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Bearing Testimony: Engaged in War

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  • WmHiram
    I am not at all ashamed to admit that Ken Burns series was what put me on the road from somebody who knew only what they d learned in high school about the
    Message 1 of 14 , Aug 22 8:31 PM
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      I am not at all ashamed to admit that Ken Burns' series was what put
      me on the road from somebody who knew only what they'd learned in
      high school about the ACW to somebody who had the honor of leading a
      battlefield tour this year. For the average Joe in the street, the
      series had a lot more impact than "Battle Cry of Freedom" or any
      other book.

      From somebody looking up from the street, not down from the ivied
      tower!

      Billie
    • jimtnfan2002@aol.com
      i think that interest in the cival-war was always alive and well to millions of us. and a lot of us knew that history books did nt tell the whole story.
      Message 2 of 14 , Aug 22 10:03 PM
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        i think that interest in the cival-war was always alive and well to millions of us. and a lot of us knew that history books did'nt tell the whole story. but burns series opened up the acw to many, many more. many of the causes of the cival-war are still important today to many of us, and i don't mean the things that are mentioned in the history books. but here in the south the confederacy was never truly surrendered. because it is impossible to stop believing in things that are larger causes than life itself in some cases. I'm glad this country is united, and i believe that had the north not have won the war, neither country (usa-or-csa) could have survived I'm not a racist or rights activist. i don't want the cival war to be fought again. the bloodshed was the worst that can be imagined. i love this county, GOD bless the USA!! but we must look at history in order to prepare the future. we the people have a responibility to know the history of the acw, so as to protect this democracy from people who have never allowed the full history of our cival war to be taught in history books. there may have been more modern history lost in the civalwarwest than anywhere ever. hats off to ken burns, for his fine series. and to all of you who care enough to explore this great section of our history. of course these are only my own opinions.
      • P. B. Jones
        Billie - Similar story here. Ken Burns series hooked me. Then I saw Gettysburg and it reeled me in. Shortly thereafter I purchased and read Battle Cry
        Message 3 of 14 , Aug 22 10:22 PM
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          Billie -
           
          Similar story here.  Ken Burns' series hooked me.   Then I saw 'Gettysburg' and it reeled me in.  Shortly thereafter I purchased and read Battle Cry of Freedom.  That was many years, many books and many chats ago.  :) 
           
          Pat
          ----- Original Message -----
          From: WmHiram
          Sent: Thursday, August 22, 2002 8:31 PM
          Subject: [civilwarwest] Bearing Testimony: Engaged in War

          I am not at all ashamed to admit that Ken Burns' series was what put
          me on the road from somebody who knew only what they'd learned in
          high school about the ACW to somebody who had the honor of leading a
          battlefield tour this year.  For the average Joe in the street, the
          series had a lot more impact than "Battle Cry of Freedom" or any
          other book.

          From somebody looking up from the street, not down from the ivied
          tower!

          Billie
        • hank9174
          Well said. Burns brought alive the people, their struggles and the world they lived in. I know it provoked many long and interesting discussions with family,
          Message 4 of 14 , Aug 23 7:17 AM
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            Well said.

            Burns brought alive the people, their struggles and the world they
            lived in. I know it provoked many long and interesting discussions
            with family, friends and strangers sparked by some various element of
            the Civil War from food to railroads to medicine to, yes, FFFs.

            The failing of the series was presenting the CW in the manner of a
            description of a car wreck: 'an invisible tree came out of nowhere,
            hit me and vanished'. I've not watched the series in over 10 years,
            but I recall the ante-bellum being discussed in a ½ hour and
            reconstruction in a ½ paragraph. The Civil War certainly didn't
            appear from no where and certainly didn't vanish on 9 April.

            Which is where McPherson and Foner come in. Foner, of course, is the
            author of THE reconstruction tome and McPherson's book is the best
            one-volume explanation of pre-war America.

            Naturally, this is all just my opinion...

