, thanks to David, Jon,
      Dutch, Bob, Dale, Jack, Ron, Jerry, and everyone else who chipped in with
      their help. If y'all can remember back to the beginning of this thread, we
      had taken Flash out on a fishing trip, got to the campground late, pulled
      in, plugged in, got the little heater going, and crashed for the night. We
      woke up cold the next morning with our rig tripping the shore power but not
      our internal breakers.



      Everything we tried came up bupkis, and all the ideas we got from everyone
      else didn't pan out. What foxed me out was that both of the breakers were
      physically pulled out of the breaker box but the shore power was still
      tripping.




      We ended up going thru every individual wiring run, like Jon suggested, and
      eventually found a single-outlet run (actually the one the heater was
      plugged into :-( ) that had an internal, inside-the-insulation fault in the
      WHITE/COMMON wire - nothing showing on the outside as far as we can see, but
      it's sandwiched inside the wall of the closet, so couldn't see for sure.
      I'd checked the outlet before and it was fine, so I didn't bother checking
      it any further the first time. I didn't think the dinky little, plastic
      housing, Wal-Mart electric heater even drew enough to cause a problem - but
      it must have. Still doesn't make sense, why it would crap out, and crap out
      that way. The heater still seems to work just fine but I'm going to toss it
      anyway just on general principles.



      Well, since we're planning on replacing the cabinets on that side of the
      coach this summer anyway, we just disconnected that run and wa-lah - we have
      our 110v system again.



      So, here's the new question: The rest of the wiring is just as old. Should
      I think about replacing as much of it as I can?



      Thanks again, everyone.



      Mike







      ============================

      Mike VanPelt

      Director of Bands & Orchestras

      Riverside University High School

      1615 E Locust St

      Milwaukee, WI 53221

      414-906-5035 (w)

      414-507-1408 (c)

      414-304-1273 (h)

      414-906-4915 (FAX)

      vanpemr@...

      mvp1114@...





      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • wpmartin55
      ... suggested, and ... in the ... see, So glad you got it figured out! My Dad, the electrical trouble shooter, would have told you, since it went out when
      Message 2 of 20 , Jun 1, 2008
      • 0 Attachment
        >
        > We ended up going thru every individual wiring run, like Jon
        suggested, and
        > eventually found a single-outlet run (actually the one the heater was
        > plugged into :-( ) that had an internal, inside-the-insulation fault
        in the
        > WHITE/COMMON wire - nothing showing on the outside as far as we can
        see,

        So glad you got it figured out! My Dad, the electrical trouble
        shooter, would have told you, "since it went out when the heat was on,
        be suspicious of the heater or the heater circuit". Sorry I didn't
        share that bit of information sooner. :) Electrical problems are the
        worst to solve, I think. We have a car batter constantly being run
        down by ?? We can't find the source. Have fun!
        Cindy M.
      • Dutch
        Wasn t that circuit connected to one of the breakers you removed for testing, Mike? How many watts does the heater draw? Dutch
        Message 3 of 20 , Jun 1, 2008
        • 0 Attachment
          Wasn't that circuit connected to one of the breakers you removed for
          testing, Mike? How many watts does the heater draw?

          Dutch

          --- In classicrv@yahoogroups.com, "Mike VanPelt" <mvp1114@...> wrote:
          >
          > Well, here's the poop on our problem child. First, thanks to David,
          > Jon, Dutch, Bob, Dale, Jack, Ron, Jerry, and everyone else who
          > chipped in with their help. If y'all can remember back to the
          > beginning of this thread, we had taken Flash out on a fishing trip,
          > got to the campground late, pulled in, plugged in, got the little
          > heater going, and crashed for the night. We woke up cold the next
          > morning with our rig tripping the shore power but not our internal
          > breakers.
          >
          > Everything we tried came up bupkis, and all the ideas we got from
          > everyone else didn't pan out. What foxed me out was that both of
          > the breakers were physically pulled out of the breaker box but the
          > shore power was still tripping.
          >
          > We ended up going thru every individual wiring run, like Jon
          > suggested, and eventually found a single-outlet run (actually the
          > one the heater was plugged into :-( ) that had an internal,
          > inside-the-insulation fault in the WHITE/COMMON wire - nothing
          > showing on the outside as far as we can see, but it's sandwiched
          > inside the wall of the closet, so couldn't see for sure. I'd checked
          > the outlet before and it was fine, so I didn't bother checking it
          > any further the first time. I didn't think the dinky little,
          > plastic housing, Wal-Mart electric heater even drew enough to cause
          > a problem - but it must have. Still doesn't make sense, why it
          > would crap out, and crap out that way. The heater still seems to
          > work just fine but I'm going to toss it anyway just on general
          > principles.
          >
          > Well, since we're planning on replacing the cabinets on that side of
          > the coach this summer anyway, we just disconnected that run and
          > wa-lah - we have our 110v system again.
          >
          > So, here's the new question: The rest of the wiring is just as old.
          > Should I think about replacing as much of it as I can?
          >
          > Thanks again, everyone.
          >
          > Mike
        • Jerry Noone
          v :* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}o :* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}w :* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}..shape {behavior:url(#default#VML);} Mike Glad you
          Message 4 of 20 , Jun 1, 2008
          • 0 Attachment
            v\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}o\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}w\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}..shape {behavior:url(#default#VML);}
            Mike

            Glad you resolved that issue. As to the rest of the wiring,remember that there are thousands of miles around the country that are olderthan yours. However, wire is cheap (well, sorta cheap) so I might suggest thatsince you are doing some work in the rig, you might try pulling off an out lethere and there and yanking on the wires to see if they would pull from thesource without opening the walls. Sometimes the wires are run without beingattached to anything. In those cases, it might be possible to tie the new wireto the old and just pull the old out and the new in. It won’t likely workwith all of the wiring (maybe none of it) but I did get that to work on aprevious rig that I had to do about half of it. It’s most likely thatyour current problem was just a fluke caused by something shifting and pinchingthe wire – not actually bad wire – so it’s probably not a bigdeal for the rest of your wiring anyway.

            Just my thoughts,

            Jerry



            From:classicrv@yahoogroups.com [mailto:classicrv@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of MikeVanPelt
            Sent: Saturday, May 31, 2008 7:57 PM
            To: classicrv@yahoogroups.com; Classic_B_Vans@yahoogroups.com
            Subject: [classicrv] HELP (Shore power problem) update & solution& a new question





            Well, here's the poop on our problem child.First, thanks to David, Jon,
            Dutch, Bob, Dale, Jack, Ron, Jerry, and everyone else who chipped in with
            their help. If y'all can remember back to the beginning of this thread, we
            had taken Flash out on a fishing trip, got to the campground late, pulled
            in, plugged in, got the little heater going, and crashed for the night. We
            woke up cold the next morning with our rig tripping the shore power but not
            our internal breakers.

