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Re: [classicrv] Re: 74 Winnie Brave

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  • dxxx cxxxxx
    Glenn, the drivetrain, suspension, steering,brakes are all dodge. they usually use the dodge guages etc. also. all the mechanicals to keep it rolling should be
    Message 1 of 16 , Oct 31, 2006
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      Glenn, the drivetrain, suspension, steering,brakes are
      all dodge. they usually use the dodge guages etc.
      also. all the mechanicals to keep it rolling should be
      available without too much trouble. the worst case,
      you might have to remove a part, take it to the parts
      house to match up. most stuff should be available in
      stock or not take longer that 2 or 3 days tops. i had
      to order the rear seals for my 92 dodge pickup too, so
      what. carquest and napa are probably the best scources
      for parts, as they carry and stock more, but kragen
      and the chain stores probably carry 70% of what you
      will need but may need to order more of it. i always
      recommend the rotor and cap with the copper and brass
      contacts. even autozone stocks them. the 440-3 is
      basically a heavy duty engine with extra cooling etc.
      most 440 parts will fit. it's easy to see if it is a
      440-3, as it says it on the side of the block. the
      differences are similar to what you see in the police
      car engines.
      class A or class C , that's up to you and your needs
      and likes and dislikes, me, i like the class A's. the
      prices are probably similar, but the Class A is a
      heavier duty chassis, more room, will tow more, and is
      more comfortable. i don't think the mileage will be
      too much different. it is also harder to find big
      block class C motor homes. also more class c motor
      homes are wood frame, as they were the cheaper rigs.
      with ANY rig, watch out for wood frame units with
      water leaks. the damage can be extensive, and repairs
      way out of the realm of reasonable or feasable. Doug


      --- Glenn <shiloh@...> wrote:

      > Does this have a booster for the rear brakes too ? I
      > vaguely
      > remember an amry truck that had a setup like that.
      > 500lb/ft wont be
      > a problem, i even have a torque wrench for that.
      > however i may pass
      > on this and keep looking for the class C I wanted in
      > the first place.
      >
      >
      >
      > > Your two most important assets will be a Dodge
      > Chassis manual for
      > the
      > > appropriate year and a good relationship with the
      > oldest Carquest
      > or
      > > NAPA parts store you can find, one old enough to
      > still have "the
      > > books." The chassis and running gear, with the
      > exception of the
      > rear
      > > brakes, is for the most part shared with the Dodge
      > medium trucks
      > > (usually the "one ton") of the same era. Both
      > Carquest and NAPA
      > have
      > > a respectable stock of said parts in their
      > warehouses.
      > >
      > > The 440 is almost the same as the auto and van
      > version, but there
      > are
      > > critical differences, mostly in the heads. Check
      > the archives for
      > > several discussions of the differences between the
      > common 440 and
      > the
      > > 440-3 (motorhome) engines. One was underway just a
      > week or so ago
      > I
      > > think.
      > >
      > > A couple of years ago, I put Old Blue back on the
      > road after she
      > had
      > > not moved for seven years. It was an interesting
      > experience, from
      > > which two hints emerge: (1) learn all you can
      > absorb about the
      > > HydroVac brake booster(s) and test them carefully.
      > and (2) have
      > on
      > > hand 3/4" or 1" drive sockets, the associated
      > breaker bar, and a
      > > 6'-8' length of the strongest pipe you can find
      > before trying to
      > > remove a wheel. Five hundred foot pounds is a LOT
      > of torque! :-)
      > > --
      > > Regards,
      > > Bill Combs
      > > ttursine@ earthlink.net
      > > 1975 Superior 2800, "Old Blue"
      > > http://home.earthlink.net/~ttursine
      > > --
      > > Never test the depth of
      > > the water with both feet.
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > > [Non-text portions of this message have been
      > removed]
      > >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > Yahoo! Groups Links
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >




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    • Bill Combs
      ... The heavier models (RM_375 and RM-400 in 1974, M-400 and M-500 thereafter) have dual Bendix HydroVac boosters mounted on the inside of the left frame rail.
      Message 2 of 16 , Nov 1, 2006
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        On Nov 1, 2006, at 12:35 AM, Glenn wrote:

        > Does this have a booster for the rear brakes too ? I vaguely
        > remember an amry truck that had a setup like that. 500lb/ft wont be
        > a problem, i even have a torque wrench for that. however i may pass
        > on this and keep looking for the class C I wanted in the first place.

        The heavier models (RM_375 and RM-400 in 1974, M-400 and M-500
        thereafter) have dual Bendix HydroVac boosters mounted on the inside
        of the left frame rail. I pointed them out as worthy of special
        attention because they contain vacuum diaphragms which can
        deteriorate over long periods of disuse. When I resurrected Old Blue,
        one was still good but the other had failed. Rebuilt units are
        available.

