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Re: Idle problems

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  • byoch
    kim, i had a toyota chinook, same motor, carburated. every year is a bit different, due to smog regs, but look at your vacuum box, on the fenderwell, about 10
    Message 1 of 16 , Aug 3, 2004
      kim,
      i had a toyota chinook, same motor, carburated. every year is a bit
      different, due to smog regs, but look at your vacuum box, on the
      fenderwell, about 10 small hoses coming out. check for leaks in the
      hoses. also check for the anti smog control, looks like the old anti
      stall dashpot. It may not be the carb, but the controls for the carb.
      as to the speed, that 20r is low horsepower, the camper is a big box.
      my chinook was hard pressed to do 75 on the highway, and it was
      streamlined and light. there are trade offs, you want a 200,000 mile
      engine, easy on gas, or you want more power. In the old days at the
      track the phrase was "you wanna go fast, how much can you spend",
      nothing is free....sigh.

      as a side note, i'm looking for a hard shell toyota chinook, the
      omega model. I will trade straight across for my 21 foot executive,
      way more room than i need.




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    • jon lechich
      Jerry when you said something about a coolant problem, my motor home was running hot when this occurred. I replace a dysfunctional temperature thermostat and
      Message 2 of 16 , Aug 3, 2004
        Jerry when you said something about a coolant problem, my motor home was running hot when this occurred. I replace a dysfunctional temperature thermostat and maybe that is causing this intermediate problem. It was running real hot and when I replaced the thermostat (last weekend) it came right down to where it is suppose to run. I will let you know if this solved the problem. Jon

        Jerry Noone <rjerryc01@...> wrote: This may not apply at all - I know nothing about Toyota engines - or ANY engines for that matter but I had a similar problem with my HR with a 454 Chev engine. I fought and fought with the idle - everytime I shut the engine of it ran on and backfired because of the high idle - finally gave the thing to my neighbor who has a repair shop - asked him to do a "tune-up". Plugs, wires, etc. He promptly called to let me know that the electronic (?) choke control was defective and he had to block it open to do the tune up. He said it was controlled by collant temp as well as "other" controls. I had him replace the choke control, which was about $60 and he returned to me a coach that ran the smoothest and best since I purchased it. Just a thought and maybe a place to begin.
        Jerry

        oiler1998@... wrote:
        Hi group,

        I bought Dolphin 19ft motorhome on a 1980 Toyota with the 20R engine.
        This is a carbureted engine. There was a new (re-manufactured)
        carburetor installed by the previous owner.

        After i bought the truck I brought it to a Toyota dealer to get it to
        run correctly. They didn't want anything to do with it. In
        their words "it's a 24 year old truck, the carburetor is bad (as
        mentioned above, the previous owner had replaced the origional) and
        we don't repair carburetors".

        So I brought the truck to a "regular" (non-brand specific) shop. They
        also assumed it was carburetion and replaced the carburetor, with no
        luck, so they replaced it again.
        With this 3rd carburetor the idle rpm's still seem to be very high (i
        haven't tach'ed it) and stays high a good 3~4 minutes. Eventually
        it kick's down to a "normal" rpm. However, when driving and I push
        in the cluth to shift the rpm's stay very high. If i keep the clutch
        in as when coming to a stop the rpm's will kick down after a while.

        This is a lesser problem of what I was having when I brought the
        truck in origionally (the rpm would never kick down and fuel
        was "dumping" in the primary).
        My thought is that after three carburetors and having somewhat the
        same symptoms the problem isn't with the carburetion.

        On the freeway I'm lucky to get 65 mph on flat land.

        Would a bad catalytic converter (back pressure)cause this kind of
        problem? bad EGR? I am trying to avoid throwing $$$ at anything and
        everything to resolve this so I can use the $$ to restore the coach.

        Is it the nature of the beast since the choke is operated by coolant
        temp?

        Thoughts and ideas welcome!

        Thanks,
        Kim



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      • jon lechich
        Thanks a heap and I will replace that unit just for JP s -Jon Sterling Voth wrote:Jon, saw your question about the 351 Winnebago.
        Message 3 of 16 , Aug 3, 2004
          Thanks a heap and I will replace that unit just for JP's -Jon