            Everything we tried came up bupkis, and all the ideas we got from everyone
            else didn't pan out. What foxed me out was that both of the breakers were
            physically pulled out of the breaker box but the shore power was still
            tripping.

            We ended up going thru every individual wiring run, like Jon suggested, and
            eventually found a single-outlet run (actually the one the heater was
            plugged into :-( ) that had an internal, inside-the-insulation fault in the
            WHITE/COMMON wire - nothing showing on the outside as far as we can see, but
            it's sandwiched inside the wall of the closet, so couldn't see for sure.
            I'd checked the outlet before and it was fine, so I didn't bother checking
            it any further the first time. I didn't think the dinky little, plastic
            housing, Wal-Mart electric heater even drew enough to cause a problem - but
            it must have. Still doesn't make sense, why it would crap out, and crap out
            that way. The heater still seems to work just fine but I'm going to toss it
            anyway just on general principles.

            Well, since we're planning on replacing the cabinets on that side of the
            coach this summer anyway, we just disconnected that run and wa-lah - we have
            our 110v system again.

            So, here's the new question: The rest of the wiring is just as old. Should
            I think about replacing as much of it as I can?

            Thanks again, everyone.

            Mike

            ============================

            Mike VanPelt

            Director of Bands & Orchestras

            Riverside University High School

            1615 E Locust St

            Milwaukee, WI 53221

            414-906-5035 (w)

            414-507-1408 (c)

            414-304-1273 (h)

            414-906-4915 (FAX)

            vanpemr@.....k12.wi.us

            mvp1114@...

            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]






            ---------------------------------


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          • r and r
            that is definitely odd. while you have everything out i would suggest replacing all the wiring. be sure to match wire gauge to breaker size. one big
            Message 5 of 20 , Jun 1, 2008
            • 0 Attachment
              that is definitely odd.

              while you have everything out i would suggest replacing all the
              wiring. be sure to match wire gauge to breaker size.

              one big question.....is the wiring aluminum? if it is go ahead and
              rewire the complete system.

              good luck!!!

              --- In classicrv@yahoogroups.com, "Mike VanPelt" <mvp1114@...> wrote:
              >
              > Well, here's the poop on our problem child. First, thanks to David,
              Jon,
              > Dutch, Bob, Dale, Jack, Ron, Jerry, and everyone else who chipped in
              with
              > their help. If y'all can remember back to the beginning of this
              thread, we
              > had taken Flash out on a fishing trip, got to the campground late,
              pulled
              > in, plugged in, got the little heater going, and crashed for the
              night. We
              > woke up cold the next morning with our rig tripping the shore power
              but not
              > our internal breakers.
              >
              >
              >
              > Everything we tried came up bupkis, and all the ideas we got from
              everyone
              > else didn't pan out. What foxed me out was that both of the
              breakers were
              > physically pulled out of the breaker box but the shore power was still
              > tripping.
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > We ended up going thru every individual wiring run, like Jon
              suggested, and
              > eventually found a single-outlet run (actually the one the heater was
              > plugged into :-( ) that had an internal, inside-the-insulation fault
              in the
              > WHITE/COMMON wire - nothing showing on the outside as far as we can
              see, but
              > it's sandwiched inside the wall of the closet, so couldn't see for sure.
              > I'd checked the outlet before and it was fine, so I didn't bother
              checking
              > it any further the first time. I didn't think the dinky little, plastic
              > housing, Wal-Mart electric heater even drew enough to cause a
              problem - but
              > it must have. Still doesn't make sense, why it would crap out, and
              crap out
              > that way. The heater still seems to work just fine but I'm going to
              toss it
              > anyway just on general principles.
              >
              >
              >
              > Well, since we're planning on replacing the cabinets on that side of the
              > coach this summer anyway, we just disconnected that run and wa-lah -
              we have
              > our 110v system again.
              >
              >
              >
              > So, here's the new question: The rest of the wiring is just as old.
              Should
              > I think about replacing as much of it as I can?
              >
              >
              >
              > Thanks again, everyone.
              >
              >
              >
              > Mike
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > ============================
              >
              > Mike VanPelt
              >
              > Director of Bands & Orchestras
              >
              > Riverside University High School
              >
              > 1615 E Locust St
              >
              > Milwaukee, WI 53221
              >
              > 414-906-5035 (w)
              >
              > 414-507-1408 (c)
              >
              > 414-304-1273 (h)
              >
              > 414-906-4915 (FAX)
              >
              > vanpemr@...
              >
              > mvp1114@...
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              >
            • Mike VanPelt
              Nope, no aluminiminiminimum wire - that d have been gone instantly had I seen it. Good ol solid copper 12/2. Mike ============================ Mike VanPelt
              Message 6 of 20 , Jun 1, 2008
              • 0 Attachment
                Nope, no aluminiminiminimum wire - that'd have been gone instantly had I
                seen it. Good ol' solid copper 12/2.



                Mike









                ============================

                Mike VanPelt

                Director of Bands & Orchestras

                Riverside University High School

                1615 E Locust St

                Milwaukee, WI 53221

                414-906-5035 (w)

                414-507-1408 (c)

                414-304-1273 (h)

                414-906-4915 (FAX)

                vanpemr@...

                mvp1114@...



                _____

                From: classicrv@yahoogroups.com [mailto:classicrv@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
                Of r and r
                Sent: Sunday, June 01, 2008 8:50 AM
                To: classicrv@yahoogroups.com
                Subject: [classicrv] Re: HELP (Shore power problem) update & solution & a
                new question



                that is definitely odd.

                while you have everything out i would suggest replacing all the
                wiring. be sure to match wire gauge to breaker size.

                one big question.....is the wiring aluminum? if it is go ahead and
                rewire the complete system.

                good luck!!!