            HankC

            footnote: FFFs - fights, feints and flanks


            --- In civilwarwest@y..., jimtnfan2002@a... wrote:
            > <PRE>i think that interest in the cival-war was always alive and
            well to millions
            > of us. and a lot of us knew that history books did'nt tell the whole
            story.
            > but burns series opened up the acw to many, many more. many of the
            causes of
            > the cival-war are still important today to many of us, and i don't
            mean the
            > things that are mentioned in the history books. but here in the
            south the
            > confederacy was never truly surrendered. because it is impossible to
            stop
            > believing in things that are larger causes than life itself in some
            cases.
            > I'm glad this country is united, and i believe that had the north
            not have
            > won the war, neither country (usa-or-csa) could have survived I'm
            not a
            > racist or rights activist. i don't want the cival war to be fought
            again. the
            > bloodshed was the worst that can be imagined. i love this county,
            GOD bless
            > the USA!! but we must look at history in order to prepare the
            future. we the
            > people have a responibility to know the history of the acw, so as to
            protect
            > this democracy from people who have never allowed the full history
            of our
            > cival war to be taught in history books. there may have been more
            modern
            > history lost in the civalwarwest than anywhere ever. hats off to ken
            burns,
            > for his fine series. and to all of you who care enough to explore
            this great
            > section of our history. of course these are only my own opinions.
          • David Kowalski
            In my case, the McPherson book came first. The acid test for buying the book was its coverage of Cold Harbor. It presented it with some depth: not as a
            Message 5 of 14 , Aug 23 7:34 AM
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              In my case, the McPherson book came first. The acid
              test for buying the book was its coverage of Cold
              Harbor. It presented it with some depth: not as a
              stupid bloody mistake with no after-effects but as
              something which left the bitter taste of caution in
              the minds and spirits of the Army of the Potomac.
              Burns was best in showing old photographs and letters
              from soldiers. I was disappointed that this
              "in-depth" coverage didn't go farther at points. My
              vote is with McPherson.

              --- "P. B. Jones" <jones@...> wrote:
              > Billie -
              >
              > Similar story here. Ken Burns' series hooked me.
              > Then I saw 'Gettysburg' and it reeled me in.
              > Shortly thereafter I purchased and read Battle Cry
              > of Freedom. That was many years, many books and
              > many chats ago. :)
              >
              > Pat
              > ----- Original Message -----
              > From: WmHiram
              > To: civilwarwest@yahoogroups.com
              > Sent: Thursday, August 22, 2002 8:31 PM
              > Subject: [civilwarwest] Bearing Testimony: Engaged
              > in War
              >
              >
              > I am not at all ashamed to admit that Ken Burns'
              > series was what put
              > me on the road from somebody who knew only what
              > they'd learned in
              > high school about the ACW to somebody who had the
              > honor of leading a
              > battlefield tour this year. For the average Joe
              > in the street, the
              > series had a lot more impact than "Battle Cry of
              > Freedom" or any
              > other book.
              >
              > From somebody looking up from the street, not down
              > from the ivied
              > tower!
              >
              > Billie
              >


              __________________________________________________
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            • WmHiram
              ... I ve not watched the series in over 10 years, ... Hank, that s true, but I don t know a lot of people who would sit still for Ken Burns Ongoing History
              Message 6 of 14 , Aug 23 7:38 AM
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                --- In civilwarwest@y..., "hank9174" <clarkc@m...> wrote:
                I've not watched the series in over 10 years,
                > but I recall the ante-bellum being discussed in a ½ hour and
                > reconstruction in a ½ paragraph. The Civil War certainly didn't
                > appear from no where and certainly didn't vanish on 9 April.

                Hank, that's true, but I don't know a lot of people who would sit
                still for "Ken Burns' Ongoing History of the United States Of America
                with Plenty of Time Spent on Political Agendas of the 19th Century."

                Ken Burns' series is pop culture. It's purty pictures and purty
                music and purty voices, and the barest whiff of Western Theater
                (which I saw as a lack even in my untutored days.) I guess that's why
                we have message boards like this, which sometimes remind me of a nit
                comb.

                Billie
              • Robert(Bob) Taubman
                I happened to be in Washington, D.C. at the time Burns series was on tv. We ended up going to Arlington Cemetery and after that I knew I had to have more of
                Message 7 of 14 , Aug 23 8:39 AM
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                  I happened to be in Washington, D.C. at the time Burns' series was on tv. We
                  ended up going to Arlington Cemetery and after that I knew I had to have more of
                  the same. I ended up purchasing Foote's trilogy and now my room is full of
                  books on the ACW. Burns' series may not have been the definitive study on the
                  conflict but for me it was the start of a never-ending journey.