        A 500 foot pound torque wrench? Quite a bit bigger than anything I've
        run across. Do you work on Main Battle Tanks? :-) [Unless you also
        have an industrial strength impact tool, you'll probably still find a
        pipe extension to the breaker bar necessary. I managed to bend the
        pipe I was using to break the lugnuts loose the first time. Even
        after several days of penetrating oil and heat/cold, some of the
        lugnuts did not loosen until I was essentially "bouncing" all of my
        200 pounds on the end of a 6' lever.]

        As to Class C versus Class A, the best thing I can say is that I
        would rather work on a motorhome chassis than a van (the basis of
        Class C's) any day. I have one of each from the mid-70's and have
        done extensive mechanical and "house" work on each. There is no
        comparison wrt ease of access.
        --
        Regards,
        Bill Combs <ttursine@...>
        1975 Superior 2800, "Old Blue"
        http://home.earthlink.net/~ttursine
        --
        I care not much for a man's religion whose
        dog and cat are not the better for it.
        - Abraham Lincoln




        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • ncra@bellsouth.net
        Glenn, I have to second what Bill Combs said, the Class A is so much easier to work on. I had to rebuild the transmission in my Winnie before I sold it. My 75
        Message 3 of 16 , Nov 1, 2006
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          Glenn,
          I have to second what Bill Combs said, the Class A is so much easier to work on. I had to rebuild the transmission in my Winnie before I sold it. My 75 Indian sat high enough to drop the trans using a roll around motor cycle life. after dropping the drive shaft ( make sure weeks are chocked ) I was able to sit upright under the Winnie and do the work. mine had the 318-3 in it had plenty of room to work. I was able to get all my engine parts same day at Advance auto parts. since i removed the trans my self I was able to get it rebuilt for $450.00.
          biggest problem I had with my Winnie was roof leaks around the roof mounted A/C unit.
          The Winnie is really well designed with easy access to about anything you need to get to. also I was surprised how well it drove.

          If you can get this Brave cheap, you will not regret it. look at some of the pics of member Rigs in Classic Winnebago group. truly amazing what you can do with one.
          I am now waiting to get a EMC ElDorado 31 foot motor home. bet it will be fun to find parts for. they are no longer made from what I understand. I bought it along with the Helicopter I am having rebuilt. so will get it when the helicopter is delivered.

          what size Brave are you looking at? my Indian was the DO-23 lots of room and a swing down bunk over driver area.
          good luck and keep us informed.

          Timothy F. Heilig
          Carolina Copters LLC
          4933 Randleman Rd.
          Greensboro N.C.
          27406
          336-674-0451
          ----- Original Message -----
          From: Bill Combs
          To: classicrv@yahoogroups.com
          Sent: Wednesday, November 01, 2006 12:12 PM
          Subject: Re: [classicrv] Re: 74 Winnie Brave


          On Nov 1, 2006, at 12:35 AM, Glenn wrote:

          >

          As to Class C versus Class A, the best thing I can say is that I
          would rather work on a motorhome chassis than a van (the basis of
          Class C's) any day. I have one of each from the mid-70's and have
          done extensive mechanical and "house" work on each. There is no
          comparison wrt ease of access.
          --
          Regards,
          Bill Combs <ttursine@...>
          1975 Superior 2800, "Old Blue"
          http://home.earthlink.net/~ttursine
          --
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          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • Bill Deisenroth
          Re: Power Brakes- My 1977 M500 MH has the Bendix Hydro Boost system. Many of the smaller Dodge MHs had the Bendix Master Vac system. Only the second system
          Message 4 of 16 , Nov 2, 2006
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            Re: Power Brakes- My 1977 M500 MH has the Bendix
            "Hydro Boost" system. Many of the smaller Dodge MHs
            had the Bendix "Master Vac" system. Only the second
            system has a vacuum diaphragm. Some owners installed
            aftermarket vacuum boosters for their rear brakes on
            their M500 or M600 chassis due to weak breaking.
            Bill



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          • Glenn
            Well I feel a little better about this rig after a few of these posts. i m thinking of taking it it but then waiting till spring t0 do anything with it. the
            Message 5 of 16 , Nov 2, 2006
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              Well I feel a little better about this rig after a few of these
              posts. i'm thinking of taking it it but then waiting till spring t0
              do anything with it. the apache will do us over this winter anyway.

              my torque wrench is a clicker type and goes up to 600 lbs. wheels on
              trucks generally are 450-500lb/ft for the most part. It doesn't get
              much use these days though.

              I hate stuck lug nuts ... once you get em off I don't truuct them.