                --- In classicrv@yahoogrou <mailto:classicrv%40yahoogroups.com> ps.com,
                "Mike VanPelt" <mvp1114@...> wrote:
                >
                > Well, here's the poop on our problem child. First, thanks to David,
                Jon,
                > Dutch, Bob, Dale, Jack, Ron, Jerry, and everyone else who chipped in
                with
                > their help. If y'all can remember back to the beginning of this
                thread, we
                > had taken Flash out on a fishing trip, got to the campground late,
                pulled
                > in, plugged in, got the little heater going, and crashed for the
                night. We
                > woke up cold the next morning with our rig tripping the shore power
                but not
                > our internal breakers.
                >
                >
                >
                > Everything we tried came up bupkis, and all the ideas we got from
                everyone
                > else didn't pan out. What foxed me out was that both of the
                breakers were
                > physically pulled out of the breaker box but the shore power was still
                > tripping.
                >
                >
                >
                >
                > We ended up going thru every individual wiring run, like Jon
                suggested, and
                > eventually found a single-outlet run (actually the one the heater was
                > plugged into :-( ) that had an internal, inside-the-insulation fault
                in the
                > WHITE/COMMON wire - nothing showing on the outside as far as we can
                see, but
                > it's sandwiched inside the wall of the closet, so couldn't see for sure.
                > I'd checked the outlet before and it was fine, so I didn't bother
                checking
                > it any further the first time. I didn't think the dinky little, plastic
                > housing, Wal-Mart electric heater even drew enough to cause a
                problem - but
                > it must have. Still doesn't make sense, why it would crap out, and
                crap out
                > that way. The heater still seems to work just fine but I'm going to
                toss it
                > anyway just on general principles.
                >
                >
                >
                > Well, since we're planning on replacing the cabinets on that side of the
                > coach this summer anyway, we just disconnected that run and wa-lah -
                we have
                > our 110v system again.
                >
                >
                >
                > So, here's the new question: The rest of the wiring is just as old.
                Should
                > I think about replacing as much of it as I can?
                >
                >
                >
                > Thanks again, everyone.
                >
                >
                >
                > Mike
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
                > ============================
                >
                > Mike VanPelt
                >
                > Director of Bands & Orchestras
                >
                > Riverside University High School
                >
                > 1615 E Locust St
                >
                > Milwaukee, WI 53221
                >
                > 414-906-5035 (w)
                >
                > 414-507-1408 (c)
                >
                > 414-304-1273 (h)
                >
                > 414-906-4915 (FAX)
                >
                > vanpemr@...
                >
                > mvp1114@...
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
                > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                >





                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              • Mike VanPelt
                Yes, I kinda plan on that now - fishing it through wherever I can. Mike ============================ Mike VanPelt Director of Bands & Orchestras Riverside
                Message 7 of 20 , Jun 1, 2008
                • 0 Attachment
                  Yes, I kinda plan on that now - fishing it through wherever I can.



                  Mike









                  ============================

                  Mike VanPelt

                  Director of Bands & Orchestras

                  Riverside University High School

                  1615 E Locust St

                  Milwaukee, WI 53221

                  414-906-5035 (w)

                  414-507-1408 (c)

                  414-304-1273 (h)

                  414-906-4915 (FAX)

                  vanpemr@...

                  mvp1114@...



                  _____

                  From: classicrv@yahoogroups.com [mailto:classicrv@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
                  Of Jerry Noone
                  Sent: Sunday, June 01, 2008 8:48 AM
                  To: classicrv@yahoogroups.com
                  Subject: RE: [classicrv] HELP (Shore power problem) update & solution & a
                  new question



                  v\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}o\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}w\:*
                  {behavior:url(#default#VML);}..shape {behavior:url(#default#VML);}
                  Mike

                  Glad you resolved that issue. As to the rest of the wiring,remember that
                  there are thousands of miles around the country that are olderthan yours.
                  However, wire is cheap (well, sorta cheap) so I might suggest thatsince you
                  are doing some work in the rig, you might try pulling off an out lethere and
                  there and yanking on the wires to see if they would pull from thesource
                  without opening the walls. Sometimes the wires are run without beingattached
                  to anything. In those cases, it might be possible to tie the new wireto the
                  old and just pull the old out and the new in. It won’t likely workwith
                  all of the wiring (maybe none of it) but I did get that to work on aprevious
                  rig that I had to do about half of it. It’s most likely thatyour
                  current problem was just a fluke caused by something shifting and
                  pinchingthe wire – not actually bad wire – so it’s
                  probably not a bigdeal for the rest of your wiring anyway.

                  Just my thoughts,

                  Jerry

                  From:classicrv@yahoogrou <mailto:classicrv%40yahoogroups.com> ps.com
                  [mailto:classicrv@yahoogrou <mailto:classicrv%40yahoogroups.com> ps.com] On
                  Behalf Of MikeVanPelt
                  Sent: Saturday, May 31, 2008 7:57 PM
                  To: classicrv@yahoogrou <mailto:classicrv%40yahoogroups.com> ps.com;
                  Classic_B_Vans@ <mailto:Classic_B_Vans%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
                  Subject: [classicrv] HELP (Shore power problem) update & solution& a new
                  question

                  Well, here's the poop on our problem child.First, thanks to David, Jon,
                  Dutch, Bob, Dale, Jack, Ron, Jerry, and everyone else who chipped in with
                  their help. If y'all can remember back to the beginning of this thread, we
                  had taken Flash out on a fishing trip, got to the campground late, pulled
                  in, plugged in, got the little heater going, and crashed for the night. We
                  woke up cold the next morning with our rig tripping the shore power but not
                  our internal breakers.

                  Everything we tried came up bupkis, and all the ideas we got from everyone
                  else didn't pan out. What foxed me out was that both of the breakers were
                  physically pulled out of the breaker box but the shore power was still
                  tripping.

                  We ended up going thru every individual wiring run, like Jon suggested, and
                  eventually found a single-outlet run (actually the one the heater was
                  plugged into :-( ) that had an internal, inside-the-insulation fault in the
                  WHITE/COMMON wire - nothing showing on the outside as far as we can see, but
                  it's sandwiched inside the wall of the closet, so couldn't see for sure.
                  I'd checked the outlet before and it was fine, so I didn't bother checking
                  it any further the first time. I didn't think the dinky little, plastic
                  housing, Wal-Mart electric heater even drew enough to cause a problem - but
                  it must have. Still doesn't make sense, why it would crap out, and crap out
                  that way. The heater still seems to work just fine but I'm going to toss it
                  anyway just on general principles.

                  Well, since we're planning on replacing the cabinets on that side of the
                  coach this summer anyway, we just disconnected that run and wa-lah - we have
                  our 110v system again.

                  So, here's the new question: The rest of the wiring is just as old. Should
                  I think about replacing as much of it as I can?

                  Thanks again, everyone.