                  Thankx Mr. Burns.


                  ----- Original Message -----
                  From: "WmHiram" <wmhiram@...>
                  To: <civilwarwest@yahoogroups.com>
                  Sent: Friday, August 23, 2002 10:38 AM
                  Subject: [civilwarwest] Re: Bearing Testimony: Engaged in War


                  --- In civilwarwest@y..., "hank9174" <clarkc@m...> wrote:
                  I've not watched the series in over 10 years,
                  > but I recall the ante-bellum being discussed in a ½ hour and
                  > reconstruction in a ½ paragraph. The Civil War certainly didn't
                  > appear from no where and certainly didn't vanish on 9 April.

                  Hank, that's true, but I don't know a lot of people who would sit
                  still for "Ken Burns' Ongoing History of the United States Of America
                  with Plenty of Time Spent on Political Agendas of the 19th Century."

                  Ken Burns' series is pop culture. It's purty pictures and purty
                  music and purty voices, and the barest whiff of Western Theater
                  (which I saw as a lack even in my untutored days.) I guess that's why
                  we have message boards like this, which sometimes remind me of a nit
                  comb.

                  Billie





                  Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                • hartshje
                  Personally, I think every generation in it s turn has to be re- awakened to things of the past. It s kind of funny reading all these posts about Burns and
                  Message 8 of 14 , Aug 29 10:59 PM
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                    Personally, I think every generation in it's turn has to be re-
                    awakened to things of the past. It's kind of funny reading all these
                    posts about Burns and McPherson. I truly enjoyed Burns' series (own
                    it) and thought he did a masterful job of helping to bring history
                    alive! That's what is pertinent. As for me, I got started off on
                    Catton, Foote, Sword, heck the Encyclopedia Americana even (which had
                    some great detailed descriptions of the tactical side of battles). I
                    haven't even read McPherson yet, having already read hundreds of
                    books and articles, but I will get "a round tuit". I don't even
                    think Burns was born yet when I started reading Civil War. And I'm
                    sure that goes for many others of us.

                    Joe H.

                    --- In civilwarwest@y..., "Robert\(Bob\) Taubman" <rtaubman@r...>
                    wrote:
                    > I happened to be in Washington, D.C. at the time Burns' series was
                    on tv. We
                    > ended up going to Arlington Cemetery and after that I knew I had to
                    have more of
                    > the same. I ended up purchasing Foote's trilogy and now my room is
                    full of
                    > books on the ACW. Burns' series may not have been the definitive
                    study on the
                    > conflict but for me it was the start of a never-ending journey.
                    >
                    > Thankx Mr. Burns.
                    >
                    >
                    > ----- Original Message -----
                    > From: "WmHiram" <wmhiram@y...>
                    > To: <civilwarwest@y...>
                    > Sent: Friday, August 23, 2002 10:38 AM
                    > Subject: [civilwarwest] Re: Bearing Testimony: Engaged in War
                    >
                    >
                    > --- In civilwarwest@y..., "hank9174" <clarkc@m...> wrote:
                    > I've not watched the series in over 10 years,
                    > > but I recall the ante-bellum being discussed in a ½ hour and
                    > > reconstruction in a ½ paragraph. The Civil War certainly didn't
                    > > appear from no where and certainly didn't vanish on 9 April.
                    >
                    > Hank, that's true, but I don't know a lot of people who would sit
                    > still for "Ken Burns' Ongoing History of the United States Of
                    America
                    > with Plenty of Time Spent on Political Agendas of the 19th Century."
                    >
                    > Ken Burns' series is pop culture. It's purty pictures and purty
                    > music and purty voices, and the barest whiff of Western Theater
                    > (which I saw as a lack even in my untutored days.) I guess that's
                    why
                    > we have message boards like this, which sometimes remind me of a nit
                    > comb.
                    >
                    > Billie
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
                    http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                  • bobaldrich2001
                    Joe H., I got interested at age 7 when my Dad took the family to Gettysburg in 1959. Before we left he got us setting up the battle on the living room floor,
                    Message 9 of 14 , Sep 3, 2002
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                      Joe H.,