          Sterling Voth <recreation@...> wrote:Jon, saw your question about the 351 Winnebago. By that engine I assume you
          have a Ford 351. They are prone to intermittent problems with the idle
          speed motor. It is the unit on the side of the throttle body that has a
          small electric motor on it and is held on by two bolts. Has an electric
          plug going to the electric motor on one end. They can stick or jam after
          moving for so many years. They basically have two air ports in them and
          control the idle speed by moving a piston back and forth by computer control
          in repsonse to all the engine signals. that is why fuel injection engines
          usually idle so darned smooth. They are constantly changing the idle many
          times a second to keep ti perfect. Virtually all Ford cars and truck have
          used this same style of unit since the mid 80's and this ia a very common
          problem. Replace it with either a "Standard Blue Streak" brand, or the
          original from Ford. Most of the Standard brand ones are made by Ford anyway
          and even have Ford labels on them. The cheap other brands usually don't
          work at keeping idle correct. This is a simple two bolt replacement, that
          assuming that you don't have too much stuff in the way involves removing the
          air cleaner and then the two bolts and reinstalling the new one. A 10
          minute job in most cases. I have changed so many of these over the years
          could do them in my sleep. :-) Chryser and GM vehicles use idle air
          control motors and solenoids also, but they are usually made differently
          from the Ford unit. Ford seems to have more trouble with this than the
          other brands though. I bet that will cure the problem with the idle on your
          engine.

          Sterling.............

          ----------
          >From: jon lechich <jipjob@...>
          >To: classicrv@yahoogroups.com
          >Subject: Re: [classicrv] Idle problems
          >Date: Tue, Aug 3, 2004, 2:56 PM
          >

          > Boy if you get the answer to this I have the same problem with my fuel
          > enjected 351 Winnebago. It doesn't do it all the time but only once in a
          > while. Sure would be neat to find out from someone what's happening. Jon

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        • oiler1998@yahoo.com
          Thanks a bunch for all the replies and recommendations. You ve helped me release the pent up frustrations. I should take in consideration the age, weight, etc.
          Message 4 of 16 , Aug 3, 2004
            Thanks a bunch for all the replies and recommendations.

            You've helped me release the pent up frustrations. I should take in
            consideration the age, weight, etc. for this engine to work with.

            I'll break out the ole Haynes book and do the systematic checks. My
            concern is the "city code" of leaving a vehicle on the street un-
            moved for 72 plus hours. Granted, usually it isn't enforced but
            Murphys law would dictate that as soon as I made the motorhome un-
            drivable I'd find the 72 hour notice on the windshield. Guess I'll
            take my chances.

            Thanks again,
            Kim
          • Jay Jobes
            Here is the hit list I would perform if I owned that coach with the Toyota motor. 1. Vacuum leaks. There are a bazilion vacuum lines and solonoids. Make sure
            Message 5 of 16 , Aug 4, 2004
              Here is the hit list I would perform if I owned that coach with the Toyota motor.

              1. Vacuum leaks. There are a bazilion vacuum lines and solonoids. Make sure each is functioning properly with no leaks. Take some needle nose pliers and next time it high idles (at running temp), pinch off each vacuum line comming off of the carb and see if one of the circuts lets the idle drop, then concentrate on that circut.

              2. Timing. Even 5-8 degrees over stock advance can cause wierd intermittant idle problems.

              3. Valve adjustment. Very easy on that motor. Unless you have recipt proof it was done recently, do it.

              4. If all that checks out, and you are still pulling your hair out, there is another option. Weber makes carburator kits for all the import motors like yours. Comes pre-jetted, and with all the linkages. This would require removing most of your smog gear in the engine bay, so may not be feesable in your area. Installing a Weber carb would give you a noticeable boost in performance, and even fuel mileage. It would give you much easier tunability as well.


              aka: Sasquatch
              1987 Porsche 944
              1974 Porsche 914
              2001 Triumph Tiger 955i
              1996 Husaberg FE501

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            • oiler1998@yahoo.com
              Thanks Jay, Sounds like a plan. Your very right about the vacuum hoses. This is a CA truck, the Weber carb advertisements advise not for CA use... oh well,
              Message 6 of 16 , Aug 4, 2004
                Thanks Jay,

                Sounds like a plan.

                Your very right about the vacuum hoses. This is a CA truck, the Weber
                carb advertisements advise not for CA use... oh well, must stay leagl.
                The needle nose plier trick sounds simple enough.

                Kim

                --- In classicrv@yahoogroups.com, Jay Jobes <jobesfzr@y...> wrote:
                > Here is the hit list I would perform if I owned that coach with the
                Toyota motor.
                >
                > 1. Vacuum leaks. There are a bazilion vacuum lines and solonoids.
                Make sure each is functioning properly with no leaks. Take some
                needle nose pliers and next time it high idles (at running temp),
                pinch off each vacuum line comming off of the carb and see if one of
                the circuts lets the idle drop, then concentrate on that circut.
                >
                > 2. Timing. Even 5-8 degrees over stock advance can cause wierd
                intermittant idle problems.
                >
                > 3. Valve adjustment. Very easy on that motor. Unless you have
                recipt proof it was done recently, do it.
                >
                > 4. If all that checks out, and you are still pulling your hair out,
                there is another option. Weber makes carburator kits for all the
                import motors like yours. Comes pre-jetted, and with all the
                linkages. This would require removing most of your smog gear in the
                engine bay, so may not be feesable in your area. Installing a Weber
                carb would give you a noticeable boost in performance, and even fuel
                mileage. It would give you much easier tunability as well.
                >
                >
                > aka: Sasquatch
                > 1987 Porsche 944
                > 1974 Porsche 914
                > 2001 Triumph Tiger 955i
                > 1996 Husaberg FE501
                >
                > ---------------------------------
                > Do you Yahoo!?
                > New and Improved Yahoo! Mail - Send 10MB messages!
                >
                > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              • JIMMY
                Kim For Toyota camper problems try going to toyota-campers group on Yahoo and explain your problem. There is a man there named Paul C. that is extremely
                Message 7 of 16 , Aug 4, 2004
                  Kim

