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Re: Why I prefer the Civil War in the West over the East

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  • josepharose
    ... Mr. Giallombardo: It s not just a question of who won? regarding the USA vs. the CSA. In fact, the generals of the CSA haven t had that difficult a time
    Message 1 of 198 , Jan 2, 2006
      --- In civilwarwest@yahoogroups.com, "Dan Giallombardo"
      <DanGiallo@A...> wrote:
      >
      > I think we all need to remember that the victors
      > write the history of the war. Had the Union been defeated, who knows
      > which general would've taken Tecumseh's place?-----Dan


      Mr. Giallombardo:

      It's not just a question of "who won?" regarding the USA vs. the CSA.
      In fact, the generals of the CSA haven't had that difficult a time in
      maintaining good reputations (where deserved) compared to their
      Federal counterparts.

      Comparing the reputations among the generals on the Federal side
      alone, however, I think that your statement "that the victors write
      the history of the war" is quite accurate. Grant and his favorites
      (e.g., Sherman, Sheridan, Schofield, D. D. Porter, and Howard) had
      been designated the victors for the Federals, placed in important
      military positions after the war, wrote influential memoirs, and have
      determined in large part their own places in history and that of their
      fellow Federal officers (for good or ill). The problem comes from the
      unreliability of their writings during and after the war, especially
      their published recollections of it.

      Joseph
    • oneplez
      ... to the ... punches or ... Sherman, ... of him, ... considered ... of ... as a ... I never said his racist reputation affected his military reputation! I
      Message 198 of 198 , Jan 11, 2006
        --- In civilwarwest@yahoogroups.com, "Bill Gower" <billgower@c...>
        wrote:
        >
        > But he did not let it affect how he fought or his decision to march
        to the
        > sea and through the Carolinas. IMHO, Sherman did not pull any
        punches or
        > work less to defeat the South because of his views. In fairness to
        Sherman,
        > when Stanton asked the black leaders of Savannah of their opinion
        of him,
        > after he had left the room, they gave high praise to Sherman and
        considered
        > him a friend and a gentleman. Again I don't like the racist views
        of
        > Sherman, but I don't have to like his racist views to respect him
        as a
        > military leaders and a great strategist.
        >
        > Bill

        I never said his racist reputation affected his military reputation!
        I said they were both bad!!!!!!

        Don


        >
        >
        >
        > -----Original Message-----
        > From: civilwarwest@yahoogroups.com
        [mailto:civilwarwest@yahoogroups.com] On
        > Behalf Of josepharose
        > Sent: Wednesday, January 11, 2006 1:58 PM
        > To: civilwarwest@yahoogroups.com
        > Subject: [civilwarwest] Re: Sherman's racism
        >
        > --- In civilwarwest@yahoogroups.com, "Bill Gower" <billgower@c...>
        wrote:
        > >
        > > I am not saying that it is unfair. I am saying that if you remove
        > all Union
        > > generals who were racists and who were not fighting to rid the
        South of
        > > slavery, the Union army would have been ruled by a couple of
        > privates from
        > > Massachusetts. Ok that's an exaggeration, but IMHO a good majority
        > of union
        > > soldiers started the war as racists and then as they saw the
        > conditions of
        > > slavery began to rethink their views. I do have a problem with
        > Sherman and
        > > racism but fortunately he didn't let racism get in the way of
        > fighting the
        > > South and wanting to restore the Union. I will not judge his
        military
        > > career by whether he was a racist or not. If that's the case,
        what
        > can be
        > > said about Custer and Sheridan?
        > >
        > > Bill
        >
        >
        > But Mr. Gower, I just indicated below that Sherman *did* let his
        > racism directly detract from the war effort by his contravening
        > administration policy.
        >
        > Joseph
        >
        >
        >
        > > -----Original Message-----
        > > From: civilwarwest@yahoogroups.com
        > [mailto:civilwarwest@yahoogroups.com] On
        > > Behalf Of josepharose
        > > Sent: Wednesday, January 11, 2006 12:53 PM
        > > To: civilwarwest@yahoogroups.com
        > > Subject: [civilwarwest] Sherman's racism
        > >
        > > --- In civilwarwest@yahoogroups.com, "Bill Gower" <billgower@c...>
        > wrote:
        > > >
        > > > Sherman was no more a racist than a lot of other generals in the
        > period.
        > > > Frank Blair and Jefferson C. Davis were good examples of
        generals
        > > that were
        > > > racisst. The majority of Americans, north and south, would
        have been
        > > > considered "racist" by today's standards. I too, have a problem
        > > with the
        > > > racism of Sherman but then I am trying to judge him and others
        by
        > > today's
        > > > standards. I am not saying that racism is right or that he was
        > > right for
        > > > it. I am just saying that through years of indoctrination by
        the
        > > planter
        > > > party of the South and by the Democrats of the day, the
        majority of
        > > > Americans were racists. Fortunately Generals were not chosen
        > because of
        > > > racial beliefs or the North would have had a hard time fielding
        > > armies with
        > > > generals.
        > > >
        > > > Bill
        > >
        > >
        > > Although you may think it unfair to discuss Sherman's racism in
        > > detail, I think that it was worse than you indicate and worse
        than the
        > > average Union general.
        > >
        > > I don't have the details from the ORs, but as I understand it,
        Sherman
        > > contravened the administration's orders on Black enlistment
        because of
        > > his feelings on the subject. I can't think of any other generals
        who
        > > let their racist feelings do that.
        > >
        > > Joseph
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > > Yahoo! Groups Links
        > >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        > Yahoo! Groups Links
        >
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