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Re: Jaka's Story 13-15

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  • LarryTheIllini
    ... I always thought she was embarrassed about forgetting to cover her bare bum. Sure dancing costumes are revealing and all, but that seemed to have crossed
    Message 1 of 5 , Jul 1, 2002
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      --- In cerebus@y..., "rainmandu2" <rainmandu@e...> wrote:
      > pp. 253-257 - We'd all be embarrassed if we threw up on
      > someone, but Jaka's acting like she killed Pud's dog or
      > something. The level of embarrassment she feels over this is
      > probably to do with her "society" upbringing. Respectable girls
      > from respectable families simply do NOT throw up on people.
      >

      I always thought she was embarrassed about forgetting to cover her
      bare bum. Sure dancing costumes are revealing and all, but that
      seemed to have crossed a line, and I thought that was the source of
      her embarrassment.

      > Dave pulls the rug out from under us on Pud, and brings a tear to
      > the eye. This whole sequence is some of Dave's best writing.
      > Like always, he's able to "manipulate" us as only the best
      > writers can: He earns it. He's not just pulling our strings and
      > making us dance.
      >

      The second time I had a genuine uncontrolable emotional reaction
      to "Cerebus" which is, unfortunately, not fully repeatable upon re-
      reads. The first was "Spike's a GOOD dog!" in Church and State.
      I don't mean that I don't regularly react emotionally to the book,
      but in these two instances, the strength of the reaction was
      surprising, and more than might be implied by the surface story alone.

      - Larry H
    • Danny Lindquist
      ... Good catch. The only thing I can think of is that the paint he went to get while Jaka died without Cerebus knowing what happened is echoed by the paint
      Message 2 of 5 , Jul 5, 2002
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        Just two brief comments:
        pp. 288-291 - Rick and Jaka argue, Cerebus makes up his mind
        to go after the white paint. I'm sure it doesn't mean anything, but
        when Cerebus was running around as Spore, the white paint he
        used wouldn't wash off and he had to wear a bag on his head to
        cover it up. Does anyone have any thoughts on the white paint,
        the Guffin, and the white paint on Cerebus' head in "Latter
        Days"?
        Good catch. The only thing I can think of is that the paint he went to get while Jaka "died" without Cerebus knowing what happened is "echoed" by the paint he uses as Spore: Cerebus (as errand boy, then as Spore) went against the natural unfolding of the story (Cerebus just sat around the house, thus he would probably have been captured (or would defeat) the Cirinists; Todd would continue to run the Ferry Tits) by doing a little something with some paint off-screen (going to buy some, then making the Spore suit) to allow for Cerebus to play a more central role in the story (presumably unconsciously or due to the actions of Dave; given Dave's manipulations of events in Mothers and Daughters, I'm inclined to say unconsciously in Jaka's Story and intentionally in Latter Days). The paint wouldn't come off of his face, so Cerebus was forced to complete the "long wooden rod, hard cylinder sticking out in front, bag being there as sort of an 'also ran'" trio of issue 277's titular phallic joke. Because of Spore, Cerebus became a "complete dick" and the butt of an entire issue's joke, as well as looking rather foolish while dictating the end of the "Booke of Cerebvs". The paint Cerebus bought for Rick ended up being the reason he was launched into an immediate rage (the "Cerebus curses your name forever, Tarim" sequnce shown in "Minds"), and a subsequent catatonic state of near-death (Melmoth), imparing his functioning in the story to an even greater extent than the "paint-chipping" isolation of Latter Days. Of course, it could just be a coincidence because of Spawn's coloring and Dave completing the dick joke of 277, and the paint having to be white so that it would show up on the guffin.
        pp 301, 302 - Rick and Jaka get it on. This is (I believe) the first
        time that Dave has included female nudity in the Cerebus comic.
        Yep, it is (I'm the type of person who pays scrupulous attention to such matters, so that I don't inadvertently reccommend explicit material to persons who would be opposed or unready for such materials; I am opposed to censorship, but I am in favor of making sure my little sister doesn't end up accidentally reading porn ;-)). If I'm not mistaken, the only male nudity in the comic is implied (the... thing in Guys that I originally thought was Cerebus's gasping mouth; the big... giant... THING on the tower in Mothers & Daughters; the sketch of a phallus on the skeleton of the Isshurian pain'neen in issue 278, and probably a few I've forgotten)... anyone aware of anything explicitly shown apart from breasts? Female genitalia is implied constantly as the comic progresses, but I think the closest that Dave comes to directly drawing them is the gratuitious panty "crotch shot" in Going Home (which I can't seem to locate. I distinctly recall seeing it and thinking "oh my... huh, maybe Dave is degenerating a little bit..."). And I feel like I'm writing too much on this topic, so I'll stop now ;-)

        Daniel

      • rainmandu2
        ... progresses, ... is the ... seem to ... maybe ... Women, pp. 154, 155. The Roach imagines himself a tiny little Roach in a regular-size vagina. Or a
        Message 3 of 5 , Jul 5, 2002
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          --- In cerebus@y..., Danny Lindquist <plindqui@a...> wrote:

          ... anyone aware of anything explicitly shown apart from
          > breasts? Female genitalia is implied constantly as the comic
          progresses,
          > but I think the closest that Dave comes to directly drawing them
          is the
          > gratuitious panty "crotch shot" in Going Home (which I can't
          seem to
          > locate. I distinctly recall seeing it and thinking "oh my... huh,
          maybe
          > Dave is degenerating a little bit..."). And I feel like I'm writing too
          > much on this topic, so I'll stop now ;-)
          >
          > Daniel

          "Women," pp. 154, 155. The Roach imagines himself a tiny little
          Roach in a regular-size vagina. Or a regular-size Roach in a
          giant-size vagina. Either way, been there, done that.
          The "gratuitous" Jaka crotch-shot is in "Going Home" (p. 180). It's
          not exactly an attractive representation of Jaka's crotch. In fact,
          Dave seems to be going out of his way to make it as unattractive
          as possible.

          Rainmandu
        • ctowner1@aol.com
          In a message dated 02-06-30 22:01:25 EDT, you write:
          Message 4 of 5 , Jul 12, 2002
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            In a message dated 02-06-30 22:01:25 EDT, you write:

            <<
            p. 298 - Oscar's own prejudices about Jaka's "art" are getting in
            the way of his being able to describe it.

            Rainmandu>>

            I think it was more a matter of his never having actually seen it. Once he
            does, it is all clear to him.

            e
            L nny
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