                      I got interested at age 7 when my Dad took the family to Gettysburg
                      in 1959. Before we left he got us setting up the battle on the
                      living room floor, with hundreds of toy soldiers (of all eras!) and
                      sofa cushions for little and big round top. Supposedly the family
                      myth goes that by the time we got to Gettysburg we kids were ready to
                      set the expert guides straight on several aspects of the battle, but
                      personally I doubt it. Later we got the Gettysburg Avalon Hill war
                      game (anybody remember that?) and played it endlessly. I also recall
                      reading a Shelby Foote picture history book and making a scrapbook
                      out of pictures from the Life magazine centennial issue(s) in the
                      1960s. And reading a kids' book on Confederate cavalrymen
                      called "Swords Stars and Bars". But I didn't learn much about the
                      Western theater until joining this forum 40 years later.

                      I haven't seen the Burns series (hope to catch some of it this time
                      around) but I question why a fascinating TV story couldn't be made
                      out of the lead up to the war - the country was being torn apart at
                      the seams, for crying out loud! Personally I think that if that
                      part was given short shrift it would be mainly due to the notorious
                      sensitivity of "causes" issues. But enough said about that!

                      Bob A.



                      --- In civilwarwest@y..., "hartshje" <Hartshje@a...> wrote:
                      > Personally, I think every generation in it's turn has to be re-
                      > awakened to things of the past. It's kind of funny reading all
                      these
                      > posts about Burns and McPherson. I truly enjoyed Burns' series
                      (own
                      > it) and thought he did a masterful job of helping to bring history
                      > alive! That's what is pertinent. As for me, I got started off on
                      > Catton, Foote, Sword, heck the Encyclopedia Americana even (which
                      had
                      > some great detailed descriptions of the tactical side of battles).
                      I
                      > haven't even read McPherson yet, having already read hundreds of
                      > books and articles, but I will get "a round tuit". I don't even
                      > think Burns was born yet when I started reading Civil War. And I'm
                      > sure that goes for many others of us.
                      >
                      > Joe H.
                      >
                      > --- In civilwarwest@y..., "Robert\(Bob\) Taubman" <rtaubman@r...>
                      > wrote:
                      > > I happened to be in Washington, D.C. at the time Burns' series
                      was
                      > on tv. We
                      > > ended up going to Arlington Cemetery and after that I knew I had
                      to
                      > have more of
                      > > the same. I ended up purchasing Foote's trilogy and now my room
                      is
                      > full of
                      > > books on the ACW. Burns' series may not have been the definitive
                      > study on the
                      > > conflict but for me it was the start of a never-ending journey.
                      > >
                      > > Thankx Mr. Burns.
                      > >
                      > >
                      > > ----- Original Message -----
                      > > From: "WmHiram" <wmhiram@y...>
                      > > To: <civilwarwest@y...>
                      > > Sent: Friday, August 23, 2002 10:38 AM
                      > > Subject: [civilwarwest] Re: Bearing Testimony: Engaged in War
                      > >
                      > >
                      > > --- In civilwarwest@y..., "hank9174" <clarkc@m...> wrote:
                      > > I've not watched the series in over 10 years,
                      > > > but I recall the ante-bellum being discussed in a ½ hour and
                      > > > reconstruction in a ½ paragraph. The Civil War certainly didn't
                      > > > appear from no where and certainly didn't vanish on 9 April.
                      > >
                      > > Hank, that's true, but I don't know a lot of people who would sit
                      > > still for "Ken Burns' Ongoing History of the United States Of
                      > America
                      > > with Plenty of Time Spent on Political Agendas of the 19th
                      Century."
                      > >
                      > > Ken Burns' series is pop culture. It's purty pictures and purty
                      > > music and purty voices, and the barest whiff of Western Theater
                      > > (which I saw as a lack even in my untutored days.) I guess that's
                      > why
                      > > we have message boards like this, which sometimes remind me of a
                      nit
                      > > comb.
                      > >
                      > > Billie
                      > >
                      > >
                      > >
                      > >
                      > >
                      > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
                      > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                    • carlw4514
                      That Gettysburg civil war game is still available, the site http://www.secondchancegames.com/ probably has it and it is traded quite often on ebay. Bob, you
                      Message 10 of 14 , Sep 3, 2002
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                        That Gettysburg civil war game is still available, the site
                        http://www.secondchancegames.com/
                        probably has it and it is traded quite often on ebay.
                        Bob, you may know I have been trolling for interest in avalon hill
                        games -- especially to work on play by email variants to a particular
                        game which has the scope of the entire war; I have come up with around
                        a half dozen people who might be interested in this and would love to
                        hear from ANYONE WHO MIGHT BE INTERESTED via private email [
                        carlw4514@... , Is it nuts to give that out here?]I really think
                        a really large proportion of the people from this website could get
                        into this project.
                        see also:
                        http://www.militarygaming.com/
                        http://www.militarygaming.com/forum/general/default.asp
                        Carl
                        --- In civilwarwest@y..., "bobaldrich2001" <aldrichr@d...> wrote:
                        > Joe H.,
                        >
                        > I got interested at age 7 when my Dad took the family to Gettysburg
                        > in 1959. Before we left he got us setting up the battle on the
                        > living room floor, with hundreds of toy soldiers (of all eras!) and
                        > sofa cushions for little and big round top. Supposedly the family
                        > myth goes that by the time we got to Gettysburg we kids were ready to
                        > set the expert guides straight on several aspects of the battle, but
                        > personally I doubt it. Later we got the Gettysburg Avalon Hill war
                        > game (anybody remember that?) and played it endlessly. I also recall
                        > reading a Shelby Foote picture history book and making a scrapbook
                        > out of pictures from the Life magazine centennial issue(s) in the
                        > 1960s. And reading a kids' book on Confederate cavalrymen
                        > called "Swords Stars and Bars". But I didn't learn much about the
                        > Western theater until joining this forum 40 years later.
                        >
                        > I haven't seen the Burns series (hope to catch some of it this time
                        > around) but I question why a fascinating TV story couldn't be made
                        > out of the lead up to the war - the country was being torn apart at
                        > the seams, for crying out loud! Personally I think that if that
                        > part was given short shrift it would be mainly due to the notorious
                        > sensitivity of "causes" issues. But enough said about that!
                        >
                        > Bob A.
                        >
                        >
                      • Dan Cone
                        ... Count me in! Dan _________________________________________________________________ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos:
                        Message 11 of 14 , Sep 3, 2002
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                          >you may know I have been trolling for interest in avalon hill
                          >games -- especially to work on play by email variants to a particular
                          >game which has the scope of the entire war; I have come up with around
                          >a half dozen people who might be interested in this and would love to
                          >hear from ANYONE WHO MIGHT BE INTERESTED via private email [
                          >carlw4514@...