              200lbs on 6' moment is about 1200 lb/ft. use cast pipe for that :)

              I have to agree on the A vs C theres certainly a lot of room to work


              >
              > The heavier models (RM_375 and RM-400 in 1974, M-400 and M-500
              > thereafter) have dual Bendix HydroVac boosters mounted on the
              inside
              > of the left frame rail. I pointed them out as worthy of special
              > attention because they contain vacuum diaphragms which can
              > deteriorate over long periods of disuse. When I resurrected Old
              Blue,
              > one was still good but the other had failed. Rebuilt units are
              > available.
              >
              > A 500 foot pound torque wrench? Quite a bit bigger than anything
              I've
              > run across. Do you work on Main Battle Tanks? :-) [Unless you
              also
              > have an industrial strength impact tool, you'll probably still
              find a
              > pipe extension to the breaker bar necessary. I managed to bend
              the
              > pipe I was using to break the lugnuts loose the first time. Even
              > after several days of penetrating oil and heat/cold, some of the
              > lugnuts did not loosen until I was essentially "bouncing" all of
              my
              > 200 pounds on the end of a 6' lever.]
              >
              > As to Class C versus Class A, the best thing I can say is that I
              > would rather work on a motorhome chassis than a van (the basis of
              > Class C's) any day. I have one of each from the mid-70's and have
              > done extensive mechanical and "house" work on each. There is no
              > comparison wrt ease of access.
              > --
              > Regards,
              > Bill Combs <ttursine@...>
              > 1975 Superior 2800, "Old Blue"
              > http://home.earthlink.net/~ttursine
              > --
              > I care not much for a man's religion whose
              > dog and cat are not the better for it.
              > - Abraham Lincoln
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              >
            • Glenn
              ... mounted A/C unit. ... anything you need to get to. also I was surprised how well it drove. ... room and a swing down bunk over driver area. ... I ll
              Message 6 of 16 , Nov 2, 2006
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                > biggest problem I had with my Winnie was roof leaks around the roof
                mounted A/C unit.
                > The Winnie is really well designed with easy access to about
                anything you need to get to. also I was surprised how well it drove.
                >
                >> what size Brave are you looking at? my Indian was the DO-23 lots of
                room and a swing down bunk over driver area.
                > good luck and keep us informed.
                >


                I'll definatly have a close look at the roof again. I find it hard to
                beleive that it hasn't leaked in al this time.

                I'm not sure how big it is.. if I had to guess I would say 22-24' tip
                to tail
              • Glenn
                Hydro booost uses the power steering pump for power right? ... _____________________________________________________________________ ... Yahoo! Groups
                Message 7 of 16 , Nov 2, 2006
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                  Hydro booost uses the power steering pump for power right?

                  --- In classicrv@yahoogroups.com, Bill Deisenroth <cor50067@...>
                  wrote:
                  >
                  > Re: Power Brakes- My 1977 M500 MH has the Bendix
                  > "Hydro Boost" system. Many of the smaller Dodge MHs
                  > had the Bendix "Master Vac" system. Only the second
                  > system has a vacuum diaphragm. Some owners installed
                  > aftermarket vacuum boosters for their rear brakes on
                  > their M500 or M600 chassis due to weak breaking.
                  > Bill
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  _____________________________________________________________________
                  _______________
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                  > (http://groups.yahoo.com)
                  >
                • Bill Combs
                  ... The 1973 through 1975 Motorhome Chassis Service Manual has this to say about the power boosters: ... all RM300 [re-designated M300 in 1975] models are
                  Message 8 of 16 , Nov 2, 2006
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                    On Nov 2, 2006, at 11:46 PM, Glenn wrote:

                    > Hydro booost uses the power steering pump for power right?
                    >
                    > --- In classicrv@yahoogroups.com, Bill Deisenroth <cor50067@...>
                    > wrote:
                    >>
                    >> Re: Power Brakes- My 1977 M500 MH has the Bendix
                    >> "Hydro Boost" system. Many of the smaller Dodge MHs
                    >> had the Bendix "Master Vac" system. Only the second
                    >> system has a vacuum diaphragm. Some owners installed
                    >> aftermarket vacuum boosters for their rear brakes on
                    >> their M500 or M600 chassis due to weak breaking.
                    >> Bill

                    The 1973 through 1975 Motorhome Chassis Service Manual has this to
                    say about the power boosters:

                    "... all RM300 [re-designated M300 in 1975] models are equipped with
                    Bendix Master-Vac combination dual diaphragm vacuum booster and
                    tandem master cylinder."

                    "Bendix Hydrovac units are used in pairs on RM-350 [re-designated
                    M400 in 1975] and RM400 [re-designated M500 in 1975] models ... The
                    booster units are single diaphtagm vacuum operated ..."

                    From what Bill says, Dodge then presumably changed power brake
                    systems on the two larger models in either 1976 or 1977? [For unknown
                    reasons, I had an impression rattling around in my alleged mind that
                    the hydraulic system came before the vacuum system. Guess that was
                    wrong.]
                    --
                    Regards,
                    Bill Combs
                    <ttursine@...>
                    1975 Superior 2800, "Old Blue"
                    http://home.earthlink.net/~ttursine
                    --
                    Chaos, panic, disorder...
                    my work here is done.




                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  • dxxx cxxxxx
                    yes ... ____________________________________________________________________________________ Cheap Talk? Check out Yahoo! Messenger s low PC-to-Phone call
                    Message 9 of 16 , Nov 2, 2006
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                      yes

                      --- Bill Combs <ttursine@...> wrote:

                      > On Nov 2, 2006, at 11:46 PM, Glenn wrote:
                      >
                      > > Hydro booost uses the power steering pump for
                      > power right?
                      > >




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