                  For Toyota camper problems try going to "toyota-campers" group on
                  Yahoo and explain your problem.

                  There is a man there named Paul C. that is extremely kowledgeable
                  about Toyotas. Paul has been working with Toyotas for years and is
                  a great source for information.

                  If I had a problem I would not hesitate to take any suggestions that
                  Paul would make. He knows what he is talking about.

                  Jimmy

                  + + + + + +


                  --- In classicrv@yahoogroups.com, oiler1998@y... wrote:
                  > Thanks a bunch for all the replies and recommendations.
                  >
                  > You've helped me release the pent up frustrations. I should take
                  in
                  > consideration the age, weight, etc. for this engine to work with.
                  >
                  > I'll break out the ole Haynes book and do the systematic checks.
                  My
                  > concern is the "city code" of leaving a vehicle on the street un-
                  > moved for 72 plus hours. Granted, usually it isn't enforced but
                  > Murphys law would dictate that as soon as I made the motorhome un-
                  > drivable I'd find the 72 hour notice on the windshield. Guess I'll
                  > take my chances.
                  >
                  > Thanks again,
                  > Kim
                • oiler1998@yahoo.com
                  Thank you Jimmy. Kim ... that ... I ll
                  Message 8 of 16 , Aug 4, 2004
                    Thank you Jimmy.
                    Kim

                    --- In classicrv@yahoogroups.com, "JIMMY" <jimmyofgh@y...> wrote:
                    > Kim
                    >
                    > For Toyota camper problems try going to "toyota-campers" group on
                    > Yahoo and explain your problem.
                    >
                    > There is a man there named Paul C. that is extremely kowledgeable
                    > about Toyotas. Paul has been working with Toyotas for years and is
                    > a great source for information.
                    >
                    > If I had a problem I would not hesitate to take any suggestions
                    that
                    > Paul would make. He knows what he is talking about.
                    >
                    > Jimmy
                    >
                    > + + + + + +
                    >
                    >
                    > --- In classicrv@yahoogroups.com, oiler1998@y... wrote:
                    > > Thanks a bunch for all the replies and recommendations.
                    > >
                    > > You've helped me release the pent up frustrations. I should take
                    > in
                    > > consideration the age, weight, etc. for this engine to work with.
                    > >
                    > > I'll break out the ole Haynes book and do the systematic checks.
                    > My
                    > > concern is the "city code" of leaving a vehicle on the street un-
                    > > moved for 72 plus hours. Granted, usually it isn't enforced but
                    > > Murphys law would dictate that as soon as I made the motorhome un-
                    > > drivable I'd find the 72 hour notice on the windshield. Guess
                    I'll
                    > > take my chances.
                    > >
                    > > Thanks again,
                    > > Kim
                  • John
                    You can try using a spray can of carb cleaner on the various vacuum hoses and connections. When the engine sputters, you have an intake leak. Works good on old
                    Message 9 of 16 , Aug 5, 2004
                      You can try using a spray can of carb cleaner on the various vacuum
                      hoses and connections. When the engine sputters, you have an intake
                      leak. Works good on old motorcycles and old RVs like my 84 Suncrest.
                      I had a split hose and the split was on the underside against the
                      intake manifold so I couldn't see it. The carb cleaner caught it
                      right away. Cheap fix luckily for me.
                      Good luck
                      John in sunny California
                    • Mark
                      ... hoses and connections. WD-40, starting fluid, or anything flammable (I wouldn t recommend paint...) will work too. Many times, just cutting off a half
                      Message 10 of 16 , Aug 5, 2004
                        >You can try using a spray can of carb cleaner on the various vacuum
                        hoses and connections.

                        WD-40, starting fluid, or anything flammable (I wouldn't recommend paint...) will work too. Many times, just cutting off a half inch off the end of a cracked hose will get you back into good rubber. It's always a good idea to leave a little extra length on new hoses for just that purpose.


                        Mark in Modesto

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