                          Count me in!

                          Dan

                          _________________________________________________________________
                          MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos:
                          http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx
                        • hartshje
                          Bob, Sounds like you ve got about 10 years on me (I was two in 59). I also had the A.H. games, and recreated the battles with 100 s of multi-era HO-25mm
                          Message 12 of 14 , Sep 3, 2002
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                            Bob,

                            Sounds like you've got about 10 years on me (I was two in '59). I
                            also had the A.H. games, and recreated the battles with 100's of
                            multi-era HO-25mm soldiers. But that was ok, it helped differentiate
                            divisions and corps, and created quite a colorful effect! Nothing
                            quite like a brigade of Mongolians trying to carry Little Round Top
                            defended by some WWI British infantry! :-) I still have quite a
                            collection, and these go for a pretty penny on e-Bay by the way.
                            Anyway, I remember reenacting Shiloh, Stones River, Chickamauga, and
                            Franklin as well as the big battles of the East. So there must have
                            been SOME info around in those days about the West, but nothing like
                            it is now. Did you have the book "Heros in Blue and Gray" by Robert
                            Alter (1965)? I recently picked up a copy off of e-Bay. And as I
                            have mentioned on CWW before, "Rifles for Waite" and "The Battle of
                            Gettysburg", American Heritage Junior Library (by B.Catton) were my
                            teething books.

                            Joe H.