                  Mike

                  ============================

                  Mike VanPelt

                  Director of Bands & Orchestras

                  Riverside University High School

                  1615 E Locust St

                  Milwaukee, WI 53221

                  414-906-5035 (w)

                  414-507-1408 (c)

                  414-304-1273 (h)

                  414-906-4915 (FAX)

                  vanpemr@mail. <mailto:vanpemr%40mail.milwaukee..k12.wi.us>
                  milwaukee..k12.wi.us

                  mvp1114@ameritech. <mailto:mvp1114%40ameritech.net> net

                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

                  ---------------------------------

                  I am using the free version of SPAMfighter for privateusers.
                  It has removed 1998 spam emails to date.
                  Paying users do not have this message in their emails.
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                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                • Mike VanPelt
                  Dutch - Yes, as a matter of fact it was, but it was on a stub wiring run - I thought everything on the driver s side was just in series; turns out there was
                  Message 8 of 20 , Jun 1, 2008
                  • 0 Attachment
                    Dutch -



                    Yes, as a matter of fact it was, but it was on a "stub" wiring run - I
                    thought everything on the driver's side was just in series; turns out there
                    was a short 4' run to this outlet spliced into the driver's side run that I
                    didn't know about, so when I initially just checked @ the end of the run it
                    didn't show as a problem.



                    The original driver's run ended @ the 'fridge outlet - there was a 2-way
                    AmFridge (12v/110v) on the very end of the driver's side run at one time. I
                    removed and capped off the 110v line after we pulled it out (it was
                    non-functional), so I assumed I knew what was going on in that area (there's
                    just another example of how "ASSUME usually turns into "make an ASS of U and
                    ME" - you'd "assume" that I'd learn :-) ). I've got the original Champion
                    coach manual, with two or three very general coach wiring schematics for
                    different models and I don't remember any of those having a dead-end run
                    there. I'm wondering if it's a "PO" - previous owner - addition or if it
                    was just a standard thing that was sometimes added on my model.



                    We've used that heater before all night in place of the furnace, in that
                    particular outlet - with two adults and two dogs, it was all we needed even
                    in February in a snowstorm overnight; it had a rudimentary thermostat
                    (low/med/hi) and would kick on & off as necessary. It's only a 1200W heater
                    on its highest setting. I guess it must have been just enough that evening.
                    Maybe something pinched on the drive out and there was just enough draw on
                    that circuit to cause the fault.



                    Mike








                    ============================

                    Mike VanPelt

                    Director of Bands & Orchestras

                    Riverside University High School

                    1615 E Locust St

                    Milwaukee, WI 53221

                    414-906-5035 (w)

                    414-507-1408 (c)

                    414-304-1273 (h)

                    414-906-4915 (FAX)

                    vanpemr@...

                    mvp1114@...



                    _____

                    From: classicrv@yahoogroups.com [mailto:classicrv@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
                    Of Dutch
                    Sent: Sunday, June 01, 2008 7:22 AM
                    To: classicrv@yahoogroups.com
                    Subject: [classicrv] Re: HELP (Shore power problem) update & solution & a
                    new question



                    Wasn't that circuit connected to one of the breakers you removed for
                    testing, Mike? How many watts does the heater draw?

                    Dutch

                    --- In classicrv@yahoogrou <mailto:classicrv%40yahoogroups.com> ps.com,
                    "Mike VanPelt" <mvp1114@...> wrote:
                    >
                    > Well, here's the poop on our problem child. First, thanks to David,
                    > Jon, Dutch, Bob, Dale, Jack, Ron, Jerry, and everyone else who
                    > chipped in with their help. If y'all can remember back to the
                    > beginning of this thread, we had taken Flash out on a fishing trip,
                    > got to the campground late, pulled in, plugged in, got the little
                    > heater going, and crashed for the night. We woke up cold the next
                    > morning with our rig tripping the shore power but not our internal
                    > breakers.
                    >
                    > Everything we tried came up bupkis, and all the ideas we got from
                    > everyone else didn't pan out. What foxed me out was that both of
                    > the breakers were physically pulled out of the breaker box but the
                    > shore power was still tripping.
                    >
                    > We ended up going thru every individual wiring run, like Jon
                    > suggested, and eventually found a single-outlet run (actually the
                    > one the heater was plugged into :-( ) that had an internal,
                    > inside-the-insulation fault in the WHITE/COMMON wire - nothing
                    > showing on the outside as far as we can see, but it's sandwiched
                    > inside the wall of the closet, so couldn't see for sure. I'd checked
                    > the outlet before and it was fine, so I didn't bother checking it
                    > any further the first time. I didn't think the dinky little,
                    > plastic housing, Wal-Mart electric heater even drew enough to cause
                    > a problem - but it must have. Still doesn't make sense, why it
                    > would crap out, and crap out that way. The heater still seems to
                    > work just fine but I'm going to toss it anyway just on general
                    > principles.
                    >
                    > Well, since we're planning on replacing the cabinets on that side of
                    > the coach this summer anyway, we just disconnected that run and
                    > wa-lah - we have our 110v system again.
                    >
                    > So, here's the new question: The rest of the wiring is just as old.
                    > Should I think about replacing as much of it as I can?
                    >
                    > Thanks again, everyone.
                    >
                    > Mike





                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  • Mike VanPelt
                    Yeah, I thought it was a possibility but since I thought the outlet was OK and we weren t moving when it went bad, I assumed that he run itself was not the
                    Message 9 of 20 , Jun 1, 2008
                    • 0 Attachment
                      Yeah, I thought it was a possibility but since I thought the outlet was OK
                      and we weren't moving when it went bad, I assumed that he run itself was not
                      the problem.



                      Mike









                      ============================

                      Mike VanPelt

                      Director of Bands & Orchestras

                      Riverside University High School

                      1615 E Locust St

                      Milwaukee, WI 53221

                      414-906-5035 (w)

                      414-507-1408 (c)

                      414-304-1273 (h)

                      414-906-4915 (FAX)

                      vanpemr@...

                      mvp1114@...



                      _____

                      From: classicrv@yahoogroups.com [mailto:classicrv@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
                      Of wpmartin55
                      Sent: Sunday, June 01, 2008 6:44 AM
                      To: classicrv@yahoogroups.com
                      Subject: [classicrv] Re: HELP (Shore power problem) update & solution & a
                      new question




                      >
                      > We ended up going thru every individual wiring run, like Jon
                      suggested, and
                      > eventually found a single-outlet run (actually the one the heater was
                      > plugged into :-( ) that had an internal, inside-the-insulation fault
                      in the
                      > WHITE/COMMON wire - nothing showing on the outside as far as we can
                      see,

                      So glad you got it figured out! My Dad, the electrical trouble
                      shooter, would have told you, "since it went out when the heat was on,
                      be suspicious of the heater or the heater circuit". Sorry I didn't
                      share that bit of information sooner. :) Electrical problems are the
                      worst to solve, I think. We have a car batter constantly being run
                      down by ?? We can't find the source. Have fun!
                      Cindy M.





