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Re: [cerebus] Re: OT: Matrix Rev

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  • ctowner1@aol.com
    ... Well, call me naive - but while I m sure they wanted my money, I THINK they WERE trying to tell a story - but - given that I cannot decipher the movie into
    Message 1 of 3 , Mar 1, 2004
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      In a message dated 2/29/2004 8:53:32 PM Eastern Standard Time, "leobrezzi" <leobrezzi@...> writes:

      >--- In cerebus@yahoogroups.com, ctowner1@a... wrote:
      >> In a message dated 2/29/2004 7:39:16 PM Eastern Standard Time,
      >> elsewoodsbook@j... writes:
      >> I was actually stupid enough to go see Matrix Revolutions in the theater
      >> and, let me tell you, it took every ounce of willpower I had not to walk
      >> out and demand a refund.  Awfu awful movie.  Thomas Edison is, I'm
      >> sure, rolling in his grave.
      >> Agreed. Is there ANYONE out there who can explain what happened at
      >the end?
      >> I've yet to meet a single person who can!
      >>
      >>   e
      >> L nny
      >
      >
      >As a great brazilian reviewer said: "They just admited that it was all
      >about our money... a great foolish story filled with some cheap
      >phylosophy... an insult to the inteligence of sci-fi fans..."
      >
      >"There are things that change... and things that don't change..."...
      >
      >They were warning us since the second movie... >>

      Well, call me naive - but while I'm sure they wanted my money, I THINK they WERE trying to tell a story - but - given that I cannot decipher the movie into that story, they failed quite a bit. But I'll bet it made sense to them. I'm just wondering how it can all be explained. And one possible, perhaps probably, answer is that we're missing key story elements that were inadvertantly (or advertantly) cut out in the editing process. So then the game shifts to: can you exptrapolate the story from what IS on the screen?

      e
      L nny
    • ctowner1@aol.com
      ... Actually..now you ve reminded me of a bit - I think you re on the right track. Definitely the Oracle s manipulations were involved. It s clear from the
      Message 2 of 3 , Mar 2, 2004
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        In a message dated 3/1/2004 9:23:00 PM Eastern Standard Time, Christopher Shumway <shumway@...> writes:

        >On Mon, 1 Mar 2004, L nny wrote:
        >
        >> > --- In cerebus@yahoogroups.com, "L nny" <ctowner1@a...> wrote:
        >> > >
        >> > > How? Was there ANY indication how he was able to succeed? Did it
        >> > > follow from anything we saw before that moment in the film? He
        >> > > allows himself to be absorbed, and Smith is defeated.  If that's
        >> > all
        >> > > he had to do, why didn't he do that the first time he saw Smith
        >> > > after he made the deal with the machines - why bother fighting?
        >>
        >> I thought there was some clue in what Neo said to Smith before he
        >> was absorbed - but I forget what it was.
        >
        >"Everything that has a beginning has an end, NEO." (My emphasis) is what
        >Smith said to Neo.  Since Smith usually insists on calling him Mr.
        >Anderson, my interpretation was that it was the Oracle speaking through
        >Smith.  Perhaps he didn't assimilate her too well.  shrug.  I was put
        >off by his "I have seen this...I'm supposed to stand...here...and say
        >something", it seemed like the whole scene was cobbled together at the
        >last minute.
        >
        >I guess you could interpret the "Why do you continue to fight?" "Because I
        >choose to" to mean that Neo finally realizes that free will trumps
        >whatever Smith has got, and the Truth sets him free, or something.
        >
        >I'm going to stop because I suspect I'm putting as much thought into this
        >as the Wachowskis did, for significantly less reward.
        >
        >--
        >Chris, disappointed>>

        Actually..now you've reminded me of a bit - I think you're on the right track. Definitely the Oracle's manipulations were involved. It's clear from the way the scene went down, the Oracle WANTED to be absorbed by Smith - you had the line of dialogue where Smith asks her: "If you can see the future, why didn't you get out of here before we found you?" and she doesn't answer. And you have the last scene where the Architect tells her she played her game well. But that begs the question of how being absorbed into the Smiths gave Neo the opening to win the day? Is Neo's free will linked to overriding Smith's programming? And what does that have to do with the Oracle? It's easy to dismiss it all as "gobbley gook" - but I find it more fun to try to figure it out. It seems like we're just missing a piece or two to do so!

        e
        L nny
      • Karl Hiller
        ctowner1@aol.com wrote: Actually..now you ve reminded me of a bit - I think you re on the right track. Definitely the Oracle s manipulations were involved.
        Message 3 of 3 , Mar 3, 2004
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          ctowner1@... wrote:
          Actually..now you've reminded me of a bit - I think you're on the right track.  Definitely the Oracle's manipulations were involved.  It's clear from the way the scene went down, the Oracle WANTED to be absorbed by Smith - you had the line of dialogue where Smith asks her: "If you can see the future, why didn't you get out of here before we found you?" and she doesn't answer.  And you have the last scene where the Architect tells her she played her game well.  But that begs the question of how being absorbed into the Smiths gave Neo the opening to win the day? Is Neo's free will linked to overriding Smith's programming? And what does that have to do with the Oracle?  It's easy to dismiss it all as "gobbley gook" - but I find it more fun to try to figure it out.  It seems like we're just missing a piece or two to do so!
          I bet it has something to do with Sir Gerrick!
           
          Karl
          300-less  :(
           


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