                            --- In civilwarwest@y..., "bobaldrich2001" <aldrichr@d...> wrote:
                            > Joe H.,
                            >
                            > I got interested at age 7 when my Dad took the family to Gettysburg
                            > in 1959. Before we left he got us setting up the battle on the
                            > living room floor, with hundreds of toy soldiers (of all eras!) and
                            > sofa cushions for little and big round top. Supposedly the family
                            > myth goes that by the time we got to Gettysburg we kids were ready
                            > to set the expert guides straight on several aspects of the battle,
                            > but personally I doubt it. Later we got the Gettysburg Avalon Hill
                            > war game (anybody remember that?) and played it endlessly. I also
                            > recall reading a Shelby Foote picture history book and making a
                            > scrapbook out of pictures from the Life magazine centennial issues
                            > in the 1960s. And reading a kids' book on Confederate cavalrymen
                            > called "Swords Stars and Bars". But I didn't learn much about the
                            > Western theater until joining this forum 40 years later.
                            >
                            > I haven't seen the Burns series (hope to catch some of it this time
                            > around) but I question why a fascinating TV story couldn't be made
                            > out of the lead up to the war - the country was being torn apart at
                            > the seams, for crying out loud! Personally I think that if that
                            > part was given short shrift it would be mainly due to the notorious
                            > sensitivity of "causes" issues. But enough said about that!
                            >
                            > Bob A.
                            >
                          • josepharose
                            There is a Civil War On-Line (CWOL) game which may be of interest: http://www.distance-simulations.org/game_links.htm is a main links page for the game. It s
                            Message 13 of 14 , Sep 3, 2002
                            • 0 Attachment
                              There is a Civil War On-Line (CWOL) game which may be of interest:
                              http://www.distance-simulations.org/game_links.htm
                              is a main links page for the game.

                              It's very complex, with different modules for the military,
                              economic, political, and foreign affairs spheres.

                              Unfortunately, I found it to be neither satisfying as a simulation
                              nor as a wargame. There is no unit facing and the fatigue tables
                              are very strange. The rulebook could use some revision, as well.
                              Many, however, appear to like it.

                              The people involved, there are about 40 on each side, seem to be
                              very nice.

                              You may wish to give it a try.