                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    • Dutch
                      Ok, I couldn t figure out why pulling the breaker didn t clear the problem and narrow it down to that circuit. :-) Dutch
                      Message 10 of 20 , Jun 1, 2008
                      • 0 Attachment
                        Ok, I couldn't figure out why pulling the breaker didn't clear the
                        problem and narrow it down to that circuit. :-)

                        Dutch

                        --- In classicrv@yahoogroups.com, "Mike VanPelt" <mvp1114@...> wrote:
                        >
                        > Dutch -
                        >
                        > Yes, as a matter of fact it was, but it was on a "stub" wiring run -
                        > I thought everything on the driver's side was just in series; turns
                        > out there was a short 4' run to this outlet spliced into the
                        > driver's side run that I didn't know about, so when I initially just
                        > checked @ the end of the run it didn't show as a problem.
                        >
                        > The original driver's run ended @ the 'fridge outlet - there was a
                        > 2-way AmFridge (12v/110v) on the very end of the driver's side run
                        > at one time. I removed and capped off the 110v line after we pulled
                        > it out (it was non-functional), so I assumed I knew what was going
                        > on in that area (there's just another example of how "ASSUME usually
                        > turns into "make an ASS of U and ME" - you'd "assume" that I'd learn
                        > :-) ). I've got the original Champion coach manual, with two or
                        > three very general coach wiring schematics for different models and
                        > I don't remember any of those having a dead-end run there. I'm
                        > wondering if it's a "PO" - previous owner - addition or if it was
                        > just a standard thing that was sometimes added on my model.
                        >
                        > We've used that heater before all night in place of the furnace, in
                        > that particular outlet - with two adults and two dogs, it was all we
                        > needed even in February in a snowstorm overnight; it had a
                        > rudimentary thermostat (low/med/hi) and would kick on & off as
                        > necessary. It's only a 1200W heater on its highest setting. I
                        > guess it must have been just enough that evening. Maybe something
                        > pinched on the drive out and there was just enough draw on that
                        > circuit to cause the fault.
                        >
                        > Mike
                        >
                        >> Wasn't that circuit connected to one of the breakers you removed
                        >> for testing, Mike? How many watts does the heater draw?
                        >>
                        >> Dutch
                      • Ron Mitchell
                        Solid copper wire can develop weak points with high resistance, if it flexes enough over time. That s why you can break solid copper by bending it back and
                        Message 11 of 20 , Jun 1, 2008
                        • 0 Attachment
                          Solid copper wire can develop weak points with high resistance, if
                          it flexes enough over time. That's why you can break solid copper by
                          bending it back and forth. Before it actually breaks, the wire begins
                          to develop a weak point. This point has much greater resistance than
                          the rest of the wire. Most automotive applications use stranded wire
                          for this very reason and to prevent breaks from forming. Even then,
                          they still happen, given enough movement. Maybe your wire was getting
                          some movement or vibration that caused this and lead to the hot spot
                          and insulation breakdown. Just at thought.
                          I run a 1200/800 Watt heater most of the winter, just to keep the
                          coach from freezing up inside. Even at the low setting, it will keep
                          the coach at around 50 degrees all winter. I've never noticed any
                          problem with the wiring, but I will now start checking for any runs
                          with a higher than expected resistance. It's a good thing that it
                          blew the GFI, instead of burning the place down.
                          The only thing I'm still confused about is why the GFI still blew
                          with the breakers turned off. Maybe I'm missing something here
                          (that's usually not too hard to do), but I'd get one of those 3-light
                          circuit testers and check all of your outlets to make sure nothing's
                          wired up wrong.

                          Ron
                          76 Coachmen

                          At 01:12 PM 06/01/2008, you wrote:

                          >Yeah, I thought it was a possibility but since I thought the outlet was OK
                          >and we weren't moving when it went bad, I assumed that he run itself was not
                          >the problem.
                          >
                          >Mike
                          >
                          >============================
                          >
                          >Mike VanPelt
                          >
                          >Director of Bands & Orchestras
                          >
                          >Riverside University High School
                          >
                          >1615 E Locust St
                          >
                          >Milwaukee, WI 53221
                          >
                          >414-906-5035 (w)
                          >
                          >414-507-1408 (c)
                          >
                          >414-304-1273 (h)
                          >
                          >414-906-4915 (FAX)
                          >
                          ><mailto:vanpemr%40mail.milwaukee.k12.wi.us>vanpemr@...
                          >
                          ><mailto:mvp1114%40ameritech.net>mvp1114@...
                          >
                          >_____
                          >
                          >From: <mailto:classicrv%40yahoogroups.com>classicrv@yahoogroups.com
                          >[mailto:classicrv@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
                          >Of wpmartin55
                          >Sent: Sunday, June 01, 2008 6:44 AM
                          >To: <mailto:classicrv%40yahoogroups.com>classicrv@yahoogroups.com
                          >Subject: [classicrv] Re: HELP (Shore power problem) update & solution & a
                          >new question
                          >
                          > >
                          > > We ended up going thru every individual wiring run, like Jon
                          >suggested, and
                          > > eventually found a single-outlet run (actually the one the heater was
                          > > plugged into :-( ) that had an internal, inside-the-insulation fault
                          >in the
                          > > WHITE/COMMON wire - nothing showing on the outside as far as we can
                          >see,
                          >
                          >So glad you got it figured out! My Dad, the electrical trouble
                          >shooter, would have told you, "since it went out when the heat was on,
                          >be suspicious of the heater or the heater circuit". Sorry I didn't
                          >share that bit of information sooner. :) Electrical problems are the
                          >worst to solve, I think. We have a car batter constantly being run
                          >down by ?? We can't find the source. Have fun!
                          >Cindy M.
                          >
                          >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                          >
                          >


                          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                        • Mike VanPelt
                          I went through all the remaining outlets with one of those testers (after this whole episode, derned right I did!); they were all fine. Mike
                          Message 12 of 20 , Jun 1, 2008
                          • 0 Attachment
                            I went through all the remaining outlets with one of those testers (after
                            this whole episode, derned right I did!); they were all fine.



                            Mike









                            ============================

                            Mike VanPelt

                            Director of Bands & Orchestras

                            Riverside University High School

                            1615 E Locust St

                            Milwaukee, WI 53221

                            414-906-5035 (w)

                            414-507-1408 (c)

                            414-304-1273 (h)

                            414-906-4915 (FAX)

                            vanpemr@...

                            mvp1114@...



                            _____

                            From: classicrv@yahoogroups.com [mailto:classicrv@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
                            Of Ron Mitchell
                            Sent: Sunday, June 01, 2008 2:12 PM
                            To: classicrv@yahoogroups.com
                            Subject: RE: [classicrv] Re: HELP (Shore power problem) update & solution &
                            a new question



                            Solid copper wire can develop weak points with high resistance, if
                            it flexes enough over time. That's why you can break solid copper by
                            bending it back and forth. Before it actually breaks, the wire begins
                            to develop a weak point. This point has much greater resistance than
                            the rest of the wire. Most automotive applications use stranded wire
                            for this very reason and to prevent breaks from forming. Even then,
                            they still happen, given enough movement. Maybe your wire was getting
                            some movement or vibration that caused this and lead to the hot spot
                            and insulation breakdown. Just at thought.
                            I run a 1200/800 Watt heater most of the winter, just to keep the
                            coach from freezing up inside. Even at the low setting, it will keep
                            the coach at around 50 degrees all winter. I've never noticed any
                            problem with the wiring, but I will now start checking for any runs
                            with a higher than expected resistance. It's a good thing that it
                            blew the GFI, instead of burning the place down.
                            The only thing I'm still confused about is why the GFI still blew
                            with the breakers turned off. Maybe I'm missing something here
                            (that's usually not too hard to do), but I'd get one of those 3-light
                            circuit testers and check all of your outlets to make sure nothing's
                            wired up wrong.

                            Ron
                            76 Coachmen

                            At 01:12 PM 06/01/2008, you wrote:

                            >Yeah, I thought it was a possibility but since I thought the outlet was OK
                            >and we weren't moving when it went bad, I assumed that he run itself was
                            not
                            >the problem.
                            >
                            >Mike
                            >
                            >============================
                            >
                            >Mike VanPelt
                            >
                            >Director of Bands & Orchestras
                            >
                            >Riverside University High School
                            >
                            >1615 E Locust St
                            >
                            >Milwaukee, WI 53221
                            >
                            >414-906-5035 (w)
                            >
                            >414-507-1408 (c)
                            >
                            >414-304-1273 (h)
                            >
                            >414-906-4915 (FAX)
                            >
                            ><mailto:vanpemr%40mail.milwaukee.k12.wi.us>vanpemr@mail.
                            <mailto:vanpemr%40mail.milwaukee.k12.wi.us> milwaukee.k12.wi.us
                            >
                            ><mailto:mvp1114%40ameritech.net>mvp1114@ameritech.
                            <mailto:mvp1114%40ameritech.net> net
                            >
                            >_____
                            >
                            >From: <mailto:classicrv%40yahoogroups.com>classicrv@yahoogrou
                            <mailto:classicrv%40yahoogroups.com> ps.com
                            >[mailto:classicrv@yahoogrou <mailto:classicrv%40yahoogroups.com> ps.com] On
                            Behalf
                            >Of wpmartin55
                            >Sent: Sunday, June 01, 2008 6:44 AM
                            >To: <mailto:classicrv%40yahoogroups.com>classicrv@yahoogrou
                            <mailto:classicrv%40yahoogroups.com> ps.com
                            >Subject: [classicrv] Re: HELP (Shore power problem) update & solution & a
                            >new question
                            >
                            > >
                            > > We ended up going thru every individual wiring run, like Jon
                            >suggested, and
                            > > eventually found a single-outlet run (actually the one the heater was
                            > > plugged into :-( ) that had an internal, inside-the-insulation fault
                            >in the
                            > > WHITE/COMMON wire - nothing showing on the outside as far as we can
                            >see,
                            >
                            >So glad you got it figured out! My Dad, the electrical trouble
                            >shooter, would have told you, "since it went out when the heat was on,
                            >be suspicious of the heater or the heater circuit". Sorry I didn't
                            >share that bit of information sooner. :) Electrical problems are the
                            >worst to solve, I think. We have a car batter constantly being run
                            >down by ?? We can't find the source. Have fun!
                            >Cindy M.
                            >
                            >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                            >
                            >

                            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





                            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                          • Dale Miller
                            ... That is what I have been trying to figure out myself. It should have been hooked up to a breaker in the trailer. -- All the Best & 73 s Dale Miller, KC2CBD
                            Message 13 of 20 , Jun 1, 2008
                            • 0 Attachment
                              Dutch wrote:
                              > Ok, I couldn't figure out why pulling the breaker didn't clear the
                              > problem and narrow it down to that circuit. :-)
                              >
                              > Dutch
                              >

                              That is what I have been trying to figure out myself.
                              It should have been hooked up to a breaker in the trailer.

                              --
                              All the Best & 73's
                              Dale Miller, KC2CBD
                              Tennessee
                              Ham Operator since 1997
                              Member of YahooPipesmokers and ASP since February 2005

                              stpatrick2spam@...
                              stpatrick3spam@...
                              stpatrick3spam@...

                              (cut the spam to reply)


                              VOTE TO REBUILD!
                              www.twintowersalliance.com

                              ---
                            • Mike VanPelt
                              The breakers in the RV wouldn t trip, which had me foxed too. All better now. Mike ============================ Mike VanPelt Director of Bands & Orchestras
                              Message 14 of 20 , Jun 1, 2008
                              • 0 Attachment
                                The breakers in the RV wouldn't trip, which had me foxed too.



                                All better now.



                                Mike









                                ============================

                                Mike VanPelt

                                Director of Bands & Orchestras

                                Riverside University High School

                                1615 E Locust St

                                Milwaukee, WI 53221

                                414-906-5035 (w)

                                414-507-1408 (c)

                                414-304-1273 (h)

                                414-906-4915 (FAX)

                                vanpemr@...

                                mvp1114@...



                                _____

                                From: classicrv@yahoogroups.com [mailto:classicrv@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
                                Of Dale Miller
                                Sent: Sunday, June 01, 2008 4:16 PM
                                To: classicrv@yahoogroups.com
                                Subject: Re: [classicrv] Re: HELP (Shore power problem) update & solution &
                                a new question



                                Dutch wrote:
                                > Ok, I couldn't figure out why pulling the breaker didn't clear the
                                > problem and narrow it down to that circuit. :-)
                                >
                                > Dutch
                                >

                                That is what I have been trying to figure out myself.
                                It should have been hooked up to a breaker in the trailer.

                                --
                                All the Best & 73's
                                Dale Miller, KC2CBD
                                Tennessee
                                Ham Operator since 1997
                                Member of YahooPipesmokers and ASP since February 2005

                                stpatrick2spam@ <mailto:stpatrick2spam%40twlakes.net> twlakes.net
                                stpatrick3spam@ <mailto:stpatrick3spam%40twlakes.net> twlakes.net
                                stpatrick3spam@ <mailto:stpatrick3spam%40gmail.com> gmail.com

                                (cut the spam to reply)

                                VOTE TO REBUILD!
                                www.twintowersalliance.com

                                ---





                                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                              • Jon Bush Sr.
                                Mike, I would suspect that since the fault was in common wire(white), the GFCI in your house picked it up faster than the RV breaker(black wire) could trip.
                                Message 15 of 20 , Jun 2, 2008
                                • 0 Attachment
                                  Mike,
                                  I would suspect that since the fault was in common wire(white), the
                                  GFCI in your house picked it up faster than the RV breaker(black wire)
                                  could trip.