                              Joseph


                              --- In civilwarwest@y..., "carlw4514" <carlw4514@y...> wrote:
                              > That Gettysburg civil war game is still available, the site
                              > http://www.secondchancegames.com/
                              > probably has it and it is traded quite often on ebay.
                              > Bob, you may know I have been trolling for interest in avalon hill
                              > games -- especially to work on play by email variants to a
                              particular
                              > game which has the scope of the entire war; I have come up with
                              around
                              > a half dozen people who might be interested in this and would love
                              to
                              > hear from ANYONE WHO MIGHT BE INTERESTED via private email [
                              > carlw4514@y... , Is it nuts to give that out here?]I really think
                              > a really large proportion of the people from this website could get
                              > into this project.
                              > see also:
                              > http://www.militarygaming.com/
                              > http://www.militarygaming.com/forum/general/default.asp
                              > Carl
                              > --- In civilwarwest@y..., "bobaldrich2001" <aldrichr@d...> wrote:
                              > > Joe H.,
                              > >
                              > > I got interested at age 7 when my Dad took the family to
                              Gettysburg
                              > > in 1959. Before we left he got us setting up the battle on the
                              > > living room floor, with hundreds of toy soldiers (of all eras!)
                              and
                              > > sofa cushions for little and big round top. Supposedly the
                              family
                              > > myth goes that by the time we got to Gettysburg we kids were
                              ready to
                              > > set the expert guides straight on several aspects of the battle,
                              but
                              > > personally I doubt it. Later we got the Gettysburg Avalon Hill
                              war
                              > > game (anybody remember that?) and played it endlessly. I also
                              recall
                              > > reading a Shelby Foote picture history book and making a
                              scrapbook
                              > > out of pictures from the Life magazine centennial issue(s) in
                              the
                              > > 1960s. And reading a kids' book on Confederate cavalrymen
                              > > called "Swords Stars and Bars". But I didn't learn much about
                              the
                              > > Western theater until joining this forum 40 years later.
                              > >
                              > > I haven't seen the Burns series (hope to catch some of it this
                              time
                              > > around) but I question why a fascinating TV story couldn't be
                              made
                              > > out of the lead up to the war - the country was being torn apart
                              at
                              > > the seams, for crying out loud! Personally I think that if
                              that
                              > > part was given short shrift it would be mainly due to the
                              notorious
                              > > sensitivity of "causes" issues. But enough said about that!
                              > >
                              > > Bob A.
                              > >
                              > >
                            • carlw4514
                              as an online game, this has some popularity, and may not be the only one of its kind. I was never sure I would like it, so your experience is telling. Perhaps
                              Message 14 of 14 , Sep 4, 2002
                              • 0 Attachment
                                as an online game, this has some popularity, and may not be the only
                                one of its kind. I was never sure I would like it, so your experience
                                is telling. Perhaps someone else will comment.
                                --- In civilwarwest@y..., "josepharose" <josepharose@y...> wrote:
                                > There is a Civil War On-Line (CWOL) game which may be of interest:
                                > http://www.distance-simulations.org/game_links.htm
                                > is a main links page for the game.
                                >
                                > It's very complex, with different modules for the military,
                                > economic, political, and foreign affairs spheres.
                                >
                                > Unfortunately, I found it to be neither satisfying as a simulation
                                > nor as a wargame. There is no unit facing and the fatigue tables
                                > are very strange. The rulebook could use some revision, as well.
                                > Many, however, appear to like it.
                                >
                                > The people involved, there are about 40 on each side, seem to be
                                > very nice.
                                >
                                > You may wish to give it a try.
                                >
                                > Joseph
                                >
                                >
                                > --- In civilwarwest@y..., "carlw4514" <carlw4514@y...> wrote:
                                > > That Gettysburg civil war game is still available, the site
                                > > http://www.secondchancegames.com/
                                > > probably has it and it is traded quite often on ebay.
                                > > Bob, you may know I have been trolling for interest in avalon hill
                                > > games -- especially to work on play by email variants to a
                                > particular
                                > > game which has the scope of the entire war; I have come up with
                                > around
                                > > a half dozen people who might be interested in this and would love
                                > to
                                > > hear from ANYONE WHO MIGHT BE INTERESTED via private email [
                                > > carlw4514@y... , Is it nuts to give that out here?]I really think
                                > > a really large proportion of the people from this website could
                                get
                                > > into this project.
                                > > see also:
                                > > http://www.militarygaming.com/
                                > > http://www.militarygaming.com/forum/general/default.asp
                                > > Carl
                                > > --- In civilwarwest@y..., "bobaldrich2001" <aldrichr@d...> wrote:
                                > > > Joe H.,
                                > > >
                                > > > I got interested at age 7 when my Dad took the family to
                                > Gettysburg
                                > > > in 1959. Before we left he got us setting up the battle on the
                                > > > living room floor, with hundreds of toy soldiers (of all eras!)
                                > and
                                > > > sofa cushions for little and big round top. Supposedly the
                                > family
                                > > > myth goes that by the time we got to Gettysburg we kids were
                                > ready to
                                > > > set the expert guides straight on several aspects of the battle,
                                > but
                                > > > personally I doubt it. Later we got the Gettysburg Avalon Hill
                                > war
                                > > > game (anybody remember that?) and played it endlessly. I also
                                > recall
                                > > > reading a Shelby Foote picture history book and making a
                                > scrapbook
                                > > > out of pictures from the Life magazine centennial issue(s) in
                                > the
                                > > > 1960s. And reading a kids' book on Confederate cavalrymen
                                > > > called "Swords Stars and Bars". But I didn't learn much about
                                > the
                                > > > Western theater until joining this forum 40 years later.
                                > > >
                                > > > I haven't seen the Burns series (hope to catch some of it this
                                > time
                                > > > around) but I question why a fascinating TV story couldn't be
                                > made
                                > > > out of the lead up to the war - the country was being torn apart
                                > at
                                > > > the seams, for crying out loud! Personally I think that if
                                > that
                                > > > part was given short shrift it would be mainly due to the
                                > notorious
                                > > > sensitivity of "causes" issues. But enough said about that!
                                > > >
                                > > > Bob A.
                                > > >
                                > > >
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