                                  Jon

                                  --- In classicrv@yahoogroups.com, "Mike VanPelt" <mvp1114@...> wrote:
                                  >
                                  > The breakers in the RV wouldn't trip, which had me foxed too.
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  > All better now.
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  > Mike
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  > ============================
                                  >
                                  > Mike VanPelt
                                  >
                                  > Director of Bands & Orchestras
                                  >
                                  > Riverside University High School
                                  >
                                  > 1615 E Locust St
                                  >
                                  > Milwaukee, WI 53221
                                  >
                                  > 414-906-5035 (w)
                                  >
                                  > 414-507-1408 (c)
                                  >
                                  > 414-304-1273 (h)
                                  >
                                  > 414-906-4915 (FAX)
                                  >
                                  > vanpemr@...
                                  >
                                  > mvp1114@...
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  > _____
                                  >
                                  > From: classicrv@yahoogroups.com [mailto:classicrv@yahoogroups.com]
                                  On Behalf
                                  > Of Dale Miller
                                  > Sent: Sunday, June 01, 2008 4:16 PM
                                  > To: classicrv@yahoogroups.com
                                  > Subject: Re: [classicrv] Re: HELP (Shore power problem) update &
                                  solution &
                                  > a new question
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  > Dutch wrote:
                                  > > Ok, I couldn't figure out why pulling the breaker didn't clear the
                                  > > problem and narrow it down to that circuit. :-)
                                  > >
                                  > > Dutch
                                  > >
                                  >
                                  > That is what I have been trying to figure out myself.
                                  > It should have been hooked up to a breaker in the trailer.
                                  >
                                  > --
                                  > All the Best & 73's
                                  > Dale Miller, KC2CBD
                                  > Tennessee
                                  > Ham Operator since 1997
                                  > Member of YahooPipesmokers and ASP since February 2005
                                  >
                                  > stpatrick2spam@ <mailto:stpatrick2spam%40twlakes.net> twlakes.net
                                  > stpatrick3spam@ <mailto:stpatrick3spam%40twlakes.net> twlakes.net
                                  > stpatrick3spam@ <mailto:stpatrick3spam%40gmail.com> gmail.com
                                  >
                                  > (cut the spam to reply)
                                  >
                                  > VOTE TO REBUILD!
                                  > www.twintowersalliance.com
                                  >
                                  > ---
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                  >
                                • Penny
                                  ... I didn t think the dinky little, plastic housing, Wal-Mart electric heater even drew enough to cause a problem - but it must have. Still doesn t make
                                  Message 16 of 20 , Jun 2, 2008
                                  • 0 Attachment
                                    --- In classicrv@yahoogroups.com, "Mike VanPelt" <mvp1114@...> wrote:
                                    I didn't think the dinky little, plastic housing, Wal-Mart electric
                                    heater even drew enough to cause a problem - but it must have. Still
                                    doesn't make sense, why it would crap out, and crap out that way. The
                                    heater still seems to work just fine but I'm going to toss it
                                    > anyway just on general principles.
                                    > So, here's the new question: The rest of the wiring is just as old.
                                    Should I think about replacing as much of it as I can?
                                    > Thanks again, everyone. Mike >>>

                                    Mike, most 110v heaters are 1500 watt and 5100 BTU's. So even a heavy,
                                    non-rinky-dink heater would give you the same problems. Throwing that
                                    heater away isn't going to solve the problem. Some heaters are only
                                    750 or 900 watt, maybe two small ones on different circuits might be
                                    better. Some have the capabilty of not using all of the 1500 watts
                                    allowed.
                                    If your wiring is old, replace it, it is probably 14 gauge, maybe
                                    better to go with 12 gauge.
                                    Happy Trails, Penny, TX
                                  • Tom K
                                    If you change the RV wiring, be sure to NOT use standard house wiring but multistranded copper wire of a suitable gauge. The vibrations could be problematic
                                    Message 17 of 20 , Jun 2, 2008
                                    • 0 Attachment
                                      If you change the RV wiring, be sure to NOT use standard house wiring but multistranded copper wire of a suitable gauge. The vibrations could be problematic on a single wire type. If you have aluminum wiring, change it.

                                      For portable heaters, I prefer Pelonis brand ceramic heaters. It has a variable fan speed and heating element to your temperature setting. As such it runs extremely quiet and on low power most of the time. Has a tip switch to turn it off should it be kicked over but has a nice solid weight so your not likely to, can be handled when hot, higher quality power cord, has a fan only setting for cooling. About an 8" cube.

                                      Tom K
                                      Charlotte, NC
                                      1988 Lesharo


                                      ----- Original Message -----
                                      From: Penny
                                      To: classicrv@yahoogroups.com
                                      Sent: Monday, June 02, 2008 9:11 AM
                                      Subject: [classicrv] Re: HELP (Shore power problem) update & solution & a new question



                                      Mike, most 110v heaters are 1500 watt and 5100 BTU's. So even a heavy,
                                      non-rinky-dink heater would give you the same problems. Throwing that
                                      heater away isn't going to solve the problem. Some heaters are only
                                      750 or 900 watt, maybe two small ones on different circuits might be
                                      better. Some have the capabilty of not using all of the 1500 watts
                                      allowed.
                                      If your wiring is old, replace it, it is probably 14 gauge, maybe
                                      better to go with 12 gauge.
                                      Happy Trails, Penny, TX





                                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                    • Mike VanPelt
                                      OK, that makes sense. Thanks! Mike ============================ Mike VanPelt Director of Bands & Orchestras Riverside University High School 1615 E Locust St
                                      Message 18 of 20 , Jun 2, 2008
                                      • 0 Attachment
                                        OK, that makes sense. Thanks!



                                        Mike









                                        ============================

                                        Mike VanPelt

                                        Director of Bands & Orchestras

                                        Riverside University High School

                                        1615 E Locust St

                                        Milwaukee, WI 53221

                                        414-906-5035 (w)

                                        414-507-1408 (c)

                                        414-304-1273 (h)

                                        414-906-4915 (FAX)

                                        vanpemr@...

                                        mvp1114@...



                                        _____

                                        From: classicrv@yahoogroups.com [mailto:classicrv@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
                                        Of Jon Bush Sr.
                                        Sent: Monday, June 02, 2008 7:36 AM
                                        To: classicrv@yahoogroups.com
                                        Subject: [classicrv] Re: HELP (Shore power problem) update & solution & a
                                        new question



                                        Mike,
                                        I would suspect that since the fault was in common wire(white), the
                                        GFCI in your house picked it up faster than the RV breaker(black wire)
                                        could trip.

                                        Jon

                                        --- In classicrv@yahoogrou <mailto:classicrv%40yahoogroups.com> ps.com,
                                        "Mike VanPelt" <mvp1114@...> wrote:
                                        >
                                        > The breakers in the RV wouldn't trip, which had me foxed too.
                                        >
                                        >
                                        >
                                        > All better now.
                                        >
                                        >
                                        >
                                        > Mike
                                        >
                                        >
                                        >
                                        >
                                        >
                                        >
                                        >
                                        >
                                        >
                                        > ============================
                                        >
                                        > Mike VanPelt
                                        >
                                        > Director of Bands & Orchestras
                                        >
                                        > Riverside University High School
                                        >
                                        > 1615 E Locust St
                                        >
                                        > Milwaukee, WI 53221
                                        >
                                        > 414-906-5035 (w)
                                        >
                                        > 414-507-1408 (c)
                                        >
                                        > 414-304-1273 (h)
                                        >
                                        > 414-906-4915 (FAX)
                                        >
                                        > vanpemr@...
                                        >
                                        > mvp1114@...
                                        >
                                        >
                                        >
                                        > _____
                                        >
                                        > From: classicrv@yahoogrou <mailto:classicrv%40yahoogroups.com> ps.com
                                        [mailto:classicrv@yahoogrou <mailto:classicrv%40yahoogroups.com> ps.com]
                                        On Behalf
                                        > Of Dale Miller
                                        > Sent: Sunday, June 01, 2008 4:16 PM
                                        > To: classicrv@yahoogrou <mailto:classicrv%40yahoogroups.com> ps.com
                                        > Subject: Re: [classicrv] Re: HELP (Shore power problem) update &
                                        solution &
                                        > a new question
                                        >
                                        >
                                        >
                                        > Dutch wrote:
                                        > > Ok, I couldn't figure out why pulling the breaker didn't clear the
                                        > > problem and narrow it down to that circuit. :-)
                                        > >
                                        > > Dutch
                                        > >
                                        >
                                        > That is what I have been trying to figure out myself.
                                        > It should have been hooked up to a breaker in the trailer.
                                        >
                                        > --
                                        > All the Best & 73's
                                        > Dale Miller, KC2CBD
                                        > Tennessee
                                        > Ham Operator since 1997
                                        > Member of YahooPipesmokers and ASP since February 2005
                                        >
                                        > stpatrick2spam@ <mailto:stpatrick2spam%40twlakes.net> twlakes.net
                                        > stpatrick3spam@ <mailto:stpatrick3spam%40twlakes.net> twlakes.net
                                        > stpatrick3spam@ <mailto:stpatrick3spam%40gmail.com> gmail.com
                                        >
                                        > (cut the spam to reply)
                                        >
                                        > VOTE TO REBUILD!
                                        > www.twintowersalliance.com
                                        >
                                        > ---
                                        >
                                        >
                                        >
                                        >
                                        >
                                        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                        >





                                        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                      • Mike VanPelt
                                        Tom - Stranded wire, not solid? I would have thought the solid would be better over a longer length of time (yes, I know that s what was in it before but it
                                        Message 19 of 20 , Jun 2, 2008
                                        • 0 Attachment
                                          Tom -



                                          Stranded wire, not solid? I would have thought the solid would be better
                                          over a longer length of time (yes, I know that's what was in it before but
                                          it did last almost 30 years).



                                          Mike









                                          ============================

                                          Mike VanPelt

                                          Director of Bands & Orchestras

                                          Riverside University High School

                                          1615 E Locust St

                                          Milwaukee, WI 53221

                                          414-906-5035 (w)

                                          414-507-1408 (c)

                                          414-304-1273 (h)

                                          414-906-4915 (FAX)

                                          vanpemr@...

                                          mvp1114@...



                                          _____

                                          From: classicrv@yahoogroups.com [mailto:classicrv@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
                                          Of Tom K
                                          Sent: Monday, June 02, 2008 8:55 AM
                                          To: classicrv@yahoogroups.com
                                          Subject: Re: [classicrv] Re: HELP (Shore power problem) update & solution &
                                          a new question



                                          If you change the RV wiring, be sure to NOT use standard house wiring but
                                          multistranded copper wire of a suitable gauge. The vibrations could be
                                          problematic on a single wire type. If you have aluminum wiring, change it.

                                          For portable heaters, I prefer Pelonis brand ceramic heaters. It has a
                                          variable fan speed and heating element to your temperature setting. As such
                                          it runs extremely quiet and on low power most of the time. Has a tip switch
                                          to turn it off should it be kicked over but has a nice solid weight so your
                                          not likely to, can be handled when hot, higher quality power cord, has a fan
                                          only setting for cooling. About an 8" cube.

                                          Tom K
                                          Charlotte, NC
                                          1988 Lesharo

                                          ----- Original Message -----
                                          From: Penny
                                          To: classicrv@yahoogrou <mailto:classicrv%40yahoogroups.com> ps.com
                                          Sent: Monday, June 02, 2008 9:11 AM
                                          Subject: [classicrv] Re: HELP (Shore power problem) update & solution & a
                                          new question

                                          Mike, most 110v heaters are 1500 watt and 5100 BTU's. So even a heavy,
                                          non-rinky-dink heater would give you the same problems. Throwing that
                                          heater away isn't going to solve the problem. Some heaters are only
                                          750 or 900 watt, maybe two small ones on different circuits might be
                                          better. Some have the capabilty of not using all of the 1500 watts
                                          allowed.
                                          If your wiring is old, replace it, it is probably 14 gauge, maybe
                                          better to go with 12 gauge.
                                          Happy Trails, Penny, TX

                                          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





                                          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                        • Penny
                                          ... Electrical problems are the worst to solve, I think. We have a car batter constantly being run down by ?? We can t find the source. Have fun! Cindy M.
                                          Message 20 of 20 , Jun 3, 2008
                                          • 0 Attachment
                                            --- In classicrv@yahoogroups.com, "wpmartin55" <wpmartin55@...> wrote:
                                            Electrical problems are the worst to solve, I think. We have a car
                                            batter constantly being run down by ?? We can't find the source. Have
                                            fun! Cindy M. >>>

                                            Cindy I have has two cars that did that. The Marquis it was the visor
                                            mirror light not shutting off when closed. The Cadillac it was
                                            something to do with the passenger seat belt not retracting all the way.
                                            Hope this helps. Penny, TX
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